Jodi Arias Trial – Day 27

448 Comments

1. I missed the very end yesterday. Does the redirect continue today or did Nurmi finish?

   • He continues today.

     • I have a strong feeling she was in a cult and had no idea… her actions and reactions dont sit right with me. She acts like a brainwashed victim. I googled cults in az… weird how it went right to mesa…

   • The prosecution in this case is over zellous. Just because Jodis Grandparents had a 25 cab gun stolen, doesnt prove pre meditation. They will never tie her to that gun. Yes Jodi is a liar, but so was Casey Anthony. Lying doesnt prove 1st or 2nd degree murder. I predict this jury will not convict her of anything except making false staements to the police.

2. Does anyone feel like Nurmi is just trying to keep her off death row? I don’t feel like they have proved self defense.

   • We still have the expert testimony to get through to help with the self defense. But they definitely want to keep Jodi off death row and IMO they have acomplished that already.

   • They don’t have to prove it. All they have to do is create reasonable doubt. The burden is on the prosecutor to prove the crime was premeditated. I have a comment awaiting moderation about the Barbara Sheehan case (I think because I included two links in my comment). But Google that one and you will see some similarities.

     • Why doesn’t Jodi lead the Defense team to Travis’ gun for sure proof of her self-defense story ?

       • Because it is exactly as your name states: Lost. She claims to have chucked it in the desert. Add over 5 years to that, it’s either buried, taken, or overgrown.

       • I doubt she remembers where it is.

         Also, you cant bet that all the Jodi haters have been out looking for it already. They will be more than happy to find it in order to try and prove that it was her grandpa’s gun.

         • But if it was not her grandpa’s gun, why wouldn’t she have given the location of the gun to Detective Flores a long time ago ?

           • Perhaps she doesn’t have a clue. She was in shock and in a fog when she left his house that evening. She said she “came to” somewhere in the desert. And she did get lost. Looking for a gun in the desert would be much like looking for a needle in a haystack.

           • How would showing them the gun help her at all anyways? It’s obvious that there is no record of Travis buying one either, so it wouldn’t help her at all either way.

       • a point, yeah. u got from mz. disgrace caller!
         IF jodi was lying, etc. ALL she had to say was ” i can’t remember what happened to the gun.”

       • the Dingo ate the gun!

       • Conversely, why doesn’t the prosecution/law enforcement go find the gun and then prove it was her grandparents’? Seems like they would have a slightly better case for premeditation if they did that, right? Or, did they already search the desert for the gun and not find it?

         Yours was a question raised on Nancy Disgrace last night. It’s interesting that no one raised mine in response.

         • It is impossible to find the gun at this point – she says she doesn’t remember where in the desert she threw it, and “the desert” between Arizona and Utah is a really, really, really big place. Also, remember that she killed him five years ago. Deserts go through a lot of changes in that length of time. Even if she remembered exactly where in the desert she threw it, they would simply not be able to find it. It’s actually a perfect place to dispose of a weapon, if you’re trying to.

           Also… it took her a very long time to admit she killed him. It isn’t like she admitted it a week later and remembered where she threw the gun and they could just go grab it. She denied having anything to do with it for a long time.

           What I can’t figure out is why she initially told Det. Flores that Travis didn’t own a gun, if she says it was his gun that she shot him with. Clearly, if he was shot (and by the time she put his body back in the shower, she’d have known that he had a gunshot wound in his face), there was a gun on the premises at the time of the killing. If she used his gun, and not her grandfather’s gun, it wouldn’t matter if she told Flores the truth about him owning one or not, right? So I don’t understand the reason for the lie. She was obviously concocting all of these lies she told everyone so that they wouldn’t know she killed him. The gun thing doesn’t fit into that. Why lie, if Travis owned a gun?

           • I think because like she said everything before was BS. She was ashamed and scared an did not want to tell the truth an have to bring out all these details about her an Travis an the whole strange relationship on again off again. An she knew all his friends were against her nobody liked her. I am sure Travis told her that his friends said she is strange leave her alone Travis. My feeling is those women were jealous of Jodi an some of them were getting extra attention before Jodi showed up.

             This guy was so strange like in one story he did not like her hugging on him or kissing him around his friends? when your new in a relationship that is what most new couples do. One friend of Travis’s stated he kept swatting her off like a fly ! I would be so embarrassed to be anywhere with him around his so called MORMON friends that I would not feel comfortable either no wonder she acted strange like they said. You would be able to feel that discontent around them so they were a secret it seemed like for a long time when they were on again an off again. An then Travis telling all these stories about her only made their discontent even more..

             But anyway I see the whole stories before hand just BS an on the stand she is telling the truth because she finally gave in. No Plea she tried to not go here.

             • I don’t think he thought of her as a serious girlfriend. I think she’s absolutely right that he used her for sex, and maybe he liked hanging out with her, but I didn’t get the impression from the recorded phone call that his interest in her was any broader than that. I think she demonstrated a willingness to give him something that he was curious about and wanted – specifically, to explore different kinds of sex before he settled down and found a girl he could be serious about. I don’t think he was very nice to her.

               I’m not TOTALLY convinced he actually physically abused her; I am a survivor of abuse myself, and the physical things she’s describing are maybe a little rougher than I would find acceptable, but the incidents she describes seem pretty mild, and kind of few and far between to be deemed “abuse.” In my mind, the term “abuse” describes a consistent pattern of behavior, and according to her own testimony, his mean behavior was kind of inconsistent.

               The question is, was he just a guy who didn’t take her seriously (and was therefore mean to her at times because he didn’t really care about her), or was he actually an abusive monster?

               • Really? Any abuse is abuse in my mind and the mental abuse that goes along with it can be even worse. As far as inconsistency, I’m pretty sure that the major abusive incidents she described all happened with progression in the 4-6 months prior to his death, so that is a pattern of abuse, and increasing violence over a period of time. Being choked is mild?
                 Lots of us have also been in those types of situations, but I don’t recall in my situation EVER contemplating if it was mild or not, or comparing it to other abused people to see who’s worse or what have you. Isn’t that the same as saying sexual abuse can be “not as bad” for some kids as others, depending on what exactly was done? Abuse is abuse. The effects are the same, and it’s the invisible stuff that messes up your mind.

               • I am curious; Jodi did TA make a suggestion that you dye your hair blonde? Has this ever come up? Just what other kinds of changes did he hint at, other than his sexual curiosities? How did he bring forth suggestions of this manner? Being a survivor of mental, verbal abuse these thins are key to personal preference and they do lead to places that are not wanted as a personal preference but, when you think you are in love. You will do things that HURT you internally as well as physically and mentally. All of that hurt builds but, you learn to keep quiet and bear it within. I know if I had not gotten away eventually my reaction may have been much the same.

                 Elizabeth

               • Oh boy, Dena, this is somewhat of a class distinction in some of the domestic abuse communities I’ve been in. For example, I don’t have corroborating evidence of the abuse my ex-husband inflicted upon me. I don’t have medical reports (he almost always insisted on “treating” me himself, even taking me from a hospital and insisting I sign out against medical advice), and I only ever called the police non-emergency hypothetically, since his best friend (so he told me) was a sergeant and later a commander and “good luck”.

                 There are also people who seem to differentiate between levels of abuse. I was NEVER battered in my face, NEVER. I had one black eye once, which was because he pushed me into a light switch, but it was coincidental. Some victims/survivors ask for photos and when you don’t have photos of injuries, you are looked down upon as not having been abused “enough”. I have a photo of his fist imprint on my stomach. Is that enough? It doesn’t show my face, so it literally could be anyone’s stomach, I’ve been told. A friend took that photo while I insisted that she didn’t. And I have a video of the night he tried to kill me, but he didn’t hit me that night. So, is that enough? In some communities, it’s not enough.

                 When he pushed me down the stairs by coming up behind me pushing his knees into my back, he said I was clumsy. Was I? When he opened cupboards and literally “rained” dozens of cans upon my body because I hadn’t turned the labels correctly, I thought I had done a poor job putting them away. Did I? When I bent down to lower cabinets in the kitchen and arose to hit my head in a cabinet door that I swear wasn’t open before, and ended up with a gash in my forehead, was it just me being clumsy and forgetful as he told me? Was the knife he often threatened me with but didn’t actually cut me, or only made small gashes, not enough? Were the burns on my wrists when he held my arms to flames not enough?

                 Was the fact that in the beginning, when he first began what I now call “abuse”, it consisted of him throwing things at my head, but they didn’t hit me, not enough? Was the fact that he would then be “Nice” (the honeymoon period) for sometimes months on end, not “enough”?

                 We didn’t have children. I married him believing we would. After several years of not conceiving and being told it was my fault, he finally told me he had a vasectomy years earlier. By then, it was too late for me to have children safely, I was too old. Since we didn’t have a terrible custody battle during our divorce, but DID have an atrocity of a divorce, where I ended up with my pleadings being stricken because I REFUSED to give him my new address in another state, and the judge ordered me to, but I still wouldn’t, because I knew it would cost me my life .. was that still not ENOUGH? I don’t have a terrible custody deal, so is that not ENOUGH? I was barred from participating in my own divorce because I didn’t want to die at his hands. In fact, as I often said, if it came to that, I would take my OWN life rather than give him the satisfaction. Was that not ENOUGH? He took everything, in a default divorce (now on appeal), but is that still not ENOUGH?

                 For the record, my ex-husband NEVER choked me, but he did poison me for years with arsenic which made me very ill. Yet, he was arrested for aggravated assault with a deadly weapon when he tried to kill me with a wine bottle, wearing a surgical glove. Choking is one of the most lethal signs that the abuse is progressing to a point from which there is no return. But he didn’t choke me. He chased me into a closet and told me he was going to kill me and I crawled into the fetal position, begging him to let me live. But I guess that still wasn’t ENOUGH, was it?

                 What’s “enough”? What DOES it take to believe a woman who says she has been abused?

                 Do we really have class distinction among abuse victims? Do we really need medical reports, police reports, photos of injuries, corroboration that we were abused? If we do, we might as well all just give up and die. Abusers are way too smart for that.

           • You mean to say that she did not get an attorney for 5 years?

           • I think she specifically told the detective that TA did not have gun, because telling him that TA did have a gun would bring attention to the possibility that she knew where to find a gun and shoot him if she was there. It’s just a claim of not knowing, in an attempt for them to look at someone other than herself.

     • Exactly, well said.

   • In my opinion they have established Travis’ violent nature. The taped phone conversation clearly shows his fantasies of rape, and his perception that he has “raped” Jodi. We all know that Rape is an act of violence. I think this makes Jodi’s assertion that he attacked her much more credible. Her defense is “self defense” and it is entirely possible that the jury will believe he had the propensity for violence and attacked her,and she defended her life.

     • I’m totally not defending the rape fantasy thing, because I find it perverse. But a LOT of men have rape fantasies who would never harm a fly in real life. She even said herself that she doesn’t think he meant “rape” in the legal sense of the word, just that he had fantasies of control and dominance.

       I think there’s too much focus on the sex in this trial. She has testified that her sexual interludes with this guy were “always” (HER word, not mine) consensual. So nothing they did in the sack should influence how anyone feels about either of them. In order to be proven, allegations of persistent physical abuse should be backed up with medical records, witness accounts, character witnesses… things like that.

       And I realize she has no burden to “prove” anything; however, what reason do we have to just accept her word? She’s lied in the past. I would feel much more comfortable believing her if she had an X-ray, or photos with bruises… a mention in a doctor’s report of an injury… anything.

       • Okay, I asked my fiance if he’d EVER had a rape fantasy, and I begged him to be honest. He said he thought it was disgusting, and he even cussed in disgust. I asked if his guy friends had ever told him they had one (since they are quite open with one another). He said absolutely NOT. He wouldn’t even hang out with someone who had one. But A LOT of guys have them? Hmm, my ex-husband did. Maybe a LOT of abusive guys have them. But nice guys? Sorry, I don’t think so. I’m no spring chicken. I’m no virgin either.

         X-rays, photos, doctor reports … yeah. Most of us who were abused don’t have them. Witness accounts? Good luck. Most abusers only abuse when they have you behind closed doors. They are saints in public. Character witnesses? Same thing. Everyone thinks they’re perfect. As my mother said “street angels, house devils”. I can’t say it better. Lies? Do you have any idea how many lies I told to protect him? Do you have any idea how many lies I told not to expose who he was? Do you know how many lies the average victim tells? If you’re an abuse victim, have you ever hung out with other victims? We all tell the same story. In fact, we often say, damn, he sounds JUST like my ex — even if we’re talking to someone in another country!

         • Also Abused: I really appreciate your posts. I don’t have the guts or energy to go into detail about abuse i order to help people understand this stuff, but you really take the time and mental effort to explain it, so thank you! And, I agree…..”Most men have rape fantasies?” Totally ridiculous, and I should hope the heck NOT. That’s no where near normal. Besides, fantasies stay in your head, TA was acting on them- big difference, and sure sounds like a progressive pattern to me. Anyway, thank you for your insightful posts.

   • They don’t have to prove anything at all. They didn’t even have to put on a defense here. The prosecutor has totally failed to prove murder one. Remember this: the case is not proving guilt–it is proving the degree of guilt and what the punishment should be for that guilt.

     • Well that’s not 100% true. Jodi has admitted to killing TA. There is nothing left to prove there. If someone claims self-defense, then that is an affirmative defense. They do indeed have to prove that it was self-defense and deadly force was the only option. To that end, the Defense has not proven it was self-defense in my opinion. JM has to prove pre-meditation. It is true that the defense does not have to prove that it was not pre-meditation, but they do have to prove self-defense.

       • Exactly. Thank you, Tessa. I’ve been trying to make this point for a while. Jodi does have SOME burden in this case. Not the ultimate one, but a little.

       • The forensic evidence does not support Jodi’s testimony. I think that might be the biggest problem here for her. And how will the jury wade through all of that?

         There has been a lot of talk about Travis and Jodi and their respective sex fantasies the last couple of days. Sex fantasies do not prove how violent someone might be. Everyone has to remember that.

         We are talking about someone’s life so I think the jury will be very careful on how they rule.

         I still think there is not enough evidence to say murder # 1.

         • Years of research shows that Rape has nothing to do with sex, it has everything to do with violence. Travis admitting this is very relavant to his propensity toward violence.

           • Agreed, and the sex is also very relevant to this case because when the expert gets on the stand to explain how a battered women thinks, and what her state of mind is, I guarantee you it will cover the topic of why she would engage in acts of sex that she did not find personally pleasing. The reason for all the sex talk will become clear.

   • RR
     Yes he is, this is a very difficult case I still believe that Jodi defends Travis and makes Nurmi’s Job harder.that was the impression i had yesterday. She still is controlled by Travis & the Cult.
     http://www.mormonconspiracy.com/mind-control.html
     I am not in any way accusing all Mormons of this but from the People that appear nightly on Dr.Drew NG etc. I see a strong Cult like behavior in them.

     • I agree with you Oliviero they all give me the impression of they are a higher being than others. An I am not saying all MORMONS either but you can’t tell me some are not different it is like that in every religion some just hold them selves up as more GODLY than others. An usually when you get to know them it is a false front.

       • I agree. I am Mormon and I see it within the church and from others of different faiths as well. People try and hold themselves above others. But I 100% disagree with Oliviero that Mormons are part of a cult and that people are somehow controlled by it. That is false. I do believe that Travis had some type of control ver Jodi, though.

         • Not all people who practice the Mormon faith but The Group Travis belonged to is very cult like you can see it when they testify appear on trashy shows etc. Too many of them in HIS group!

       • Rhonda you are right, I always call it the I am better then you group, but the difference between Cults and Authentic Religion is that They are NOT Inclusive, they are exclusive secretive and act like they are better then others, don’t marry outside the group, But usually the more perfect someone acts on the outside the more screwed up they are on the inside, The Cult Factor is very big in this case in my belief.

   • They are just trying to keep her off of death row, Jodi agreed to first degree murder and life BUT the state wanted death. Very sad….. it really is a huge gamble the state is taking but from what I truly think is Jodi is NOT getting a fair trial…… she is so abused….she does need help not death.

     • This is not true, Jodi did not agree to first degree, at this point if the jury believes self-defense she could be acquitted. She did offer to plea to 2nd degree and the prosecution turned that down.

     • Jodi never, ever, ever agreed to 1st degree murder……where is that information coming from?
       I also wanted to mention something else that was posted above about Jodi saying that she “didn’t feel” that TA “really” meant rape in the legal sense, or that she herself considers their sex “consensual”, even though she was sleeping through some of it. Just because she says she believes to this day that he did NOT have these sick intentions, does not make it so. She is very clearly someone who has not come to grips with what he has actually done to her during that time. Putting your abuser on a pedestal is nothing new. It is so blatantly obvious that she is still in denial about the kind of person he was and she wants to believe the best about him still! That does not mean that she is right in assuming his intentions were noble. When someone can say that they consented to sex in their sleep, I am going to assume that her opinion about Mr. Wonderful is a little off, and I am sure some of the jury is thinking the same. My opinion of her is that she is naive, and was very much so when it came to TA.
       The abuser in this case was above her stature when she met him. He was a very charming public speaker, who was highly influential (evidenced by the fact that he could talk people into buying legal services before they ever need it and convince the world of his virginity and pureness), and he was a church member with some level of ranking. He was her “teacher”spiritually, and her “leader” in business, and if you put this all together, what you get is nothing less than an abuse of power from where I stand.
       I do not believe that most men have fantasies about rape, 12 year old girls, etc., that is disturbing and I highly doubt this to be true, But fantasies are one thing. Most people who have an odd fantasy, are able to keep it in their head where it belongs. TA did not seem to know the difference, and that is dangerous. He was beginning to act on his fantasies. Where would he have been at the age of 40 with all of it, do you suppose?

       It frustrates me to hear all of the downplaying of his actions. Not his thoughts, his actions, and that is what they were. They’re no longer fantasies when you start acting on them.
       As we heard from her own journal today, it was Jody who did not want to marry TA, and it was TA who called her the lottery win of wives. After today, I have to say, I am more convinced of her non guilt than I have been to date, and I am even more convinced that TA was something far different than what he had others seeing. That is the only premeditation I see proof of in this case…..TA’s full intention to deceive and control people.

       • Well said and so on target!!! As I posted earlier, rape and therefore rape fantasies are not about sex they are about violence. Years of research bears this out. Travis admits to both the fantasy and the actual act.

3. With reference to the Law of Attraction a line from one of my favorite songs
   ” You plant ice you’re gonna harvest wind”

   • Reminds me of the Christina Perri song Jar of Hearts: “You’re gonna catch a cold from the ice inside your soul.”

     • Mine’s a little older. From the lips of the the one and only Mr Jerry Garcia, who also said

       “Ain’t no time to hate,
       Barely time to wait”

4. I knew that JM’s strategy reminded me of something and I looked it up to see if I was right, and here it is: the Barbara Sheehan case. She was the abused wife of a retired cop who shot him one day while he was shaving, 11 times, and claimed self defense:

   “With the end of Barbara’s direct testimony, you could see her gird herself for the assault that would inevitably come with cross examination by assistant D.A. Pomodore. For the next two days Barbara endured every form of duplicity and innuendo as the ADA attempted to undermine her testimony.

   At one point Pomodore ordered Barbara to pick up the .38 revolver used in the shooting and hold it as she had as she’d walked down the hallway that morning; then again to hold it and show the jury what position she was in when she shot her husband. Barbara was hysterical, begging the judge not to force her to hold the hated gun, finally saying, “I feel like I’m going to be physically sick.” “Did you feel physically sick on the morning you used this gun to shoot and kill your husband?” Pomodore retorted.

   With that Barbara broke down.”

   http://purpleberets.org/barbarasheehan_trial.html

   Interesting how he modeled his cross on that! A couple of interesting points from that trial:

   1. The jury acquitted Ms. Sheehan, but they couldn’t let her walk completely, so they gave her a lesser charge regarding the firearm possession.

   2. The limits on the testimony of the domestic violence expert. There is a Maryland lethality assessment questionnaire that I’ve answered many times (and many other domestic violence victims have also). In Ms. Sheehan’s case, “of the twenty or so indicators of lethality in a battering relationship, nearly all were present in Barbara’s situation in the year preceding the shooting. The escalating violence, threats to kill, presence of guns, his talk of suicide, his use of choking and complete control of her daily acts all confirmed the likelihood of what Barbara herself knew to be true – that her time was running out.”

   Compare that to Jodi’s case: escalating violence (from breaking a finger to choking), threats to kill, presence of guns, choking, control of daily acts. The only one missing is TA talking of suicide. But perhaps that WAS present. Perhaps he told Jodi he would commit suicide if she reported the masturbatory incident? Even without it, there was a high indication of lethality. Another indicator many victims of domestic violence have seen (not on the lethality assessment) is the smear campaign. My ex told different neighbors I was mentally ill, for example. TA claimed Jodi was stalking him, slashing his tires, etc.

   Ms. Sheehan’s charge was far more reasonable: second degree murder – which Jodi was willing to plea to. I read elsewhere that the jury was hung until a day before they reached the verdict. http://www.nytimes.com/2011/10/07/nyregion/barbara-sheehan-who-killed-husband-is-found-not-guilty-of-murder.html?pagewanted=all “The trial offered two narratives so diametrically opposed that jurors said it had often been difficult to decipher who the real Barbara Sheehan was. … She said that the jury had decided, however, to find Ms. Sheehan guilty of possessing the second weapon, since she had shot her husband even after he no longer posed a danger. The verdict, she indicated, was something of a compromise.”

   Many here have wondered if the masturbatory act will confuse the jury. In that case, “the jury doubted the attempt to show that Mr. Sheehan’s bizarre sexual behavior, which included forcing his wife to watch while he masturbated dressed in an adult diaper, had been a motive for a murderous rage.”

   Will the jury feel similarly in Jodi’s case? What will the domestic violence expert be allowed to testify about? That may really tie things together for the jury. This week will be crucial!

   • The down side here is the difference in time spent together. This couple were married for 24 years, she likely endured years of abuse. Jodi and Travis were only dating, only a “couple” for 4-5 months. Some jurors will think it was something she should have just walked away from.

     • That’s always the problem, Dog, regardless of the length of the relationship. If I had a dollar for everyone who said to me (after my 10 year marriage) “Why didn’t you just walk out the door and never come back?” Far too many people think abuse is the victim’s fault. There’s something wrong with us that we didn’t just walk away. Hopefully, the domestic violence expert can explain this to the jury: why we don’t just leave; why Jodi didn’t.

       • You have to take in to consideration that a) they only dated a very short period of time b) in that short period of time there were significant problems c) they lived miles apart from each other. They weren’t living together, they weren’t married, they did not have children, there really was nothing to prevent her from walking. I get what you’re saying, I’m just pointing out that its a really big deal and some jurors may not believe she couldn’t have just walked away from it. Like Frank said (below) it is something defense is going to have to address.

         • Dog, I was in an abusive relationship that I can now look back at and wonder why did I not get out sooner. It has been years, and I still don’t have the answer. I wasn’t married, didn’t have children, had my own home. etc. Abuse does a number. Abusers are calculating. It starts out slowly and progresses to a God awful place that the abused doesn’t even realize the magnitude until they are long out of the situation…and even then not have the insight as to why they stayed. When your in the situation, you think you don’t believe the things you are called, etc., only to realize long after you have left the abuse that you were emotionally beat down and forever changed.

           Don’t believe for a moment that there are not jurors who, at the very least, aren’t close to somebody that stayed in an abusive relationship that made no sense.

         • No Dog that’s not true.

           My first relationship (abusive occured when i was 17). we were together since 15 – 19 though but when we had sex and he started using meth ( I was an honor student – good girl bad boy syndrome) he was such an S.O.B!!!! He was worldly compared to me. Got into porn, strip clubs etc. He would break up with in such a cruel way, saying I reminded him of his mother who is a “dirty biker whore” – I was an honor student, college grad etc. He just hated women! The sex was awesome, addicting. And he was smart enough to using violence to scare me by hitting walls and grabbing me. I was just a kid. I never felt used until I found out he was sleeping with everyone!!! then Id be in trouble for seeing someone else while he was out slumming. He disconnected the coil wire in my car so I couldn’t leave etc. And when I did go out with someone, he’d berate me for days and deny he did anything wrong – even with proof!!!! I’d end up begging him. (THANK GOD I GOT HELP BECAUSE EACH RELATIONSHIP GOT WORSE AFTER. I’m not yelling at you.) I think that happened with Jodi too. She just got sucked in relationship after relationship. Same patterns different guy.

           He calls my parents 25 years later asking my dad if he can bottle his sperm ( loser), he emails me calling me a whore from when I finally left him in college! He spoofs his email, and if you ask my mom, this first relationship is what set me up to be abused in the next relationship. This guy was a nut but everyone liked him.

           • Thank you so much for sharing, ladies. I’m so sorry you had to go through those awful relationships. I’m so glad you both got out of them.

             Like you both, I look back now and wonder what was wrong with me to marry him in the first place. We were together for 3 years before we got married but we had problems (caused by him) and even went to couples’ counseling. That was NOT a good way to start a marriage. Hindsight is 20/20 so I can see that now. Back then, I don’t know what I was thinking. He said we must be “meant to be” and that he was always drawn back to me. He said we couldn’t waste all the time we’d put into our relationship. He would say we should break up, but then tell me he was addicted to my smile or some other crap. This would always happen when things were going well with us. He even moved out once but called me repeatedly all weekend (without me answering) and into the following week, until I agreed to go see a counselor with him and just try. I think back now and want to kick myself. If I’d only gotten away THEN instead of having a 10 year marriage and ending up losing everything I’d worked all my life to accomplish.

             No one really understands these relationships unless you’ve been in one. My hope is at least one juror, their mother, aunt, sister, or friend has been in one.

         • Dog, they were actually together for almost 2 years. Sure, they “officially” dated for only 5 months, but their relationship started in September 2006 and didn’t end until he died in June 2008. Back in my day, we didn’t define the “friends with benefits” thing that younger people call it now. We still called it dating. Gust said they were dating but weren’t “exclusive” back in those days. I think the older jurors will see it that way too and there does seem to be several older jurors if the descriptions we’ve heard are correct thus far.

           Now, is 2 years long enough? No, it’s not a 24 year marriage. But I think it’s just a little less time than Selina Brown and Javon Foster dated. She was the woman shot getting on the bus in DC. I believe it’s LESS time than Jovan Belcher and Kasandra Perkins were together, however. He’s the football player who shot his girlfriend. They had only been together during much of 2012 in an on again/off again relationship. Of course, both of these women had children with their abusers. But the media covered the abuse, quite extensively. It seems unlikely the jurors will not have heard about one or both of these cases.

           Then again, one could argue they had children in common, whereas Jodi did not. And that’s always an issue. I had no children and I’m constantly told that I’m in a small minority of women who are domestic violence victims who did not have children with their abuser, especially since we were married.

           Yes, the defense will need to address this. And I believe their domestic violence expert (or experts) will do so. Hopefully, that expert will be able to successfully explain why victims are drawn back to these relationships.

           However, I still think the Barbara Sheehan case shows us where JM got his tactics from. The whole ““Did you feel physically sick on the morning you used this gun to shoot and kill your husband?” was stolen, almost verbatim by JM in his “Were you crying when …” lines to Jodi last week.

       • Believe it or not, what I recall in my situation years ago, was the overwhelming feeling that it would be “easier” to stay. Easier on the mind, easier not to face it, easier to be in denial I guess. Might not sound logical, but when you’re in that situation with nothing but walking on egg shells everyday and having your decisions made for you, it becomes hard to know how to make your own.

     • PEOPLE NOT INVOLVED in something like that OR in a “situation” that arises suddenly say “shoulda walked away”. easier said than done. but it IS something for defense to address.

       re: the ‘fight’ in general… a person’s 1st instinct is to DEFEND. keep the other at bay, gauge where they are and what they may do, etc. deep ‘animal’ INSTINCT. in our DNA from cavemen… imo.
       things can happen SO FAST.

       at his point, EVERYONE judging, etc.has the luxury of ‘time to think’. i don’t think jodi had that.
       IF she had time to think, she wouldn’t have done that, IMO. maybe I’m a rube, but…

       • Right, Frank, exactly. Fight or flight. I don’t know how I got through the night my ex tried to kill me. I don’t know how I was calm and spoke to the police. But it was that survival instinct that kicked in.

         Also, the other night, I had an incident where I blew a fuse and went into a panic attack. Why? Because that happened twice with my ex and he went ballistic on me. He had the circuit breaker locked up so that I couldn’t “mess things up even worse.” Old reactions die hard! I couldn’t stop shaking. The circuit breaker in my apartment didn’t fix the problem and I knew I’d have to call maintenance. Shaking and panicking (even though no one was going to yell at me or hit me), I began meticulously cleaning BEFORE calling maintenance. Why? Because my ex trained me to clean up immediately. If I threw up, I cleaned up. If I broke something, I cleaned it up. I could get into serious trouble if he discovered any kind of mess. So, there I was, cleaning and panicking, finally calling maintenance, and then pacing, with my heart racing, as maintenance knocked on the door. I caught myself and realized what was going on.

         Jodi cleaned for Travis. Perhaps she was yelled at if she missed a spot of dust. Perhaps she went into some kind of mode of “gotta clean” the night he died. In her panic and shock, no doubt, she just did whatever, without realizing what she was doing. It was probably more an automatic reaction and a panic attack than anything else.

         • So true……the mind can try to forget, but every cell in your body remembers when there’s an association to trigger the panic.

     • Yes your right Dog. She hoped he would change an she was in love with him an hoped when it all failed he would get HELP. But she felt he would not get HELP because no one wanted to ADMIT he had some problems. There has to be other women out there that know what she is talking about all this strange behavior did not just start up in his later years. It disgusts me that other women would not stand up no matter how shameful it is.

       An as far as that goes the sisters themselves had to see some kind of behavior also that was disrespectful to women and of course they will not say anything either.

       • Rhonda, I am in total agreement and I am somewhat shocked. Not so much bothered the comments where people ask why she didn’t walk away, or do this or that instead – those are just honest questions. It’s the judgement of her not walking away, and the downplaying of his behaviors that are disturbing me along with the “all men have rape fantasies”……

5. Is it just me or are Travis’ “friends” painting a picture of Travis as someone who had no ability to make sound judgments in his life regarding Jodi? If he or any of these “friends” had sooo many “bad feelings” and felt so strongly that she had slashed his tires, etc., why on God’s green earth would they have not gone further to get her away from him? Restraining orders at a minimum. Maybe locking his doors at some point. I’ll tell you why. Because there was no real fear. It’s a sick ego boost to make people think you have a “stalker” on some level, isn’t it? The “friends” have crossed the line, but it will be interesting to watch as they one by one come out of the woodwork for their 15 minutes and to support this convenient truth.

   And isn’t it interesting that this Bryan Carr was once deemed a somewhat credible source of information on Jodi, but now that he’s thrown this fork into the road (albeit he stole it from here), he is a nut job! He no longer fits HLN’s agenda. It’s actually probably a good thing because it officially starts this conversation in the mainstream towards the other more plausible theory.

   As always, no disrespect is meant to the family or true friends of TA.

   http://www.change.org/petitions/take-a-stand-against-yellow-journalism-headline-news-hln-nancy-grace-jane-velez-mitchel-jean-casarez-vinnie-politan-dr-drew

   • I’ve noticed as the media attention has grown during the trial the nonsense spewing from the friends of TA has grown along with it. One of his friends, that fat goof who appeared on that Dateline program last week, saying things like (not exact quote) “Travis kicked Jodi to the curb, got rid of her, and surprise surprise she shows up at a PPL function with a new rising star in the company.”. Really, you fat little coward? I hate to break the news but being on the arm of a rising star in a sham company such as PPL is nothing for anyone to be proud of. Jodi is a beautiful woman, based on looks alone Travis was clearly the pursuer in that relationship. I see TA’s little friends trying to make it sound like Jodi should thank her lucky stars that a guy like TA gave her the time of day. They all come across as weazley little used car salesman, telling a tale to make the sale, that’s all.

     • Right! They should all be grateful if a woman like Jodi paid them the time of day. Beauty AND brains, plus a kind kind heart.

     • Not to mention dog, Jodi was set up with Ryan by some relative of Chris Hughes…Zion Hughes or something like that.

       They are all just liars and can’t keept THEIR stories straight!

     • U GOT IT RIGHT DOG,

     • Yes! I noticed the same thing and thought “Ooh, a rising star of a pyramid scheme, so impressive!”

       • LOL! “another rising star at PPL” LOL!! I wish my husband WOULD tell me he was going to join PPL! LOL!

     • Dog, agree. Would love to see a video of all the clips of his so-called “friends”. Their chorus is so rehearsed, so flimsy, such a sales pitch!

       Also, would love to see a list of the top 10 or 15 or so questions in video form unanswered by the prosecution.

       Yeah, she is lying now. Lying to protect her and her family’s life. And yes stupid, but fueled by fear to have not told the entire truth from the beginning. But Flores wasn’t listening and that has been made clear. Who is above the DA? What entity? Department of Justice?

       And poor Nurmi, doing a stellar job, but he must know the truth.

       Does anyone wish at some point she would crack and just blurt out the truth? But that would actually likely hurt her and who knows what. She’s very strong, but you can see the life being drained from her by having to admit to a crime she didn’t commit on a man she loved, if only for the way she imagined and wanted him to be, not how he truly was. Very sad.

       http://www.change.org/petitions/take-a-stand-against-yellow-journalism-headline-news-hln-nancy-grace-jane-velez-mitchel-jean-casarez-vinnie-politan-dr-drew

       • I have to disagree with the idea she is lying to protect someone, if that were the case, she would have just admitted to killing him in the beginning. Her first two stories were of one, not knowing who did it, but not being involved, and the second, two masked intruders. If she was protecting someone, it would be dangerous to encourage the police to further look into other suspects, as they might find who she was protecting.

     • there isnt one of TA friends that can compare to jodi looks. they are soooo jealous of her. thats what i think. thats why they are talking all the crap about her. most of them wanted to be in her place. jodi knows how to talk, walk with the best of them. does anyone know who Nurmi is calling on next?

       • Maggie wouldnt that be exciting if Jodi just said, ok ok this is the truth. and told everything and everyone who was involved. What if when the gun went off she passed out and woke up to him dead. and thought omg what did i do. just a thought. ive got so many things going on in my head i just dont know.

         • believe me, if there were ANY evidence at all that someone else was involved, the defense would be all over it.. there were only 2 ppl involved that day…jodi and travis and it was a struggle between the two of them for their lives. only lingering question is whether or not the jurors will believe her..

     • I thibnk all of his so called friends have reachd the other side of the world,meaning lunacy! They were and are green with envy:Jodi was the ”exotic stranger” the intruder that came into TA’s life and they KNEW she was mentally superior to them,she may not have finished high school but she had spent time searching to find her life purpose,plus all her sensitivity and Art affiliation mede her eloquent,well spoken almost appearing highly educated.I mean even to this day that her life and life environment have changed dramatically I wouldnt be able to believe that this is a woman with no university background.Now imagine how Jodi was,acted and interacted when she was a free person.Oh my,the jealousy that they must have felt.So ,the solution?Suck her brains into this cult religion,brainwash her as much as possible to become robot-like(like the H’s and that Desiree girl who seemed almost like a real robot).Of course her ”controller” would be Travis,he was the Chosen one by the group of admirers.And when they realised how different she was,she was ostrasized.No,I could never see Jodi as simply a good Mormon wife with her husband and their kids happily living in a suberb-she was wayyyy too special and she got punished for that by them all,maybe TA including.

     • Yes it is horrible slander what they are doing to Jodi. I think she was trying to stay in that MORMON group an maybe the PPL group. But I pray she see’s that is a horrible choice an does not go back to that religion where she feels she has to be with an marry a man from that religion.

       Do you remember that Abe guy too he also disgusts me. Here she was nice to him when Travis was saying that Abe had soul less eyes. She said oh Abe never has said anything but good things about you tho. AN then this ABE guy gets on tv an says the most horrible things about Jodi an it is like he is so GIDDY about it. He truly makes me ill. He wanted Jodi but was turned down because she wanted only Travis an it hurt his pride you can tell so now he says really ugly things about her. An from looking at his my space page Abe is a PIG also.

       • Rhonda he had to keep her a secret so of course he told people she stalked him.

       • Rhonda

         I don’t think Travis and some of his friends are a good representation of what the Mormon faith is actually about. In fact, he was the exact opposite. I hope Jodi met enough good people who are members of the church to understand that Travis and his friends are not indicative of Mormons in general. In fact, that goes for you too and anyone else who seems to generalize Travis’ actions and his association with the Mormon faith.

   • TA was BRAGGING to his friends re: all the sex with Jodi and how was destroying every hole she had, etc.
     (paraphrasing from a guy to a guy…)

   • It kind of creeps me out in here because I know that Bryan Carr is in here somewhere an I may even have talked to him in here. But he does report things from this site. An tells the WORLD Jodi told him this or that an somebody needs to go tell the NEWS that that GUY is not talking to JODI even. Somebody surely can get in a call an tell them that.

6. watching “highlights” on trutv wih our pal vinnie! i missed yesterday.
   the Vin man keeps saying, “trashing TA, putting on trial, etc”.
   YEP, that’s right Vinny! and that IS TA’s voice AND words on the phone. can not get away from that, xcep for him repeating jodi was willing. that is weak, imo.

   we hear how TA treated jodi STR8 from TA, and IF she did all those wounds, HOW CAN NO ONE on tv mention that was “all the rage from repeated humilation delivered to jodi via TA”? i mean that’s Psych 101 to me. the t.heads and so called xperts on tv give the hosts what they want… “jodi is a chameleon, a liar…”

   i REALLY like what Nurmi is doing. esp. with words just showing TA’s words. surprised it’s allowed, but glad they can do it. AND the JOURNAL!! GREAT MOVE!!

   as we ALL kno, preMed? NO WAY!! NOT A CHANCE!! sorry, TA lovers. HOW can u be for a guy like that?
   how about A LIL RESPECT for a woman?

   • After at least twelve days to testimony, the “chameleon’s” true colors would have shown through. They haven’t..

     I am so sick of this hogwash that TA’s dumb friends are still putting forward. They know the truth now, and they really need to just shut up for the sake of TA’s memory, if nothing else.

     • This is so typical his friends are weird CULTISH
       This concept of controlling thought is explained further: “In the real world, nature provides us with an open system of trial and error, awareness and learning. Exercising our own bodies, senses, minds and self-direction allows us to reach for the stars, to see a greater range of possibilities and fulfill ourselves by being true to ourselves. In contrast, The Pattern, or upside-down world of Mormonism, took away our individuality. We became part of the mass known as the Latter-day Saints. We were instructed several times a week about what to think, what to believe, how to behave, what to read, how to dress and how to spend our money.”
       http://www.mormonconspiracy.com/mind-control.html

       • Yeah… no. Oliviero, I’ve been a member living in Logan Utah for many years, and never once have I been told what to think, believe, how to behave, etc. I make a conscious choice to follow some of the church’s suggestions, such as tithing and doing home teaching, but it’s MY choice. We aren’t forced or brainwashed into doing anything. It’s all free will. I really wish you wouldn’t go to these cockamamie Conspiracy theory websites and spout their filth as fact.

         • As Travis’s friend I want to remember my friend as I knew him. I believe many of his friends wish to do this also. I; for one will not speak publically, ever (televised) that is. I feel I best serve my friend by being objective enough to listen to the information presented, hear more than is said and be guided by my conscience. I have my own thoughts, own opinions and own feelings. I am not a sheeple, and easily led, as most Mormons have been painted to be, though most are not. I believe there are so many things none of us will ever be privy to from their relationship. I did not see their relationship, if I had I know I would have called my friend on his behavior. I did not know this side of Travis. But I also did not know the side of Jodi that we see in the publicized proceedings of court. I pray for all involved, Jodi, Travis’s family, the jury and most importantly the general public. If the self-centered, malicious, mob mentality is any indication of the world we live in, with no compassion for anyone save themselves, I am very saddened as to what will become of us all. Justice for us all is what I pray for most.

           • That’s the bottom line. I really wish the media would cool it and allow the judicial process to proceed. The attempt to whip up a mob mentality is dangerous.

           • I wouldn’t campaign for my friend either like his friends have. People like you I respect, people like them, seem like game players not grieving friends who want to remember him in a nice way. They want to lie to everyone about him and paint a false picture of the guy.

             • I cannot in good conscience defend him. I did not know the side that is being portrayed. I cannot condemn her wither for the exact reason.

               • I understand. You sound like a strong person. I admit, if I were you, I’d be fearful that his friends would start in on me (you). Take it from me, they dont walk their talk. Be careful!

               • I’m tough. I have said the same thing to most all of them. I have no fear of reprisal. I have Truth on my side. Many may not want it to be true, but his own words have been used, no one held a gun to his head to make him say any of the things he did. It’s a fact that we all have a “church face” and “worldly face” and a privet face. Most would be in the very same boat as Travis if their thoughts, misspoken words and so called “deviant” behavior were made public. I cannot judge him, her or anyone. I have said before that if most of our thoughts, misdeeds or “deviant” moments were brought into this kind of light, we would all suffer greatly. I know I am correct in this. “Church” people are just that people, they are fallible and human, and they may try to be good, as I try to be good. But we all fail and we all need help and most of all we all need forgiveness.

               • “I have said before that if most of our thoughts, misdeeds or “deviant” moments were brought into this kind of light, we would all suffer greatly.”

                 No one should ever be ashamed or disgraced by anything they’ve done in life.

           • Understood, Bella. Very brave and commendable of you to post here. All of us here, I believe, only want the entire truth to be told. The family of Travis’ deserves that, as does all involved. And many of us believe, for some very valid, logical, factual reasons, that while no one is saying Jodi is a saint, that she did not maliciously kill him, certainly did not pre-meditate such, and possibly never harmed him at all.

             Please at least open your eyes, and perhaps even your Mormon friends, to these thoughts. No clear evidence presents that she planned a trip to see him – gas cans (completely in line with frugality, and even changing her mind on buying another can, car rental (she had rented a car 90 miles away to save money in the months before as well), the gun (an unlucky coincidence for sure, but still not proof, and not in line with a woman who is smart enough to know 25 caliber is not sufficient to kill anyone). She had every reason to keep Travis alive – if even at the off chance she could change his mind, and that he was a friend who inspired her and motivated her.

             She craved that. Jodi lied, many believe, because she was scared because she really had been threatened at the scene. So she figured to make it where she’d have no questions to answer at all and further place her from harm, she created the story that she wasn’t there at all, including the fake calls and emails to Travis.

             There is no proof of “stalking” or slashing of tires, just exaggerations of her stopping by, etc. When she saw him on the couch with another girl, wouldn’t a stalker confront them? She did not.

             Why did Travis’ friends, who routinely got a text or email from him regularly not check things out before 6 days? And they did not smell anything before that? Very, very suspicious.

             And Ashley Reed Thompson, Dustin’s wife or ex-wife. …do you know what caused her death in 2010?

             Her fear was more than her trust of law enforcement. Flores repeatedly told her, correctly, that more than one person was involved. Then she came out with the story to the media. I believe because she was afraid to tell investigators first (if that was the case, can’t recall if she had told LE first). But this made the state angry and they knew they had enough evidence to at least place her there, and then they could ignore most else that would support the intruders theory, as it has been shown. She is lying now, quite possibly, and taking the rap to protect her family. She knows the state will not investigate her claims. The self-defense story is plausible, but to many, it is obvious her emotions include the pain of confessing to a crime she did not commit.

             Justice for Travis would include those who did know him and care to not blindly support a theory even they don’t fully believe, but do everything they can to get out the whole truth, no matter how painful it might be. I believe, based on some of what I know, that Travis himself would want this. So very sorry for the loss of your friend, as we all are.

             • I take offence with your statement, “Please at least open your eyes, and perhaps even your Mormon friends, to these thoughts”. I believe my eyes are clearly open. I cannot speak for anyone else. I cannot change a feeling held by anyone else. The facts present themselves to all. I see the news, I see the media, I see this page, I see Twitter… I cannot change anyone else’s feelings, as they are just those; feelings. Just as I cannot convince you Mormonism is truly awe inspiring and not fundamentally wrong, or Travis was a good man. I cannot change your feelings.

               I can however lead myself in a truthful manner. I can be open and educate myself to know truth exists in many deceptions and in most things. I do not follow blindly. I can support Justice for all.

               • Bella, I’m sorry you felt offended. It was not my intention. Facts have been presented, certainly. But many here and other places don’t believe all the facts have been presented. I think most of us like to believe the state and law enforcement are here to protect us and always on the side of the truth. However, and maybe not you, but many have experienced that that is always not the case, and that there are egos and agendas involved.

                 I have zero problem with Mormonism, as I’m sure many others feel the same. I believe that Travis was a “good man”, with flaws just like most of us. I believe that Jodi is “good woman” with flaws, as well. I see no evidence from anyone, anywhere of any previous pathological, violent, or even untruthful behavior. I find it hard to believe she changed so much during this time. She had certainly broken up with boyfriends before, even had them cheat on her, have anal sex with her, and all else, and she did not find herself accused of pre-meditated murder.

                 My only request is ask yourself if you are content with the current answers to the most difficult questions, concerning both the details and the big picture.

                 Again, certainly justice should prevail, based on the entire, truthful picture.

                 Please try and ignore any obvious ignorant statements about Mormonism or you will miss the thoughtful, important other posts here that may help you in some way. That’s all.

               • Thank you BelieveInTruth,

                 I believe I will never know all the truth in this life. I will have to make my progress here and then when I meet my Father in Heaven, all TRUTH will be revealed. You are correct; too many egos and agendas are involved here to allow all the truth to come forth. I try to be satisfied with what I feel, know and discern here in this world of chaos and turmoil. My hope is Justice prevails notwithstanding the B.S we are being subjected to.

               • Bella, I am very sorry for the loss of your friend.

               • Thank you Sam,

                 That is one of the things I appreciate most here. A difference of opinion does not preclude simple courtesy. I sincerely appreciate the sentiment. I miss him. I grieve all over again for my friend as this all comes to light. I grieve for Jodi; she has lost much in this also. I ache for her sadness. Many ask the same question, how I can have empathy or sympathy for her. It is simple; she is a woman who made a horrible mistake, she is not the first and will not be the last. I believe she is truly remorseful for her actions. I do not believe she is only sorry for getting caught as many believe. She loved him, good bad or to her detriment, I believe she loved my friend. They were toxic for each other, but that is true of allot of relationships. I am not her judge, nor on the jury, my job not to judge her, my obligation is to forgive. Just as I forgive Travis for his inadequacies, I forgive her for her part.

           • What the mobs are not taking in to consideration is that in their pleadings for death they’re not only killing Jodi, they’re also killing her parents, her siblings, her family and friends. Yes, Travis’ family and friends went through it, we understand that. Is an eye for an eye really what the church teaches? And what about Travis’ sister Samantha? As an officer of the law should she be seeking utter retribution just because its her brother?

             • One of the things I see as I look at pictures of the families in court is two families who are devastated. It makes me so very sad. Each family member has lost someone. Travis’ family lost a brother they dearly loved and they also lost the innocent side of him they thought was all of who he was. Jodi’s siblings will always be the siblings of “Jodi Arias, the murderer” – even if she’s acquitted. Her parents will always be her parents. Even if Jodi does not get the death penalty, she will never have a normal life again where she will be able to walk down the street. Think about it without judging any of the family! It’s truly tragic for all concerned, when you do. Far too many hearts broken. Far too many lives changed forever.

           • Bella, if I may ask, what were your impressions of Jodi? I know you didn’t know her well, but did you see any of these “robotic” or “zombie-like” characteristics being described by others of Travis’ friends?

             Thank you so much, by the way, for honoring your friend so well. You are a very classy lady!

             • I only saw her once at a church related event. I found her “normal” not and “Me Centered” as most are describing. I saw her as another “sister” (church description) I didn’t see “soulless” nor cold. But I look at most people differently. I had a very different upbringing as I was able to be around people most in society would describe as repulsive and ugly. (I can explain that individually but not on a forum as this.) I saw her as quiet, which I understand. I am quiet till I am secure in my surroundings; I feel she is very similar to me. Surprising I see her same way today. Many media outlets have said “the many faces of Jodi” but if you look at any of us in any of 100 different settings, we all have different faces, expressions and some type of emotion written on or face. I view her today as I viewed her then, as another “sister”.

               • ” I had a very different upbringing as I was able to be around people most in society would describe as repulsive and ugly.”

                 Ah, that helps explain your generosity of heart that so many people lack.

                 Thanks for sharing your thoughts here Bella..

               • Bella- You are very eloquent and are to be commended for your objectivity. I am sure this is very difficult for you, as you are grieving the loss of your friend, that you knew as a kind and good person. None of us can ever truely know the heart of a person, only God knows.

               • Bella, thank you for answering this, my question of your impressions of Jodi, and also for everything else you have EVER said on this forum. I am so touched by who you are, the kind of person you are. Not that this should EVER matter, but I haven’t known very many Mormons in my life as I grew up in another country (not the US). I grew up believing there is good and bad in all religions, but to respect everyone’s faith. I first heard of Mormonism because I was CRAZY about Donny Osmond back in the 70s and didn’t know a thing about it. I heard it was an American religion, a form of Christianity, but you couldn’t have caffeine (tea or coffee) or soda. I remember being devastated thinking I loved tea and if I grew up and married Donny, how would he ever survive my family who drank tea every 10 minutes LOL

                 For some reason, even after I moved to the US in 1985, I never met any Mormons in person until quite recently. I heard from others they knocked on doors like Jehovah’s Witnesses and always hoped one would knock on mine so I could find out a little about their faith. But it never happened. Then, I finally got to meet one who was the wife of someone my ex did business with, but only very very briefly, although I talked with her by phone a few times thereafter. She was a lovely lovely person. Her husband wasn’t Mormon, but they had a big family. I had no idea that Mormons did not like their own to marry outside their faith, due to that experience, and therefore, to this day, I don’t know if that’s true or not

                 While I was in the process of trying to leave my abusive husband, I met another Mormon woman in a group on FB. At first, I thought she was awesome. But after my husband was arrested, and I was left in our home with no water, no income, and no method of transportation — which he abruptly shut off after being released on bond — this woman tried really hard to convert me to Mormonism telling me that if I belonged to her church, I would have lots of support, like a family. I have been an atheist for a long time, but I was feeling very desperate, at that time, as I had no way to get to the store for food and it was costing me almost $100 round trip in a cab. I had called a gazillion different Christian churches in the area, as was suggested by devout Christian friends. But none of them would help. My FB friend — who lived in another state — said she would reach out to the local ward in my area. Strangely enough (from what I’d heard about Mormons wanting to convert everyone), the bishop took forever to do anything, and my friend was actually quite angry. I would have done almost anything in order to get a ride to the store so that I could feed my cats. I had even begged the Christians (who offered to give me a ride to Bible Study, but not to the store) that I would go to the study groups *if* they would just give me a ride to the store. I was willing to pay for rides too.

                 Finally, I was contacted by some missionaries of the Mormon church (this was over a month later). I was ashamed of my house and did not want them to come there. I was exhausted and wasn’t keeping up with housekeeping, and had been trained to keep it clean. They insisted they would have to come to my house in order to meet me before giving me rides to the store. I told them I was ashamed of my house. Also, there were doors and walls with holes from my ex-husband’s temper that no one had ever seen before, and I didn’t want them to see. I had been trained to NEVER let anyone in. But these people sounded so nice so I set up an appointment a week and a half later (their earliest date, they said). They showed up 2 hours earlier than expected — which annoyed me because I wasn’t ready and again, I had been trained not to show my face in public unless my hair and make up were perfect. They were extremely persistent at the gate of my community and it annoyed me. I spoke with them on the phone and asked if they could come back 2 hours later or even 1 hour later. I basically begged them. I had never spoken with the woman, only the man, and he seemed rather arrogant. Coming from the situation I’d been in (basically imprisoned in my home for 9 years), I was rather intimidated. He told me he would bring a woman, and that he had a woman with him, but I didn’t know them. He told me I was being ungrateful (yes, he said that word) and that they had driven there (only about 15 minutes for them — an eternity for me, a woman who doesn’t drive at all) — to bring me their faith and share it with me. Although he didn’t say it exactly, his attitude was basically “we’re here now, take it or leave it.” I was very upset and felt threatened and said “I’m sorry, I can’t do this.” He said “Well, I thought you needed a ride to the store desperately?” He was sarcastic at this point. I told him to go away and that I thanked them for coming, but I couldn’t see them then. He said I didn’t sound like an abused woman to him. I had heard that so many times. I remember breaking down and crying soooo hard.

                 I told my Mormon FB friend and she was upset, but also said that if I wanted the help of the Mormon church, I would have to be more accepting and allow them to introduce me to their faith. I felt very pressured and this was really the first time in 10 years that I’d been free of my husband. I wanted help, but I didn’t want to be forced to convert. I don’t know if that makes sense or not. My friendship with that friend suffered. She no longer called me. However, when she posted that she was feeding her kids cereal for dinner because her soon-to-be-ex hadn’t paid child support, since I had a little money I had hidden from my ex, I bought her Visa or Amex gift cards and sent them to her. It wasn’t a lot of money, maybe $50 total. She politely, but cursely thanked me. Some time after that, after I got on my feet and had moved away, she turned on me over something stupid, and we haven’t been friends at all since then. While I realize it’s not fair to judge a faith based on one person, I have felt a little disturbed since then. I will also admit to feeling disturbed by those stranger Christians who also offered me rides to Bible Study, but not to the store even if I paid them (but less than the cab). I grew up Christian, isn’t charity important anymore?

                 My only other experience with a Mormon person was with someone from work. He overheard me talking about my awful divorce with someone there and asked me about it. Assuming he was interested in a friendly manner, and since he had always seemed so congenial, I told him a little. On another occasion, I posed a hypothetical legal question to him about my case. He seemed to be sympathetic and answered me. I didn’t detect any signs of uncomfortability. We never spoke about it again. He later told my boss that I made him feel very uncomfortable talking about my personal family situation and that it was inappropriate, which she brought up in a review. Then, why did he ask? Why did he butt in? And why didn’t he walk away or tell me that our conversation was inappropriate?

                 I’m a hyperliteral person, I admit and I may not pick up on non verbal queues — some of which I blame on the fact that I had no human interaction (other than with my husband) for 9 years, and I forgot social skills. Of course, he didn’t know that so it’s not his fault. I have wracked my brain trying to figure out what I did wrong. I have even wondered (and I shouldn’t) if he beats his own wife, so thought it unacceptable of me to complain. But since both of these experiences, I have not held people of the Mormon faith in high regard. I apologize for being judgmental about that, as it’s usually not my way. One evangelical friend really helped me a LOT and NEVER tried to convert me or pressure me to return to the faith of my youth. She told me Mormonism was founded by a guy who is crazy, that one of the rewards in the afterlife is you are awarded your own planet. Never taking her word (or anyone else’s nowadays), I did my own research, and was somewhat disgusted with Joseph Smith’s behavior. I hope this doesn’t offend you. As all of this was rather recent, before reading of Jodi’s case, I have tended to agree with some of the posters bashing Mormonism, which is truly out of character for me.

                 I’m writing all this because you have honestly, sincerely, restored me to my belief that well to quote the Jackson family (another family popular at the same time as the Osmonds, in my youth) “one bad apple don’t spoil the hole bunch, girl” or in my case, possibly two bad apples. And I have rethought my behavior towards the missionaries. That man didn’t understand how threatened I felt and, now, that I’m returned to society, I realize people show up early or late ALL the time. It’s not a cardinal sin. But my ex-husband lived by schedules to the minute, and I had to, as well. It was all I knew at the time, just a few weeks after his arrest.

                 So, I thank you for returning me to the person I have always been, and forcing me (although you didn’t realize it or intend it) to question myself on what I consider to be my “bad behavior” and my own judgmental opinions. I’m giving away some things about myself here that may allow anyone reading to know who I am, if they already know a little of my story. I usually don’t do that. But it’s worth it for me to tell you how much your posts have meant. Thank you, from the bottom of my heart.

                 And thank you also for confirming what I thought about Jodi, although I don’t know her. Watching her testify, I feel like I am her, except that was me in my 20s, not today, in my 40s. I looked into so many faiths, usually influenced by some guy or another. I even began the process of converting to Judaism at one point. And I was really pretty, but really quiet and introverted, and didn’t understand my appeal to men based on my looks because honestly, my personality didn’t match. I would have done anything for a man, to make him happy.

                 Again, Bella, thank you for ALL your comments. And I’m so sorry that you are not only mourning the loss of a friend in Travis, but also, perhaps the loss of what he seemed to be. You are very honest, very open, and truly a compassionate person. I am so glad I found this forum, you, and so many of the others here. And I am so glad I have heard Jodi’s testimony. I only hope she someday can realize how much she has meant to people like me, an also abused woman, who is moving beyond it. Thank you. Bless you.

           • Thank you for being honest. No one every really knows what goes on behind closed doors. I am sorry for the loss of the friend you knew; first by his death and now your loss again by seeing a person you did not know. There are no winners in this situation but it is refreshing to see someone willing to be objective.

         • Well like we keep saying WE KNOW all MORMON”S OR LDS or whatever they are called do not FOLLOW all the crap but you can’t tell me some do not go OVER BOARD it happens in every religion you are going to have a group that does do things to the EXTREME or even the OLD WAYS even if the people take it out x it out or whatever they do it is still doctrine it still was written down one time an then they change it to fit the days prophet. Personally I do not believe there are prophets on earth today. Jesus will come back one day an we will see.

           • Each religion has people who go overboard.

             We do have a group that do things in the “Old ways”, the FLDS, and as I mention prior, they are not members of our church, we do not affiliate with them, and we do not mix or mingle.

             They are a separate church in our eyes, and whom we wholeheartedly disagree with.

           • Just like the foundation of a building is important The foundation of Mormonism Founded by a Criminal Joseph Smith, a complete degenerate since they base their teachings on Him he is the Founder. I am sorry But I see it as a Cult & So does The Ross Institute that studies Cults, Are there nice Mormons yes, but the Religion is cultish and its foundation is of Mud, Smith was a complete degenerate & evil Man. There are too many cases similar to Jodis Look how she is, still afraid to say anything about Travis, This group appears Nightly on Trash TV Shows I am sure they are getting paid for it & how about the money being pumped into that Trashy Channel that has Jane Velez Dr. D, NG, how much Mormon money is going into that.?? They are way too prejudice. Sorry these people are a disgrace and Jodi Arias needs to be de programmed. Think about the hold he had.

             • I am going to repost this, I think its very enlightening regarding the Mormon women, and how things are for them in the LDS church.

               http://home.teleport.com/~packham/prozac.htm

           • In Utah – You Don’t Embarrass the Mormon Church!!
             http://4witness.org/mormon/hofmann.php
             Not all Mormons adhere to this I am sure but many do and this Group covers up a lot.
             Remember Travis Room mate is the one who revealed to the girl who testified that, Travis was having relations with Jodi,, she says I later found out it was a lie, OH MY GOSH WHAT??? are you serious I am thinking, The horse is Out of the barn on that one. According to a psychiatrist who appeared only once Court TV, was cut off after he stated a difference of opinion about Jodi He said her behavior was consistent with abuse he said Looks like Ritual Abuse which is used in Cults as a form of Control. When he said ritual abuse The bald guy don’t know his name said she wasn’t abused. Now this was a legit Psychiatrist. The Bald guy was just chanting the Mantra. Evil Jodi, If you keep saying things over & over again they believe it will sink in.

         • Hi Pyromie I have a question for you.Do you think that the wards should be split up differently when it comes to age groups? I have a problem with 29-30 year old men “dating” 18-19 year old girls.I tend to see it as a possible predatory situation. I personally think it should be set up as singles 18-24 and singles 25-30 as there are much different thought processes in those age groups.

           • Honestly, I don’t see much dating with that large of an age difference, but It still is up to those who do it. I mean, If an 18 year old person meets a 29 year old, No matter where, and they decide to date, it’s their decision. I personally don’t agree with it, per se, but I don’t see a problem with it if they are the ones who choose to be together.

             My aunt (non LDS) and my uncle (non LDS) are ten years apart, he is 50, she is 40, and they’ve been happily married since she was 25, so based on that, I would consider myself bias.

             • Thank you for your reply Pyromie. Personally I think there is a big difference between an 18-19 year old and a 25 year old. People tend to do a lot of growing in those years.Maturing would be a better word.

       • Sounds like PPL’s creed too….

   • I guarantee the judge is going to allow JM to play Jodi asking to get “her ass pounded” and several other recordings that make her look like a total slut in his closing.

   • One of HLN’s catchphrases is “They’re putting the VICTIM on trial!” What the hell do they expect when the defendant is making the case that she was abused?

     • They better be careful. It could easily backfire!! If the jury has decided that JA was just as willing in the sexual fantasy area as TA and it has been established that she was sexually active for many years more than TA then this line of defense is actually hurting her. Not to mention I am on her side and I have to admit that I am sick of Jodi’s testimony and I have developed a serious dislike for Nurmi.
       Let’s just hope the jury hasn’t gotten sick of him yet….he needs to get her off the stand QUICKLY!! She still has to answer the jury’s questions and those will be a huge indicator of how things are going!!

       • That’s not the jury’s job, however. They are supposed to look at whether the prosecution has proven its case of murder one beyond reasonable doubt. It hasn’t because it can’t.

       • I agree, Hill. Nurmi should get her off the stand quickly, because it’s not sounding like Jodi is co-operating in her own defense. Her answers on re-direct have been wishy-washy and don’t offer the clarity the jurors need to get strong sense of the situation she was in.

         • I think she is treating this like a practice run.She knows she will be getting at least one appeal and is just using this as a way to figure out how to act kind of like a dress rehearsal.

           I am still really worried about how the jury will judge the 13 stab wounds to the back after he was already shot…..it is kinda hard to call that self defense.

           • If I remember correctly, only 2 of the wounds would be classified as “stab” where the others were incised wounds. Anybody else have a thought on this?

             • If all those stab wounds were deep, the pros would have gone on and on. I read the autopsy report and the backwounds were only an inch deep.

               • Eleven knife wounds to the back and two HUGE gashes to the head and you are arguing the DEPTH of the wounds?

                 Seriously, that is a piss poor explanation. Somehow they have to explain those wounds or the BEST they can hope for is felony murder without premeditation.

                 It is odd that anytime I talk about the wounds to the back Jodi supporters simply try to act like they don’t matter because they aren’t malicious or life threatening enough. He was already shot in the face and that makes ALL of the knife wounds hard to rationalize let alone stabbing him in the back that many times.

                 The trial is not like this forum, the jury will want answers or they will simply assume the worst.

               • By the way you also avoided the fact of the matter by making a straw man argument about the severity of the wounds…

                 The point was how can those wounds and the wounds to the back of the head be considered defensive in any way?

                 I am not here to tear Jodi down I just want an honest discussion and simply trying to change the subject on the more difficult points makes us look like fools.

             • The problem is Jodi not remembering the details of the stabbing. Without any details its hard for anyone to try to piece together what exactly happened, or at least critiquing her version of the event.

               • By your logic all you have to do is kill someone and then say you cannot remember.

                 The defense will have to explain WHY thirteen stab wounds to the back could occur in a self defense scenario,

             • I agree when looking at the PHOTOS it looks like SLASH SLASH SLASH on the back like he was on top of her an she was running the knife across the back ? the actual stab wounds hit the bone they said so maybe he finally rolled off then.

               • Exactly! It can be explained as self defense because the back wounds are indicative of coming from someone in a position not to be “stabbing someone in the back”, but rather from someone who is in a position where they are only able to thrash around from underneath their attacker. Makes perfect sense to me. I kind of get the feeling that the guy just would not stop, no matter what, and got angrier and scarier, and more of a threat just on pure adrenaline alone.

               • The fact That Jodi is defending Travis Oh only 4 times he was violent she only forgets the killing which was very horrible will make it very difficult,t her Lawyer Nurmi is good but she has been very protective of Travis. I don’t believe in the Death Penalty I think the Tape of Travis stating that is how he was able to rape her all those times, She seems to not deal with the reality. People noticed she was fighting her own Lawyer. I think Nurmi brought it home and answered to Martinez.
                 We will se what happens but she is way to protective of Travis. and it doesn’t look good when you look at the photos.

           • Felony murder without premeditation isn’t on the table from the State only Premeditated 1st degree DP murder.

             • The jury can find her guilty of a lesser offense in the state of Arizona.

               The jury are also the ones who decide the penalty in Arizona.

             • this is true.. they do not HAVE to find her guilty of 1st degree.. they can find her guilty of a lesser sentence.. and, even if they do find her guilty of 1st degree, they do not have to suggest the dp.. it isnt all or nothing.. there are many different ways this can go..

           • I believe he was on top of her when the back wounds happened and she was trying to get him off of her and this would fit in with self defense. I came to this conclusion after looking at the autopsy photo of his back and the back wounds make more sense if they were in that position. If he had her back to her the wounds would look much different. And Hill post on other days also discuss the back wounds and other theories we have and how we have come to some of the conclusions we did. You can’t just read one day and jump to the conclusion that we haven’t given this trial any thought.

         • Picque, I couldn’t agree more. Yesterday she really had opportunities to answer yes or no to questions that would have helped her but seemed like she refused to go there. On the other hand, it seems to fit with not wanting to make others look bad. We will see.

           • I know, Jodie. Makes you wonder what Nurmi’s plan is at this point. And speaking of him–do you notice that there’s a lack of something between Jodi and her attorneys? Nothing bad, like a conflict, but you’d think some kind of warmth would show through in their interactions.

             • Oh I see warmth. Sometimes, Jodi laughes when Nurmi does. It happened when she was being crossed. Yesterday, when she put her arm around Jenifer, She smiled at jodi broadly.

               • I did see that…and the picture above is from that instance.

                 I thought it was nice. 🙂

               • You’re right about the picture. Jennifer does seem to show kindness toward Jodi, and so does Nurmi, as when he approached her after she broke down on the stand. I guess I should’ve been more specific–Jodi doesn’t seem to accept it or to reciprocate–which is fine, and in many ways, understandable–but it still makes for some awkwardness and remoteness in their interactions. Anyway … I’m not trying to make an important point; it’s just an observation.

               • I think what you’re seeing is Jodi under extreme stress and terrified, not sure she can even go on, but giving it her all.

       • The number of years that Jodi was sexually active is irrelevant to this case. We all have pasts. Travis sure did as well.

7. Also Kira JM was the genius (I’m being sarcastic) who decided to seek the death penalty in this case. There was so much misinformation about what a “saint” Travis was and what a “jealous predator” Jodi was. How in the hell did these brainiacs at HLN think her defense was going to present their case?

   I also don’t see the point of why all these stupid HLN shows keep putting on friends of Travis even after the evidence already shows that Travis wasn’t who he made himself out to be. TA was the one leading a double life & pretending to be big financial success and a virgin! TA had financial problems and we all know he wasn’t a virgin either. What does their opinion of Travis/Jodi matter in terms of the evidence anyway? It’s up to the prosecutor to prove premeditation and he hasn’t succeeded in doing so.

   Thanks for allowing me to rant!

   • HLN is making a FORTUNE from this trial. It’s all about that!

8. I wish we could make this site by membership only with email verification in order to post. I don’t care who reads my comments, but the 2 brain cell people are annoying with their outstanding one-liners.

   • I concur, (unless you consider me one of those “2 brain cell people” haha.

     • No pyromie! I don’t consider you a 2 cell person, LOLOL.

       I like your posts, and you sound like a very nice Mormon…I always think about your feelings when I post conspiracy stuff, 😉

       Doesn’t mean I don’t post my thoughts…LOLOLOL

       • I’m not a very nice Mormon, I’m a very nice Person 😛 lol

         I don’t mind people posting their thoughts and opinions, It just kicks me in the seat when people post “Facts” about the church, that really either aren’t accurate, or are outdated.

         Keep on Rocking, BeeCee.

         • ” It just kicks me in the seat when people post “Facts” about the church, that really either aren’t accurate, or are outdated. ”

           I can understand that 🙂

         • AMEN!!!!!!!!! Outdated, and inaccurate. But the church is the church no matter the commentary or misguided information. We (members) don’t defend it (church). I believe as I need to believe. I live as I need to live. I love as I feel inclined to do so. But as many knock the church, much of my opinions formed in my youth continue today, my charity and compassion for Jodi stems from it. So knocking the church or Mormonism does nothing to, for, nor against me. I believe most members feel this way.

         • Yeah ppl say catholics worship statutes. LOL Kind bugged me back in the day but I know who and how I worship.

         • And I’m a good person but not a good Catholic LOL!

           • You don’t have to be a good (Mormon, Catholic, Lutheran… etc.) you just need to be a good human. The media, hates and all others could take a lesson from most on here.

             • Well said Bella!

             • I agree 100% Bella.

               • Indeed, and if people starting posting historical “facts” about any church, it could get really ugly fast! There is no religion without some serious nasty stuff. Even Buddhism (which isn’t really a religion) has some controversial figures in the past.

           • I’m pretty much the same thing. I do believe in Mother Mary though.:-)

             • She was a real person. I believe in her too.

               • Me too. I was just talking about the worshiping of statutes. People used to say, “you guys worship statutes” *rolls eyes”

               • But I think im mispelling statues. too much legal stuff LOL statues statutes.

               • I used to know someone who believe the Catholic church’s use of rosaries was satanic.

                 There was no reason behind it, he just thought it seemed “Evil”

                 Some people amuse me.

               • Catholicism is the only Christian denomination that gives Mary the title of “Mother of God” too!

         • ” It just kicks me in the seat when people post “Facts” about the church, that really either aren’t accurate, or are outdated. ”

           That’s a pretty big statement. You can be assured that young or ‘new’ members of the church are not at all familiar with what goes on behind closed doors. The church, regardless of religion, is bigger than the mob, its bigger than government in many places. I am quite sure the once-a-week church go’ers would be completely amazed/shocked/disgusted with some of the activities religion participates in.

           • That’s what former temple members say too. That’s my concern. They can’t all be disgruntled can they?

             • BUT the same could be said of any church, any religion …

               • true. But why such a web presence? why do they say they need counseling etc when they exit? That is what concerns me.

           • Allow me to clarify, It grinds my gears when people post things they believe to be facts, that aren’t true. I’m not stating all of their “Facts” aren’t true, just that those that they post that are either fallacies, or inaccurate, bother me.

             One such example would be the “Multiple wives” scenario.

             The LDS church hasn’t practiced polygamy since 1904, it was initially banned in 1890, but took some time to fully dissolve. The FLDS church (a broken off branch that chooses to still practice such things) have their own followings, but they have been completely cut off from the Standard church. We don’t agree with them, and nor do we affiliate with them.

             • pyromie..who are those sister wives people? Are they FLDS?

               Those people, ugh, I can’t even watch that show…but I guess more power to them to live in their drama filled lives.

               • We excommunicate Polygamists, so unless they are excommunicated LDS, they are FLDS (or neither?).

             • Sister Wives – The TLC program are LDS and they have actually taken a stance against FDLS, so there’s something very inconsistent here regarding LDS and multiple wives. I don’t care either way, just wanted to mention that I know they are LDS, and not FLDS.

               • So basically there can be people who call themselves Mormons and go by the old ways even if they aren’t allowed to be a part of mainstream Mormonism.

                 I guess they would fall under the “extremist” category.

           • Thats Not True Its Biblical so all “Christian” Denominations recognize Mary as the Mother Of Christ, The Mormons are not Christian.

   • I have to put my email in just too comment in here? would not matter people make up emails every day.

9. Nice post SJ!

10. I thought Jodi did really well on the stand yesterday. I was very touched by how she described her feelings for Travis … how she believed in him, that he could change and loved him with all his faults. The media psychologists say she is a sociopath. She clearly has a conscious. I even heard a victim’s advocate trying to sell the idea that Jodi is taking on the persona of an abused victim. That Jodi has learned (studied) what a victim would feel and do, and that is how she is testifying. From my own experience abusers can inflict emotional abuse frequently and physical abuse periodically. That can be bruises that are not seen, or fractures left untreated, and kept silent. Those fractures and hits to the body even if it’s infrequent instill fear and control. I like the way Nurmi brought out the range of emotion that Jodi experienced in the relationship. She didn’t know if she was coming or going.

    One other thing I wanted to share. I have stayed at the Ventana Resort at Big Sur. Before the trial I wasn’t sure about where I stood on Jodi’s stories. When I heard she and the former boyfriend worked at Ventana I have to admit it made me become more open minded to hear her side. It may seem hard to fathom that a place of employment could sway me, but if you have ever been there you may understand what I mean. It is one of the most serene places I’ve ever been, and I have traveled all over the world to some very nice places. So when Jodi talks about the Law of Attraction and things of a spiritual nature I find her believable knowing that she herself has been in that kind of environment. The Ventana is so beautiful and peaceful.

11. Observations I’ve made are very simple. Jodi’s behavior during direct calm and talkative vs her behavior during cross was defensive. Well guess what? IF Travis was this duplicitous person kind of like her lawyer vs the DA, what do you think Jodi’s behavior was like? Pretty much the same. Except she loved this man so the contrasting behavior may have been more drastic and if he was violent towards her she probably was more defensive. It’s that simple.

    • I disagree she is not in LOVE or have FEELINGS for the Prosecutor she knows he holds DISCONTENT for her she can feel that an see that. You can’t compare a LOVE AFFAIR that went wrong with some man you do not even know that is aggressive an confrontational with you. when your LIFE is on the LINE.

12. Can someone explain what was the fuzz over the Jodi´s journal yesterday?

13. Good day Team Jodie – hoping for another good day for Jodie and Nurmi.

14. Morning SJ!

    Thank you for posting that love of attraction quote! I’m a believer and a living proof that if you give love from the inside out you attract it 🙂

15. I don’t watch HLN but was channel surfing. Their lead-in for the day is now “Damage control – Can the defense punch enough holes into the proscutions case”. I had to listen for a minute and JVM was saying that the tape and journal is allowing the defense to punch holes into their theory. JVM also said she had a visceral reaction when listening to TA’s tape although she didn’t agree with the fact they were “snipped” together but saying she understood because the judge needs to be sure that there aren’t appellate issues.”

    Again, I don’t watch HLN but felt I needed to post this since it sounds like the talking heads are now moving their goal posts. If the talking heads are admitting basically that the PROs case isn’t holding up, one would think the jurors definitely don’t.

16. I watched many parts of days 23, 24, and 25 over and over again. I think that the prosecutor does not really believe Jodi’s accounts. I am almost certain that he believes that she remembers everything that transpired. And, I think that he also knows that the memories of the event are very painful, and act as triggers for an emotional response.

    If a person has real amnesia, and a crime scene was shown, then the person might draw a blank, and not really understand what he is looking at. For example, a splatter of red on some floor tile may not draw an emotional response from a person – provided the person has no memories connected to it. Of course, what a person will say is that Jodi’s mind was in a “fog”. But, the prosecutor’s view appears to be that moving the body, washing the blood away with water, deleting all of the photos in the camera, attempting to dispose of the camera, removing the weapons from the crime scene, and such, indicate that the person’s mind was not in a “fog”, because the person was fully cognizant of all such behavior, which is consistent with “tampering” with a crime scene. And, I think Jodi admitted this, at one point. So, I do not think that Martinez believes that her mind was in a “fog”.

    Also, Martinez is tracking further potentially deceptive behavior that followed immediately after leaving the crime scene, such as changing clothes before the check point, washing bloody hands, disposing of the weapons in the desert, calling or texting with disingenuous messages, and showing up to see Ryan, as though nothing had ever happened. Again, I do not think that Martinez believes that she “cannot remember” the incident. Instead, I think that he sees all such behavior as being deceptive, both during, and after, she says that her mind was in a “fog”.

    Because of this, it appears that Martinez is going so far as to use her painful memories of the killing directly against her, by making her “re-live” the events, in order to “break her down” mentally, and emotionally. It appears that he figured out that the memories are horribly painful, and something that she would rather avoid re-living. So, whenever she says that she “does not remember”, I do not think that he believes her, at all. And, it looks like it is these statements, and similar statements, are the sort of thing that drives the prosecutor forward.

    Also, it looks like the prosecutor does not believe the sequence of events, either. For example, he asked her about the splatter of Travis’s blood on the sink. Obviously, if Travis came out of the shower, in anger, he still would not have been bleeding. If the death occurred away from the bathroom, such as at the end of the hallway, then Travis never could have leaned over the sink, and splattered blood on the sink, since he already would have been dead. So, if the blood splatter came directly from Travis, while he leaned over the sink, then how did it get there? And, when?

    I think that Martinez is going to say that while he was in the shower, she returned with the gun, and shot him in the head. Of course, if a person is in a shower stall, there is nowhere to go. But, the bullet wound would not have killed him, since the gun was severely underpowered. After being shot in the head, Travis could have come out of the shower. If he did come out of the shower, with the bullet wound, then he could have stopped to look in the mirror, to see what had happened to his head. Or, he could have staggered around, while leaning over the sink, at one point. If he did stagger down the hallway, then Jodi could have met him, and finished killing him with the knife, after abandoning the gun – which did not kill him on the first shot.

    So, I think that Martinez may think that Jodi, may have shot him first, in the shower, thus incapacitating his, to some degree. Then, upon meeting him in the hallway, the first cuts were made to the hands, and then she may have stabbed him in the stomach/chest area, hitting his heart, with the knife. As soon as he went down, face first, she would have continued stabbing his back. But, to make sure that he was dead, she would have taken the last cut to his throat, by first lifting his head, and then cutting his throat. Then, she would have dragged his body back to the shower stall. If she dragged his body on a tiled floor that was wet, then it would have been easy to move, due to less friction. The prosecutor may say that she threw water on the floor to make it easier to slide the body across the floor. Or, he may say that washing with water was done to obliterate the evidence. Either way, I think he will say that this points to a person thinking very clearly, during the event.

    Also, Jodi said that when she “came to herself”, she was in the desert. And, afterwards, when she went to see Ryan, he said that she seemed perfectly fine. Yet, she also said that she remembered holding the knife, and dropping it, while screaming in the bathroom. So, even if she remembered that part, it ought to be enough to have left her really shaken up, immediately afterwards. And, if she did not remember any of it, then it should be cause for immediate concern. I mean, how can a person end up somewhere, and not remember anything, unless there is a medical problem? Also, how could someone end up somewhere, with bloody clothes, and weapons, while not remembering what had transpired? Again, given subsequent behavior, I think that Martinez is convinced that she remembers everything in excruciating detail.

    Also, I do not think that Juan was concerned about the gas cans, themselves. I think what actually drew his concern was the fact that Jodi purchased gas, for the cans, by paying cash, while she did the rest of the transactions, via credit card. Probably, the gas stations had some sort of video record of her entering into the service station to pay for the gas can fillings separately, with cash payments. He realized that these small cash payments were done in a way that made them hard to detect – unlike the credit card transactions. So, I think he sees these small cash payments as a deliberate attempt to hide the gas purchase. Also, Ms. Arias said that she returned one can, but did not remember getting a receipt from Wal-Mart. And, she told her friends that she was going to Utah, and not to Arizona. For these reasons, I think that Martinez has seen this as involving deception from the beginning. Of course, one would ask what a person would do with three tanks of gas. The more obvious answer would be to put the gas in the car. But, the gas could also have been used to destroy virtually all of the evidence in the home, too. If the gas was simply to put in the car, then why go out of the way to make sure that it was done via a cash transaction, rather than via the credit card? Why separate the transactions, while pumping?

    Another thing that I have noticed is Juan’s manner of sparring with Ms. Arias. It is easy to see the tactics as being bully-ish. But, what is harder to see is that Jodi frequently engages in passive aggressive forms of behavior. In some cases, Juan will ask a “yes” or “no” question. And, Jodi will insist upon giving the same longer answer, three or four times in a row. For example, if Juan asks, “Did you tell him that you were going to Arizona? Yes or No”, Jodi may say something about Utah, three or four times, repeatedly. For some people – or people in the jury – this could raise a question: Was Jodi really a “battered victim”? Or, was she the aggressor?

    Everytime that Jodi engages in passive aggressive antics, Juan simply raises the bar, and escalates the fight, which in some ways shows that Jodi can be extraordinarily aggressive, and defiant. Of course, Juan already showed the jury what transpired in her past relationships, with a number of males. It appears that Jodi called the shots. He also showed the jury what transpired when her mother came to help her, and how that relationship suffered considerable deterioration. And, the jurors may know that Jodi acted in defiance, against her own lawyer’s advice. One lawyer – Victoria Washington – appears to have quit the case, after Jodi wanted to represent herself. So, when Jodi comes off as passively aggressive, and Juan starts sparring with her, the jury could easily wonder whether Jodi is really the aggressor, or whether she is a “battered victim”.

    Also, the jurors may see the passive aggressive behavior as dovetailing with really aggressive forms of lying. In other words, some people tell “white lies”, to not hurt others. Others may lie simply to avoid getting into trouble. But, in this case, we see the person who committed the act also calling the detective (possibly pumping him for information), holding press conferences and making false statements, socializing with the victim’s friends, going to the memorial, etc. This is a sort of really aggressive type of behavior that does not seem compatible with the idea that a person is simply an innocent, battered victim of a crime, who is cooperating with the authorities.

    Also, the fact that Jodi admitted that the gunshot came first, does change things. Everyone wonders how so much could have been done, in under two minutes. But, if the initial shot to the head occurred in the shower stall, then by the time that the knife was employed, Travis could have been seriously incapacitated. So, finishing him off with a knife would not require much work. Nor would it have required very much time, either. Also, this could easily explain why Jodi did not get hurt, herself, if Travis had first been, to some degree, incapacitated by a shot to the head, with the gun.

    Anyway, my guess is that the further the trial continues, the worse it will become, for her. The biggest problem is that if the jurors conclude that she really does remember everything, then they may see the memory loss problem as a “smokescreen”. And, if they make that conclusion, then it could appear to them as though she is still hiding something.

    • Maybe the blood splatter over the sink is after he was shot, she slippea away, he got up and went to the sink and mirror before he went to find her and like she said kill her.

    • One can never assume TA was shot in the shower since Flores didn’t feel the scene required that the shower walls be checked for ever having had the presence of blood….IMO Barney Fife would have known to check the shower walls although they looked very pristine to my old ass eyes.

      Legally, and from watching the entire trial to date, the State has not met their burden of proof.

      • TA was found in the shower, sitting on top of blood in the bottom of the shower. Wouldn’t ya think they would have checked for the entire stall for blood?? Hard to believe they didn’t.

        • Yep.

    • Just because you’re passive aggressive doesn’t equate to you being a battered victim. Many victims feed off these disputes with their abusers. I don’t know about the gas cans but she did say something about tax deductions. If she premeditated this why kill him at 530 pm when his room mates can come in and hear this? She could’ve. Killed him in the morning when they were probably sleeping. That don’t hunt that’s all I’m gonna say…

      • I meant to say just because you’re passive aggressive that doesn’t mean you’re NOT a victim.

      • Don’t forget to add, why would you keep your receipts for you tax records.

        • Exactly, why would you keep receipts that would place you in a specific place at a precise time if you’re prememditating a murder?

      • Even better….. yesterday she talked about seeking out an area in the woods where they could act out Travis’ fantasy of tying her to a tree and videotape him having sex with her. Why not just go along with it and pop him in in the head out in the woods? So much easier and she wouldn’t have to clean up afterwords.

        • oh,Dog!excellent comment!never would have thought of it!yeah,the woods sounds like more ”convenient” place,no cleaning up needed,less evidence left behind meaning no carpet or walls to leave bloody fingerprints on,she could have staged it like a robbery or a serial killer’s doing.

          • Better yet do it in his bedroom but like DEXTER does an with the ATONEMENT neck slashing oh my would have been thought to be of the doctrine to go to heaven because he was sinning like crazy an had roommates even that obviously did not like it they moved out. The one even told Jodi to come on over with that chicken while he had to know Travis was with another woman. I still think he is the one that wrote that email to that other gf that was so religious. You can’t tell me some guys would think his GAME ON behavior was wrong not all men are PIGS. Some do have morals. Travis had none it was all a GAME to him DATING an getting them hooked an reeled in then releasing an moving on. An those women that do not want to tell the TRUTH they too will have to answer one day.

    • Ben–your analysis of the prosecution’s cross-examination and the methods he’s using to elicit testimony from Jodi is pretty accurate, I think. He genuinely does not believe in the amnesia, which is why he didn’t challenge it directly. Instead, he used her lack of memory, along with the photos and other physical evidence, to construct a narrative. Then he asked Jodi to concede to that narrative. She didn’t agree, of course, with each detail, but she did agree when she had no choice.

      I noticed, too, with Martinez, that he yells and bullies and twists Jodi’s words more when he’s making a feeble point. But, during cross about the actual killing, he really pulled back on those loud antics. Like he didn’t want her to get defensive.

      • Hello Pique,

        I guess you can see what I am getting at. I watched 23, 24, and 25 over and over. It became obvious that bringing up certain aspects of the death illicit an immediate emotional response. The emotional pain that Jodi experiences appears to be excruciating. And, the prosecutor’s methods seemed to be geared to the idea that she actually remembers the killing.

        To give a comparison, when she spoke to the detective, she simply asked, “Why would my handprint be there?” It was totally non-emotional, as though she had no clue. That would be consistent with a person having amnesia. But, if the prosecutor even mentions certain things, Jodi looks as though it is gut wrenching to think about, and she sometimes looks like she is on the verge of vomiting. As I tried to explain here, if this was a matter of amnesia, then she would be drawing a blank. Also, she did not say that she had true amnesia. Rather, she says that her mind was in a “fog”. This would be understandable if she had been in a state of shock. But, the details of what transpired while her mind was supposedly in a state of “fog”, and what transpired immediately afterwards, suggest that she was never in a state of shock, or even in a “fog”, and that everything was done with a considerable degree of calculation. For example, she said that she had a feeling that Travis was dead, afterwards. Yet, she also changed her own bloody clothes, and washed her own bloody hands, and disposed of weapons, after the “fog” had supposedly cleared. Then, when she met Ryan, everything was “hunky dory”, again. And, she said that she got confirmation of Travis’ death a few days later. If all of this is true, then shouldn’t finding oneself in the middle of the desert, in a different state (Arizona), with bloody clothes, bloody hands, bloody weapons, and a gun – shouldn’t this be cause for immediate concern, especially if one could not remember why one was there? I mean, most people would probably go straight to a hospital to try to figure out why all of the memories are gone. Coming to one’s senses in the middle of the desert, with blood all over the place, should be cause for extreme alarm, as well as a great deal of mental confusion. A person would think over and over again, “How did I get here, and what happened to my memories??? Did I suffer a stroke, or some other medical problem??? Why am I bloody?? Why do I have a gun?? Why am I here in the desert??” This alone could be enough to send a person into a state of shock. If tomorrow, at midday, I found myself in the Arizona desert, under these conditions, with no memory of how I got there, or why my clothes were bloody, I would probably have a heart attack, or some sort of mental breakdown. It is not normal to have huge gaps in one’s memory. It should be extremely disorienting.

        From what I can see, if the jury stops believing that Jodi had amnesia, and that she engaged in deceptive behavior before, and after, the killing, then they may end up seeing everything as one big smokescreen, designed to cover whatever really happened. And, if the jury reaches that point – which I think is now possible – then they may think that Jodi actually did deliberately murder Travis. Still, they may not think that it can actually be “proven”, given the lack of direct evidence.

        • “From what I can see, if the jury stops believing that Jodi had amnesia, and that she engaged in deceptive behavior before, and after, the killing, then they may end up seeing everything as one big smokescreen, designed to cover whatever really happened. And, if the jury reaches that point – which I think is now possible – then they may think that Jodi actually did deliberately murder Travis. Still, they may not think that it can actually be “proven”, given the lack of direct evidence.”

          If the jurors believe in the amnesia at all, Ben.

          I would think they’d be highly skeptical. Jodi insists on calling it a “fog”–perhaps because she isn’t allowed to diagnose herself with “amnesia”–but a “fog” still implies, as you’re saying, something different from a complete blank. My understanding of being in a fog is that you’re still there mentally, but that events take on a strange or surreal quality. Either misty and distantly unreal, or sharp and in-focus (“flashbulb” images) but without coherence, without the whole narrative. What Jodi describes as being in a fog is actually a complete blank:

          The gun goes off, he’s attacking her, and then nothing. There’s a big blank space. Next, she drops the knife on the tile floor, and hears the sound it makes. Then, nothing; a big blank space. Suddenly, she’s in the desert.

          After finding herself in the desert, then things actually become foggy: she recalls, but isn’t clear about, the process of cleaning up her hands and clothes, putting something on her bare feet, and getting rid of evidence in more than one place. She’s pretty sure something terrible has happened, but she’s not sure that when she left Travis, he was dead. Or, maybe she did think he was dead, but she didn’t want to believe it. This type of psychological denial sounds plausible.

          BUT, her denial, there in the desert, sounds less plausible next to the fact that we know that Jodi was NOT in denial when she did the clean-up. She knew, regardless of her state-of-mind, that it had to be done. And, even though the clean-up didn’t include taking the camera, she accomplished quite a lot in a short time: she got his body into the shower (yes, perhaps with the help of water on the floor) and washed him off; she collected the weapons, the rope, and her personal belongings; she looked at and deleted photos; she put a load of clothes and the camera in the washing machine; and last but not least, she got herself out of the house without being seen by anyone. Also, I’m inclined to believe that she had no blood on her hands when she left. Clearly, she washed Travis down, so she probably washed her own hands, too …

          So, yeah: what are the chances the jurors are taking her at her word about the amnesia? Sure, there’s no way to prove that someone does or does not remember, if they insist they don’t. But, the way Martinez coaxed her into agreeing on a probable narrative (supported by physical evidence), and the way he elicited emotional responses from her, got pretty close. A lot of doubt, I think, is hanging over her lack of memory.

          Still, to go from “she’s not telling the truth, or the whole truth, about what happened on June 4th” to “she planned out this killing” is a fairly large leap, isn’t it? I don’t know. The premeditation aspects don’t sound very strong. But, I do know what you mean about the the jury potentially viewing each individual instance of implausibility as one big smokescreen.

    • Concerning the blood splatter in the sink, it may have been caused by the gunshot itself.*High-velocity spatters are usually caused by gunshot wounds, although they can be caused by other weapons if the assailant exerts an extreme amount of force. They travel more than 100 feet per second and usually look like a fine spray of tiny droplets, less than one millimeter in diameter. Bullet wounds are unique because they can have both back and front spatters, or just back spatters. This depends on whether the bullet stopped after entering the victim’s body or traveled through it. In most cases, the back spatter is much smaller than the front spatter because the spatter travels in the direction of the bullet.*
      http://science.howstuffworks.com/bloodstain-pattern-analysis2.htm

      • Hello Debbie,

        In the photo of the sink, it looks like there are some larger puddles of blood, and a splattered area towards the back. In your opinion, what do you think caused the finer splatter? Maybe the gunshot, itself? According to Jodi, she fired the gun in the bedroom, some distance down the hallway, from the bathroom sink. If the photos show that Travis was dragged back through the hallway to the bathroom, then how could his blood have been sprayed up on the bathroom sink? I believe that Jodi did admit that the blood could only have been left by Travis standing over the sink. Since Jodi did admit this, then it looks like the prosecutor is going to say that her claim that Travis was inadvertently shot in the bedroom, is completely false. Here is the photo of the sink:

        http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2013/01/07/article-2258479-16CAC8B1000005DC-257_634x400.jpg

        Also, when the prosecutor first asked Jodi about this, it seemed as though she did not know. So, he showed her a photo of Travis, already dead. Then, he asked her whether she thought that he could have stood up over the sink, after he was dead. She said “no”. Just want to see what your thoughts are on this.

        • Hi Ben Jodi in fact stated that she ran out of the closet and back into the bathroom not the bedroom after she acquired the gun from the closet. She then stated that she pointed the gun with both hands at Travis but he wouldn’t stop and the gun went off. Yes I do pay very close attention. I am thinking that yes the blood splatter at least at the back of the sink/mirror area is in fact the result of the gun being fired.
          If she does not remember anything after the gun went off, how is she really supposed to know how the blood got in the sink? For Martinez to ask such a rhetorical question is just assinine on his part. The answer is of course he didn’t stand at the sink after he was dead you imbecile.
          Here is another fact for you to ponder: There were things in the washing machine along with the camera. A towel and a couple of socks had bleach stains on them,however nothing else had bleached out markings. How did that happen? If bleach does not go in to the water first as the water is filling, anything it touches will have bleached out markings, but it would not be limited to just a couple of items. What I would deduce from the fact that only three items(two socks and a towel ) had bleached out markings, is that bleach was not used on the day that this laundry was done.

          • “The answer is of course he didn’t stand at the sink after he was dead you imbecile.”

            OMG Debbie, loved loved love his. Comment of the day!

    • Ben, the defense is saying that the gas cans were filled (8.30 gallons) with the debit card and the
      the other two purchases were made with cash. Jodi first prepaid $40 on her car and that was 9.59 gallons and that never filled it up so she topped it off with 2.77 gallons after prepaying. So she put
      12.36 gallons in the car. She just filled the 5 gallon cans to a little over 4 gallons each so they wouldn’t leak out the top as they might if they are too full.

17. This is so refreshing…we are finally getting to see and hear the real Jodi!!!!

    WE ARE TEAM JODI – AND WE WILL BE VICTORIOUS.

18. How many are watching the trial on the AZ site?
    Are you having problems with the audio?

    Had to stop trying to listen yesterday…couldn’t make out what was being said 🙁

    Also, video & audio out of sync by a minute or at least it seems that way.
    Any solutions?

    • I am watching AZCentral link, but mine seemed to be working fine ysterday. Sorry, not much help;(

    • Goodmorning all!!! Lets hope Jodi has a good day today!!!

      • Hey LC!

      • Good morning LC!And go Nurminator and Jodi!

    • I still have the seal so it appears it hasn’t started yet.

      • Sorry hit send inadvertently…..but I didn’t have any sync issues yesterday watching on AZ.

    • Radaronline.com has it live too.

    • No problem with the voicing but the volume was very low.

      • The volume is low on azcentral. I use headphones I can hear it much better 🙂

    • I’ve been watching this AZCentral link from day one: http://www.azcentral.com/video/1724204566001. I have had one or two little glitches here and there – understandable considering the technology – but no major problems at all. Plus I can pause and rewind, which I do if I get a phone call or something. I have yet to miss a moment of testimony because of technical issues. (Though I admit I skipped some of the XE because I was too annoyed.)

      I admit I have a pretty fast internet connection. Perhaps your tech glitches are coming from your ISP, and not from AZCentral?

      • Thanks everyone!

        I’ll try Radar, but it could be my laptop, I guess.

        I’m no computer whiz for sure!! 🙂

19. I’ve been watching the entire trial, and I think it has only actually got started on time twice. Very frustrating……………….

    • How must Jodi feel, knowing that all these delays are keeping her in jail longer if she ends up being acquitted? Seems to me the only ones who benefit from the less-than-8-hour day, the late starts, and the hour-and-a-half lunch are the poor, overpaid attorneys and judge.

20. Off topic but boyfriend has gone fishing today, I don’t feel the need to wear a headset……hahaha

21. Okay, I’m here today. I’m very sick (deep-chest coughing, sinus infection, strep throat, Migraine, 103F fever), but I’m here. Don’t know how long I can listen or watch feed so somebody please update every now and then, okay? (MB, JC, Maria, TMiller, etc…) Totally missed all day yest.

    • oh, dear. Hope you feel better soon!

      • Thank you, lovely Bystander.

    • 🙁 feel better Ashley!

      • Muchas gracias, Maria.

    • Glad to see you back, sad to see you sick. Hope you feel better soon!

      Highlight of the day yesterday – Nurmi showed that Martinez spliced Jodi’s diary; Martinez then wanted to pretend the whole entries were fabrications! Right, as if.

      Then HLN wanted to pretend that Nurmi edited the phone sex tape, when the jury had already heard it in entirety. Go figure!

      • Whaaa…? Spliced her journal, as in he picked & chose which parts he wanted to highlight and ignored the parts he didn’t?

        • Yep!

22. Oh oh Kermit……more redacting caught by the Nurminator and you will be Nurminized again…lol

    • I know it’s so crazy how JM redacted her journal and text messages so she can appear as a different person.

      • crazy is putting it mildly!

23. Jodi’s looking rather on the thin side… Or is it just me? IMO, she looks a bit peckish.

    • IMO yes, but she looks better to me today than she did yesterday. Hope you get to feeling better.

      • TY so much, Jodie. So sweet of you

    • Yes she’s soooo thin. It’s probably stress..,

    • she’s lost a looot of weight,poor Jodi.

    • She does to me too. I wonder now all the time if she had lunch or supper. If she misses it they don’t care. I hope you feel better also Ashley. Jodi just looks so pale an thinner every day to me ;(

24. Oh boy, do you think the ankle biter will ask to voir dire the witness again and start his seizure like antics?

    • You called it.

      I wonder if he buys his suits in the boy’s department? Heh.

      • Definitely his shoes…..lmao

25. Martinez asking?

26. I figured out why Kermit never goes to the podium. The electronics that Nurmi uses to raise it doesn’t allow for it to lower than much….we could pitch in for a step stool to go in his ever growing basket.

27. What “No Objection” ?????

    Is he ill???

28. Yes, only positive and “Noteworthy” things you’d record in your journal to remember years later.

    • I personally have never kept journals, but I would guess that I would only note positive events or things I’d want to remember. Just saying.

29. JA still speaks of TA in the present tense.

    • yeah,like 90%of the time she talks about him.

30. ”i better check my watch;i might be testifying about this 5 years later” lol lol lo Nurmi!!!

    • Loved that statement!

    • too funny!

31. awww poor jodi, talking about Travis in the present tense…she is putting herself back there.

32. Travis youngest sister? How old is she?

    • I was thinking the same thing. She looks like she is about 10 yrs old.

      • She looks 10 but with a hair style of someone older

33. I am understanding this right – JM conveniently left out this portion of the journal entry on this day too?? Wow,!

    • That is how I’m taking it.

      A little scary that JM is suddenly being so quiet….unless at this point he wants JA’s re-direct complete and off the stand because they are poking so many holes and showing the deception in many exhibits that were presented to the jury. As much as the ankle biter irritates me, I wonder why the sudden quiet nature in the voir dire and not many objections. Any thoughts?

    • yeah,it appears so. Plus, the haters are gonna eat their hearts out that TA wanted to marry her and had proposed to her!! Did they even know a tiny part of him?I seriously doubt it!

      • Ya that was a great part there. I knew though when she said they had talked about names for baby’s at one time they had to talk about getting married too I would think. Being in that religion anyways I would think marriage comes first then baby’s a lot of baby’s all they can make to keep that church going strong funny how they do some things like the Catholics did at one time.

    • Yep, he sure did. I’m sure this isn’t the lowest level he’s stooped to yet, either.

34. Just was surprised in a good way Martinez wasn’t aggressive in his questioning! He’s aggressive all the time. Shocked right now.

    • I thought the exact same thing.

      • I find that to be an indicator of something…. Resignation he’s lost 1st degree from the table?

        • I could only hope, but it is hard to say when we are dealing with the likes of JM.

          • WOW!!!!! Truly revealing Travis didn’t want to spend time with family. After his friends paint him like a different person… No one really knew him and he had a double life. WOW!!! She wrote this back in January.

            • He’s rather get his rocks off, I’m sure. That was probably one of his priorities, not family.

35. I wish they would show the whole letter so we could read it!

36. Oh oh, objection on foundation, sustained on foundation, may I voir dire, yes, no objection….

37. Oh my, no objection. Scaring me how quiet Kermit is being! Maybe he’s afraid he has already dug himself a big enough hole that he can’t get out of (well for kermit that hole could be the size of a golf divet)

    • lol!!!

      Honestly I think he’s pouting. He introduced the diary and it’s biting him in the ass now. I wonder if he’s used to being up against a defense lawyer that calmly and methodically picks a part his case like a bad lego project.

      • Whoa…what’s up with pickleface? She is overuling Kermit…

        Maybe she isn’t as dumb or senile like I thought.

        • She seems to be in a better mood today too

      • objection and sidebar….just when I thought Martinez may have been shot in the ass with a tranquilizer gun this morning….

        • HAHAHAHA!!!!

        • Haha I know! I guess he forgot his coffee this morning?

          • With Kermit’s size I wonder if he would take 2 1/2 hour energy drinks versus the 5 hour. Any thoughts….lol.

        • I missed today’s testimony so i’m listening right now and reading the comments to go along with it. This comment cracked me up! Maria you are so fun!

38. T-Dog? Really? What a loser.

    • Yep, lame, lame!

      • does it mean anything?i cant figure it out by myself(any help for ur greek friend? 🙂 )

        • It means he was an idiot.

        • Maybe Top Dog

          • Trampy dog….who knows. He was so warped

            • thanx Jodi!

        • Guys in their 20 and 30s sometimes take the initial and then add dog to the end. I would be J-dog. I think it stems from Snoop Dog.

    • yeah Michael L, I think it was on his myspace at one point too…maybe it goes along with the “game on” dating?

39. Thank God that jack ass JM drug these journal entries in! Total backfire! LOVE IT!!!!!

40. Travis’s estranged brother with the Elvis Lip… Seriously? He’s still doing this?

    • I noticed that! Creepy upper lip thing going on…

      • creeper lip lol

    • Listen, I’m all for discussing the trial and Jodi’s innocence, but regardless of TA’s actions and the resulting situation, we shouldn’t be taking jabs at the family. It’s not fair. We need to reserve some of that empathy we have for Jodi for them… this is a ROTTEN situation for EVERYONE.

      • Well, in case you missed it this is a Jodi support page, so while I actually DO have empathy for them on the loss of their brother..I am not enlightened enough to NOT enjoy making fun of everyone on the pro prosecution side, which includes his family, Kermit, and Gloria Esteban.

        The things they say about Jodi are WAY worse.

        We are not calling for needles of death to be put in their arms, are we?

        • I agree ! an I do not see anyone on other NEWS pages where you can COMMENT stand up for JODI but I do see them saying very UGLY things about JODI an her entire FAMILY an no one says oh stop that. That is not nice. Really ? this page is pretty decent compared to the others from what I have read. An if you DO HAPPEN to go comment of your OPINION on those other pages you are HOUNDED called HORRIBLE names by some stating they are RELIGIOUS which truly DISGUSTS ME. Some are even sent nasty EMAILS by the other side. I could go on. But to each his own if you don’t like what you READ go somewhere else that is WHAT I DID I came here !

        • Yeah, no doubt. I don’t see them asking the Alexander clan to conduct themselves respectfully in a courtroom either.

          If they want to see bullying, they should go to the pro-pros side that thinks rape is awesome and totally acceptable in a relationship.

          • i dont see our comments as being bullying.i believe all people here have a great sense of humor,trying to give a funny twist.The pro-pros sites have comments that have made my skin crawl,hair-rising blood thirsty comments,name calling,swearing,real hatred,i mean scary scary stuff!
            We have all stated from the get go of this trial that we toatally feel for their loss.If (and I repeat IF)we get off the line sometimes it’s because it’s like a defense mechanism imho,because we’ve been exposed to this sh*t for a long time,watching Jodi being dragged thru the mad(to put it mildly)both in the courtroom and on the media,so sometimes here is the only safe place to feel uncensored.

            • I don’t go to the pro-pros site, but I read what is reported here and it is downright disgusting.

      • I agree. And even jabs at the prosecutor sometimes goes waaaay too far on this page. He is just doing his job whether you like him or not.
        I come to this page to get civil conversation, not to read bullying comments. In essence you are doing just what the other side is doing.
        Thank you.

        • Your welcome. JM is not “just doing his job” as Nurmi shows poking holes into his cross. JM presented exhibits that were not in full context as he presented, he got TA’s letters to stay out based on the Hughes’ known lying statements, JM’s office worked with the Hughes when they knew they were on the witness list and didn’t advise them to avoid media coverage, JM’s lead investigator Flores outright lied and he allowed that to stand and I could go on.

          JM is trying to win a high profile case at all costs. For him, the ends justify the means, so that is why you see a push back.

          • Exactly. Martinez is a public servant who should, for all intents and purposes be doing his job to the best of his ability, as honestly as possible. The man shows no integrity by splicing Jodi’s journal and claiming the rest of it is fabricated.

            Nothing that has been said here comes anywhere close to the depraved vulgarity of the pro-pros side.

            But hey – I have come to expect whining every time the defense is making headway. They never come here to tell us how “mean” we are when they think the prosecution kicked ass (even though the Martinez clearly did not kick ass, but dug himself to a level lower than before).

        • I personally don’t post derogatory comments about Travis’ family because I don’t like it when the pro-pros sites do it to Jodi’s family. These people are all just bystanders.

          Martinez? Eh, I don’t care. He’s pursuing death when it’s not warranted and is only concerned about racking up another win for his record. He’s fair game…a few height and voice jokes aren’t going to kill him.

          • I thought in a trial, families aren’t suppose to show emotion. A friend, whose sister was murdered was told that as the family while in court they weren’t allowed to show any emotion. I think this family has been given a lot of leeway by the judge.

      • I agree Joseph

    • I seen that yesterday an had to look closer he does do that it is creepy !!

    • Yes lol I expected him to stand up and start singing “I ain’t nothing but a hound dog…”

    • Looks like John Black from Days of Our Lives with all those lip curls and eye brow wiggles. Driving me crazy actually.

41. Does anyone else find it odd that the younger sister of Travis is in court instead of school? I guess she could be home schooled, but it looks like they are trying to garner sympathy to me. Would you expose someone so young to some of the testimony you know could be presented in this case? Just saying.

    • Her name is Hillary Wilcox. I don’t think she is that young. I believe she is married and has a child from the looks of her FB page.

      • Yep…she looks young but she’s an adult. Same with me…I’m 37 and get mistaken for a college student at times.

    • Yes, I thought the same thing. Since the eye rolls, smirks, sneers, and glares aren’t working, let’s bring in lil sister with a headband flower in her hair to elicit the proper reaction.

      I wonder how old she is though?

42. I had to step out for about an hour, what in the world did I miss? Someone pls give me the highlights

    • Just going over some more journal entries that Martinez butchered to prop up his joke of a case.

      • Just now watching the “highlighted” portions of the journal. WOW so Farty Marty really chopped up that journal didn’t he?

        • Soooo just because she didnt date the 2nd entry, hes going to claim it wasnt actually written on that date? Yes, she held a space and filled it in later just in case she needed to plant some evidence.

43. Is there any other place than HLN that I can watch? I’m really getting tired of the every two minute commercial breaks????

    • yes tanne i usually watch either here http://www.azcentral.com/community/mesa/articles/20130225jodi-arias-murder-trial-arizona-live-video.html
      or here http://www.wptv.com/generic/news/national/Jodi-Arias-trial-live-video

      • ” Your comment is awaiting moderation.” lol i didnt write that!! typo elves???

        • …. 🙂

          ’nuff said. lol

    • Try the link at the top of this page.

    • Thanks guys! Can’t stand HLN and In Session stopped airing without warning and they were only sub-par. =)

44. I saw something again about car rentals. I meant to post this a while ago but I did a quick check for car rentals in Yreka. There is a listing for 33 car rental establishments that service Yreka. BUT, other than 1 Hertz outlet the rest are in Redding or even further away. As a business traveler I can tell you Hertz is normally the costliest place to rent a car, even at major airports. In a one horse town like Yreka they are probably cost prohibitive and only for emergencies.

    I wonder if Nurmi’s going to bring this out.

    In my opinion he needs to chip away at each little thing he can.

    • Totally agree, since Martinez thinks Jodi driving an hour in the direction that she intended to go in the first place is somehow proof of something nefarious.

      • And he’s doing it now!

45. Just got in.
    Who is the young woman sitting next to TA’s clenched jaw brother? She looks like a good obedient Mormon girl feeling sorry for Jodi, perhaps thinking ‘omg this could be me’

    • TA’s younger sister.

46. Radaronline is working great!!

    Volume is loud enough, no choppy audio and video & audio are in sync 🙂

    Thanks for the suggestion!

47. Just added road rage to Travis character… I had guessed it already, along smacking girlfriend while she is driving

48. oh,see???she’s not that stupis as the haters(and the prosecution)tried to portray her!IF she wanted she could have taken any of these non registerd guns from her father Matt etc.WHY bother staging a robbery which could be totally traceable??

    • Ευχαριστώ, Maria!

      • Ashley!!! You’re too sweet***

49. This trial has captivated me, and I have read posts on this site with great interest, particularly those regarding Domestic Violence, which is at the core of this trial. I am well educated and have a College degree with a minor in Criminology. I also have 30 years experience as a Social Worker. I say this, to point out that supporters of Jodi are not the ignorant, uneducated folks that the media portray us to be.

    That being said, I want to commend those on this site who have shared their own experiences as victims of Domestic abuse. You are courageous, and are helping shed light on this misunderstood and still well hidden crime, that is plagueing our society. So glad you made it out alive as so many don’t . The incidence of DV is increasing at alarming rates! So many beautiful young women with bright futures are being murdered by “nice” men who outwardly appear so loving, accomplished and decent, while on the inside are abusive, controlling, troubled people who calously take the lives of the women they are in relationships with. A recent case in NYS, where a beautiful young woman was beaten to death in her college dorm room by her boyfriend, is a heartbreaking prime example.

    The more I hear Jodi on the stand, and hear Travis via his text messages and recorded phone call, the more I believe that Jodi acted in self defense and was one of those who fortunately made it out alive.

    I encourage all of those who are supporting Jodi to continue to shine the light on Domestic Violence and become involved in community efforts to educate our young people on the issue of DV, so tragedies like this will become obsolete.

    • Amen!
      Moreover it looks from the questions raised in this forum that the investigation was very flawed, witnesses and leads not followed, that what occurred that day between 5:32pm and 6pm, all the cleaning except for Jodi’s palm print, and the following 5 days, the 911 call, etc, who would want to kill Travis, his job, all these Prepaid Legal Mormon employees of that pyramid scheme going on TV to trash Jodi their ex-employee who had been brought into their fold by Travis…. None investigated.
      There is reasonable doubt to think that she either brainwashed to participate in his killing or was framed for it, and that she is as innocent as a lamb brought to slaughter.

    • Great post, TR! I think social workers who speak up are just as brave. You have the experience and research knowledge to back-up what happens in DV.

      • Thank you Sam. I’m sure Dr. Drew would disagree:) However, I sent him an email asking several relevant questions and have not had a reply.

        • That’s because Dr. Drew couldn’t answer a relevant question to save his life.

50. Nurmi is doing a good job of hitting all the points JM hit on on cross.

51. For folks looking for places to watch try this:
    http://www.wptv.com/generic/news/national/Jodi-Arias-trial-live-video

52. Just found this site today. I have been watching the trial and reading comments from other pages. I would get so aggravated that no one was posting any thoughts that I was thinking. I was beginning to feel like I was the only one that believed that there was more to the story then the other places was pages was showing. Thanks for having a place where I can read something that doesn’t make me want to scream!

    • welcome Crystal! this site is a blessing to us all**

    • I know how you feel Crystal I just happen to come across this site by Google I was looking for anyone that thought maybe there was more to this case then BURN JODI. Every news page I went too was horrible no one would even think about maybe Travis was not a saint. But Jodi deserved to DIE an they all want to watch. I agree with the Death Penalty but not in a case such as this. Some people were even going so far to say she was a Serial Killer ? it was beyond ridiculous. Glad you found this site.

53. Ughh…just an observation….does anyone else find Nurmi’s SLLLOOOWWWW method of speaking and asking questions annoying??? OMG, he takes a full 2 or 3 seconds in between words in 1 sentence. Between that and starting to ask something and then saying, Ok, but before I ask you that, let’s go back to this”…..ughh. At this point, IMHO, he needs to move it along!!! get to the actual date of June 4th, he is going to lose the jury in all this. He has already gone over everything prior that he needs to, if I am on this jury I would be getting irritated at him, (she doesn’t need that) and would want to hear about June 8th and then the experts. No more diary stuff, sex talk, etc…..get her off the stand already.

    • He has to poke holes in everything, as he has, that JM represented to the jury on cross. For example, the journals that were redacted by JM that changed the intent of the totality of her words. Everything Nurmi is going through slowly and methodically is to show there was no premeditation in JA’s actions leading up to and through June 4th. What she did after June 4th really doesn’t mean a damn thing really since JA was already dead.

      She defended herself and freaked out.

      • I agree with you, Jodie. This HAS to be done, Nurmi has to clear it up n if i was a juror, id be understanding of this process that Nurmi is going through with the journal. Of course not everyone is the same n im sure there are jurors that might find it tedious n SLLLOOOOWWWW, but there are also jurors that want to know n see evvveerryyyyy single thing.

        • I would rather have a Doctor that took his time an explained everything to me than a Doctor like JM that flew through it an out the door I go wondering WTH did he just say. I think the same goes for Lawyers. I think most people are that way. This is about DEATH PENALTY her LIFE is on the LINE here she deserves the slow process not the wham bam thank you maam she has had that too much in her life I think. I fired several lawyers that acted like JM I do not like it some people do but I do not. To each his own like they say.

    • “does anyone else find Nurmi’s SLLLOOOWWWW method of speaking and asking questions annoying???

      NO.

      • I don’t find it annoying, in fact he could be over playing the patient form of examination, in order to highlight the State’s hyper freak out form of examination, making JM look like an idiot with a lot to hide.

    • I often wonder about that too. However, I think JM threw up so much smoke that Nurmi needs to go through and debunk that stuff in a methodical manner. If he can, and he seems to be doing that, I suspect the jury will hang in there with him. I think he should lay of any more of the touchy feely stuff and get to the facts. As Friday would say “All we want are the facts Ma’am.”

      He also needs to shake Jodi up. She just doesn’t seem to give up on this “TA was a gem” nonsense. On the other hand that may be just what the jury needs to see. The sheer absurdity of the situation may explain why she hung in there with TA. There is something basically awry on both sides in a relationship such as this.

      • Al I can also see how she still helps TA look like such a nice person. WHY??!! Theres been quite a few times that Nurmi sets her up with a question and again, Jodis fails to answer in a way that would help her out. I would imagine Nurmi went over most of these questions with her. Idk maybe its because she rather say the whole truth or like you mentioned, purposely done for the jury to see. But its clear to me that she could’ve bashed or made TA look like a bigger D*** then what he was IF sge wanted to.

        • LC that’s annoying because poor Nurmi she has to wake up.

        • Jodi still loves Travis. She hasn’t broken out of the toxic cycle even though he’s not here anymore. It’s sad.

        • I think there is a reason for this. The expert in battered women will testify, and what she says will support the way that Jodi is protecting Travis. Could be that the defense is well aware of this and that they are not frustrated with Jodi at all for her answers, but actually highlighting this part of her so that the expert’s testimony “fits”.

          Jodi is so truthful too. She could have denied remembering dropping the knife, and that would have left the door open for other possible suspects being there. I think this statement she made shows that she will tell the truth now, no matter what.

    • Don’t under-estimate the jury. If you were one of them and Jodi’s life was in your hands, you would pay careful attention, may be snooze once or twice, but at deliberation you would want to review all the details. Including all her journal’s entries that the prosecutor’s threw in her face in a staged tantrum in two minutes claiming it proved there was no abuse, all the so-called evidence of premeditation brought by prosecution that are being debunked right now.

      • Exactly. Martinez opened that door by splicing the journal and waving it around like it proves something. So Nurmi, being a competent lawyer, is showing his tactics for what they really are.

    • personally,I prefer Nurmi’s style than Martinez’s.With Nurmi I dont get a headache,I dont wanna slap him,I dont wanna scream at the screen”hey,you’re biased,a misogynist and bashing the witness”If I were Nurmi and knew this woman’s life and the trial’s outcome were in my hands I would make sure to be as meticulous,analytical and methodical as possible.This is not a show or a movie for us to get bored just because it isnt fast and entertaining.This is a real trial.Let him do his job,Im sure he knows better than us.

      • Your so right Maria, I always like your comments, by the way. I wish people would understand this is NOT a live TV show, this is so sad… it is also a very hard case for Nurmi. I can’t imagine the pressure he is under. This is HIS career n on top of this case being so screwd up before it was given to him, he also knows the media n half of the word is watching n listening to everything his doing. If he losses this case, he didnt do ANYTHING wrong, it is the public n media that have played n screwd with this case. People need to realize that this can happen to anyone n it is not fair to rush through something this important (death n life) for public amusements.

      • I do, too. I could hardly watch Martinez all last week; he was so spastic jumping from one subject to the next, up and down and round and round in circles… I LITERALLY ended up with a headache every single day, and some days even nauseated. I often had to take breaks from him.

      • Maria Me Too Martinez voice is too high pitched strident irritating!!

    • yes, i agree.. i think its time jodi gets off the stand.. she looks exhausted, poor thing.. and im also afraid the jury is going to lose focus.. put the experts up and let her rest!

    • Nope, not me either……
      =)

    • No, it’s not annoying to me. Let him go over everything the jury needs to be clear about. This being a deat penalty case the jury has the responsibility to sit there and listen … her life is being decided and she deserves a fair trial.

    • Nurmi’s voice doesn’t bother me. Martinez’ voice grates on my last nerve. I dread when he speaks.

54. As it relates to premeditated murder here is some of the craziness we are to believe:

    she rented a car in her name
    she hung the license plate upside down (don’t know how this would be incognito)
    she burglarized her grandparents home to get a gun (traceable back to her)
    she told people she was going to Mesa
    she used debit cards in her name to get gas and kept the receipts (wanted to make sure she would still be able to make accurate tax records – that would be my thought process in route to a murder)
    she stopped to get her nails done (don’t want to have a chipped nail)

    Of course the list goes on…and this is some of the NON-evidence the state wants to use to put somebody to death.

    • That would be my exact worries too, the tax from the gas used & my nails!!! Lol

    • Right, as if there’s no standard of critical thinking when someone’s life is hanging in the balance.

      Oh, and also that she was on her way to see a potential romantic interest too.

55. I’m so glad her lawyer is going over all these mundane details that took place that day. If a person is planning to kill someone, especially a person with no history of violence, would they carry on with average activities like get their nails done?! My husband and I both say, if you have made up your mind to kill someone you go and get it done! You don’t dilly-dally along the way like she did. That’s what bothered me about the prosecutions theory all along. Not to mention spend time sleeping with and having sex with your victim, knowing you are going to kill them. IMO!

    • and waiting until 5:30pm to start killing when you know the tenant is coming back from work at 6pm

      • I agree, this is what the jury should be
        Considering when deciding on premed.
        It doesn’t seem plausible knowing this.

        • I know! You would have to be a REAL psycho with very obvious signs of mental illness to be able to do that. And she doesn’t show any psychosis whatsoever now….which would show if she was that mentally disturbed. It doesn’t go away for court. LOL IMO, she snapped when she was attacked and with a ‘fight or flight’ being her only options, and instantly knowing flight wasn’t going to work, she had the instinctive nature we all have to fight, kick in. I remember one time my husband was so angry with me for weeks, treat me with abusive speech to the extent that I snapped and started swinging and pounded on him relentlessly. Fortunately for me, he would never hit me so he just took it. But he also reevaluated how he was treating me and stopped being cruel. I was in a blind rage that was uncontrollable. Not that Jodi was in a rage, but rather in terror, I can see how she could blindly react uncontrollably with nothing but survival at all cost motivating her.

      • Exactly! She had all night and morning to kill him if it was part of a plan.

    • Were the roommates at home when Jodi arrived at 4am?

56. I’ve read this website daily since the beginning.
    It was a relief to find intellectual debate that assumes
    Innocents until proven guilty. Having served on 3 juries
    I have found this is essential in our justice system.
    That being said I have many questions and have found this
    Site very helpful. Thank you for keeping us all informed!

57. MB – Team Jodi says:
    March 5, 2013 at 1:51 pm
    “……..Exactly. Martinez is a public servant who should, for all intents and purposes be doing his job to the best of his ability, as honestly as possible. The man shows no integrity by splicing Jodi’s journal and pretending the rest of it is fabricated….”

    Can I ask though, why Mr. Nurmi can splice together an audio recording and it is just fine and justifiable, but if Mr. Martinez does it, it shows no integrity.

    Seems hypocritical to me. Just sayin.’

    • I agree. Both men are doing their jobs. Even though I support Jodi, I don’t think either are doing a poor job or being unfair. It’s up to the jury to suss through this information and come to the same conclusion we all have. Have faith. 🙂

    • He did not SPLICE the recording we already heard that tape all together ?? he just put the statements that TRAVIS said apart to those that only want to hear JODI an nothing else an there are many out there. It is like they did not even hear Travis at all an some even say he was reading a script that Jodi wrote for him it is ridiculous. I knew from being around men in jobs I worked all my life that were predominately male workers as in out of 100 workers I was a woman…………that that voice was a conceited very demanding man. Some people only hear what they want to hear so it made sense to me to do that.

    • No, it’s not hypocritical. The jury had already heard the sex tape in entirety, whereas the jury did not see the journal in entirety before Martinez cut it up into chunks to support his theory.

      Funny how you didn’t mention that.

      • Then by this logic, the jury hasn’t seen/heard the ENTIRE journal then, and ALL of it should be read to the jurors.

        Who do you vote to read the entire journal, cover to cover?

        • I agree, perhaps the WHOLE journal should be let in…..maybe it would shed more light on the type of woman Jodi really is/was.

          • Yes, the WHOLE journal — and Travis’ letters — should have been evidence. So much and so many witnesses were cut out, investigation not done.

            The ‘Jodi stalker’ theory was not allowed though, was hearsay from Travis supposedly having said it before he died, and repeated on TV shows ad nauseum by witch burning commentators who invite Travis’ so-called Mormon friends from Prepaid Legal to say it over and over.

          • I expect the journals to be available to the jury in their entirety. Remember, Nurmi and maybe JM did actually enter the complete journals into the record as an exhibit. All evidentiary exhibits are available to the jury for their review.

        • I vote yes!! Bring on the whole journal.

          And while we are at it, let’s bring on Travis’ journal!!!

          • I was thrilled to see/hear “he makes me sick”, etc. That she “CAN NOT” marry him, that there was DEFINITELY something ODD with him. I think it helps her a lot.

            Jesus God, as I type this I hear Vinnie refer to the journal as obsession, really?. STFU!!! How can they twist it. Am I the only one the understands ENGLISH?

            • lol apparently!

          • And his letters.

          • this might be a stupid question, probably is, but did travis have a journal?

          • YES WHERE IS HIS JOURNAL COMPUTER & GIRLFRIEND there is Deanna on FB with all his pics as if she was his GF

          • Oh that’ll be hilarious!

            Diary Entry #223984

            “I am so fabulous, I should start a sperm bank to propogate my awesomeness. The world would thank me. Sincerely, T-Dog.”

        • If Martinez is going to use particular entries, he should be using the ENTIRE entries; not cutting out what he wants the jury to hear and what he doesn’t.

          I don’t understand why this is so hard for you to understand.

          Oh, that’s right. The defense is having a good day, so you’re here to stir the pot.

          • Right on the money MB 🙂

            • And also, when Nurmi introduced the sex tape he did not splice it to protect Jodi. Jodi had to face the music for her part in the whole thing; even though she was participating just to please Travis.

              Yet I don’t see WhaDoo pointing that out either.

          • …

            • if you say anything even remotely questioning on the travis support site, you are not only blocked, but people threaten to kill you and they call you terrible names.

              • True dat

              • And the admins tell people how to think such as by posting things like, ” there was no camera dropping friends, that is a lie!!!” Yes we are pro defense here but I observe many varying theories about this case.

            • WhaDoo,

              We aren’t all the same on here. I think this place is mostly nice.

              I agree with your post. I was surprised Nurmi was allowed to enter the spliced-together audio. When I watched how he proceeded with it – by stopping after each piece and asking Jodi questions, it seemed a little better. I think it’s good that it’s not entered into evidence since it is spliced audio. I didn’t have problems with Martinez selecting portions of Jodi’s journal, since the defense could do the same.

              I wonder if the jury will get to see the entire contents of the journal?

              • I don’t have a problem with either side using “portions” of an entire document to make a point, but it’s the deliberate deleting of a section of that portion that is wrong. If you are using a specific dated journal entry, use the entire entry for that date. Not two sentences that suits your cause and twists the truth. Just my opinion……

              • The reason Nurmi did that was because Martinez did that, and also in response to Jodi being the instigator. The other reason is Travis voice was not very clear muffled so he wanted show what Travis said. I think he was right in responding to Martinez twisted version and also the muffled voice of Travis.

              • Directed to nobody in particular, I want to point this out:

                When Nurmi admitted the sex tape into evidence, it was admitted in entirety. So when they were played the spliced clips, they at least knew a reference of context to put Travis’ words into – and they were fully aware of Jodi’s part in the whole thing.

                When Martinez admitted the journal entries, the jury in fact did NOT have a reference of context to understand her statements.

                I find it interesting that the pro-pros think it’s ok for Martinez to cut up Jodi’s journal for the jury without the benefit of understanding the entries in entirety; but then get all butt hurt when Nurmi spliced clips, added subtitles; so he could address each one when the jury has already heard the tape in entirety. Seems the hypocrisy is the other way around.

                Ok, I’m done. Back to your regularly scheduled program…

                • Hi MB.

                  I think it works to the defense’s favour that Martinez read only portions though. It gives the defense a chance to show the jury that he had pulled portions out. I think just about everything Martinez does works in favour of the defense though.

                  I’m not a fan of attorneys being allowed to alter evidence. It appears shady, imo. I didn’t think Nurmi needed to pull sections of the audio out because it was powerful enough as it stood. This is where I think the judge is failing to do her duty. As much as I adore the Nurminator, I think he should go faster and be more confident that he’s already won this case.

            • lol WHOA WhaDoo, calm down now! Remember you’re the one who opened the door to having your own points refuted by copying and pasting my comment and accusing me of being a hypocrite. If you can’t take the heat, get out of the kitchen.

              • …

                • Accusing someone of being a hypocrite is not an “observation.” Most reasonable people will deduce that’s a surefire way to start an argument, so when I say “shit stirrer” it is an accurate assessment not a personal attack. Lucky for you, I’m not interested in excising your opinion in entirety, I have better things to do with my life.

              • That poster has been trolling for a while now – yeah, I said it. He/she only shows up to be argumentative or to whine about how mean everyone is.

          • agree MB,dont listen to them.
            what is up with Nurmi splicing the tape?he did NOT,that tape was played from beginning to end days ago,now it was Nurmi’s turn to subtitle it just in case TA’s voice/words were not clearly understood,since Martinez tried to portray him as a virgin,never having jacked off in his life for crying out loud!!!It’s NOT then same as cutting and pasting a journal to fit one’s theory of stalking or twisting around their words as JM did.And what’s this nonsense with people wanting to listen to the ENTIRE journal?Umm ,if she writes about taking her dog for a walk or going to the supermarket or having a tiring day at work,no thank you I dont wanna hear about that,nothing to do with the case!Martinez broght these entris into the trial he should at least have the integrity to NOT cut and paste.Now that Nurmis is ”forced” to read out whole parts of the journal people find him boring.Well,if Kermit had played by the rules,we wouldnt have to listen to the word journal again.But…here we are!

            • Yes, exactly, Martinez keeps opening the doors so Nurmi is walking right on in and pointing out his shenanigans. It’s not Nurmi’s fault Martinez is relying on character assassination instead of evidence to prove his case; and that his claims are so easily refuted.

              I’m not sure I want to hear the entire journal either, especially Travis’ where god only knows how much self-aggrandizement takes place. Martinez makes himself look foolish by bringing in the journal entries anyway, because most people know that just having a diary doesn’t mean people write everything in them. He makes himself look worse by cutting and pasting certain statements and pretending the rest is “made up” by the defense. So I’m not worried about the journal, I just think it’s laughable that the pro-pros are upset with Nurmi about the sex tape when Martinez was doing it all along with the journal.

              • its totally fair that nurmi was allowed to do this! i, for one, had a hard time understanding exactly what travis was saying when they originally played the audio.. it’s important that the jury hear every word that travis said to jodi during that converstaion, and without the splicing of the phone converstation, the jurors might have missed some very disturbing things that came out of travis’s mouth..

58. HAHA. I can’t watch live, I can see twitter with my tablet. I just found “itsjustme” on there. Their true anti-Jodi colors are showing through!!!

    • “Wish she’d admit”I went there to give him1 last chance to be with me or he wasn’t going to be with any1els”

      Yeah, there’s a reason why I don’t normally talk to haters or pretend that their points have any meaningful impact on this case. Because they just come here to start trouble, then go back to wherever they came from to talk their shit.

      • yes MB, they are “shit stirrers”, right?

        • I think most identify their own doings and slutting with Travis’ abuse and are trying to cleanse themselves by painting him as a martyr and Jodi as an evil murderous entrapping whore.

      • Another great day so far, IMO, for the defense. You can always tell when the haters pop up to stir shit. I’m with you, MB, I ignore them once I figure out they don’t want to discuss, only argue and insult. Most of them here you can always tell they spend their days on the hater sites then come here and expect us to reason with them, convince them of WHY? A waste of time.
        We here have already picked our team, after all, the site is called, JODI IS INNOCENT. If I wanted to fight with ignorant witch hunters, I would be on facebook or HLN.
        Like someone said earlier, we were being just as bad as the hater sites by poking fun, at least we are not wanting to have some one put to death, even before a trial. I DARE to go on FACEBOOK and have some psycho threaten my family.

      • Anyone who believes that theory should head to the pro-pros boards. This isn’t a freaking LIfetime movie with an “If I can’t have you, NO ONE CAN!” plot.

59. I was thinking about the bullet casing. They say the shot couldn’t have been first, because it landed on blood. But if it were laying on dry tile, and there was a struggle for Jodi’s life, including loss of Travis’ blood, couldn’t it have EASILY at some point later been inadvertently kicked and then slid across the floor thereby landing on blood?

    • Yes HRS, I have argued with the pro prosecution people who come on here about that very thing. I have firearms experience and absolutely the shell casing could have bounced to the final landing place.

      Empty shells are very light and bouncy on tile and concrete. Just try sweeping a bunch on them up, or stepping on them wrong..

      • I may have missed some things in the beginning but where is all the forensic discussion in this case? I would think they would have dissected the spatter patterns and blood and fiber eveidence to death until we were all ready to scream? It seems to me that there is little presented. This forum is the only one discussing the trajectory and depth of the back wounds. Where is the EXPERT that can make sense of this crime scene? And they didn’t tear the car apart because some local yokel cleaned it? People have been convicted based on forensic evidence that TRIED to erase evidence from a car. This dude was certainly some minimum wage guy who hit it with a rag and a wet vac and declared it good to go. And it amazes me that I hear nothing of unidentified or foreign DNA being found in his room or bathroom. There were other people there….heck he was the stud right? They have focused solely on Jodi and can’t see the forest for the trees!

        • You would think we’d hear analysis like that……..but it’s hard when they narrowed in on one suspect(which they were directed to) and never looked past her.

      • Or she could’ve kicked it when she left in a hurry. I missed the part where she explains how she left the house. But if she left in a hurry she could’ve kicked it and not even noticed it, and it lands on top of a puddle of blood.

    • You are exactly right BeeCee. Anyone who has any experience with firing a gun knows the casings, even the larger ones easily bounce all over. I don’t give too much weight to the ultimate location of the casing.

60. Are we changing to an afternoon session today?

    • Yes we are — just added…
      SJ
      Team Jodi

61. the live feed is black?

    • Mine too

62. Why does everyone make fun of everybody you do not agree with on the other side?

    • Because it seems most of the people on the “other” side are incapable of having a civil discussion or listening to the facts as they are being documented by the court so all they do is insult, threaten and belittle those that support Jodi’s position.

    • Lighten up.

63. Ms. Arias, would you have tried to put $40 worth of gas in to two gas cans that are already full?

    “No, that makes no sense”

    Translation: Mr. Martinez, you’re an idiot. Choke on that one!

    • There are three main goals people subconsciously seek.
      They are: 1. Symbolic rewards 2. Material gains 3. Security.

      We all have the need for symbolic rewards, such as recognition and praise. Everybody wants to feel important and special. The act of praising and recognizing another is a strong motivator. Always reward good deeds with praise, and give positive, constructive criticism for bad deeds. If you are patient, in time you will see the results of your compliments. This is especially true of children and younger people. They are emotionally fed by this and it bolsters their sense of self.

      Material rewards mean a lot to people, whether they realize it or not. In any capitalist society, a person’s status is judged by their material gains. Therefore, since money produces material gain, it is a strong motivator, and its presence can have a strong influence on others. We are all motivated by a fiscal gain.
      Everyone needs security and stability. Security is attained when people feel they belong and are needed by others. People want security in their jobs, friends, family, etc. There are many ways to increase other people’s feelings of security.

      Lastly, I have solved many arguments just by listening. It may be hard to believe, but it really works. It works when someone is trying to get their point across to you, and when they are yelling and telling you how right they are. Even if the argument is meaningless, people want to know that they have been heard and understood.

      • I’m not getting the relevance?

        ps I’m a minimalist, material items are not important to all… =o)

        • It’s just some of my thoughts and opinions to a question posed by Marc “Why does everyone make fun of everybody you do not agree with on the other side”? Sorry for the musings and meanderings…

          • Ok I understand, I thought maybe your response had been posted under my comment by mistake. I just didn’t get the relevance to my comment… =o)

    • I thought that the reason she borrowed gas cans was so she could fill up in some other state than California since the gas was cheaper.

64. Nurmi is awesome, but his tie is really distracting me today. It’s like an optical illusion.

    • Maybe Van Gogh painting is more appropriate…

65. Oh brother, what now??

66. I’m still stuck on the bullet issue.

    I was thinking about it last night at work, and if Jodi shot Travis last; it makes no sense that she would shoot him right above the eyebrow to make sure he’s dead. It’s questionable that the bullet even passed through the brain.

    http://blinkoncrime.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/01/Alexander-projectile-xray.gif

    If he were bled out and laying still, like the medical examiner said, she’d have ample time to aim for a more effective kill shot.

    • Exactly..

    • You said it. This was not an execution shot.

      • Think about this. Every stereo typical coup d’grace is a shot to the temple. Given an inexperienced “assassin” if the guy was down that is where he would have shot. And it would have been from point blank range. That shot, being where it is makes sense only as a chance shot or a miss.

      • I always thought a execution SHOT was right between the EYES or from the TOP of the HEAD DOWNWARDS or in the BACK OF THE HEAD in the middle but not from the EYEBROW maybe from temple to temple like in some suicide attempts which many fail at with a small cal gun.

    • If you’re to believe forensics, the shot was fired last- after the throat slitting and stabbing. He was dead, so you’re right, it wasn’t an execution shot. Jodi’s story however is more plausible, that she shot him as he charged, head down- thus explaining the trajectory.

      • The ME’s point of the shot incapacitating him is just bunk. We’ve put that one to rest a while ago with all sorts of discussions and links to web sites that document people carrying on after similar shots, etc.

        That was just an ipso facto twist to make it fit their story, with good old Esteban falling on his sword and taking one for the team. Bet he’s seething.

        • Right, and I’ve been posting links for days now showing how people shot with higher caliber bullets can survive wounds to the head and still walk away – or sometimes live for years with their injury.

          • MB Team Jodi You are right the particular Gun used is not a lethal weapon that you can kill some one with one shot ,she shot him he attacked her, he was very aggressive since he was shot she start stabbing him in the back because he probably fell on her. & of course all that pent up Rage which she still is not facing.

      • No, I don’t believe the medical examiner’s version of events. But whatever, I guess if you can’t win a debate honestly you’d rather twist words.

67. I haven’t read any ME report on TA. Does anyone know if steroid use would be found from an autopsy? I have heard mention about Travis possibly using steroids to enhance his physique. Is there proof of that?

    • I am not sure if they did a toxicology screen on him but I would imagine they would have. Anabolic steroids would show up on that.

    • Yes there was a toxicology report it’s in the autopsy it says negative but it doesn’t list the types of drugs that were tested so who knows it is possible…

68. Oh wow 100 questions! !! Thats great, let’s hope they KEEP most of them!!!

    And does that mean Martinez will or wont have a chance at redirect? ??

    • Since they are moving on to the questions first thing tomorrow morning I’d say, no, the rules must be that the defendant gets to end on their counsel’s questions just like prosecutors get to end on a rebuttal case (the defense gets no rebuttal case due to the burden of proof). In Arizona, the last thing that they do is have the jury ask questions to a witness before that witness is done. So whatever questions are accepted will be asked and then the defense will move on to their next witness.

      • what will the rebuttal case be like? I know martinez will call his own expert and introduce new witnesses. Is there anything else to it?

69. I am so impressed by Jodi’s manner and attitude as a witness. Her witness demeanor is pitch perfect. She is so unbelievably good she ought to teach it but it’s probably not something that can be taught- it is innate. That said, I think Nurmi and his team deserve a lot of credit for giving her excellent direction and explanation, and Jodi has listened to them and taken to heart their advice.

    What a crying shame it is that parents are so often oblivious to the marvelous potential of their children and fail to encourage it. That’s the thought that keeps coming back to me as I watch this bright talented young girl fighting for her life in a courtroom. Her parents failed her.

70. nice quote above SJ about the law of attraction…I posted to my FB page…:)

71. I really like this site. SJ, is there any way you can moderate another site after the trial… have no idea what that site would be, but I am really enjoying being able to express my thoughts without being called names, voted down, or labeled as a troll (AHEM… CNN.com!).

    I also like being able to read threads of intelligent conversation where I don’t have to skip over most comments for being offensive/angry/insane/stupid.

    • Me too. I don’t read at news site comment sections anymore. The comments are outlandish and hateful.

    • Yesss! I agree with Amanda. I feel better when I come here as well. I also post in other sites, especially twitter, and it seems that I’m in the minority. Also, I have sent messages of support about Jodi and they do not post those. I told them that they were discriminating. They’re only posting and considering all the haters’ comments and none of supporters like myself. They’re making it look as though Jodi has no supporters, then I said what about me?

      • I do too from time to time go on the NEWS posts an say something but the MAJORITY is all HATERS on there an it makes me feel bad. Especially when I know some are RELIGIOUS people that know for a fact to THROW THE FIRST STONE you MUST BE SINLESS an it upsets me they are doing what they do an go to CHURCH on SUNDAY an some of them on WEDNESDAY TOO ! disgusting !

72. Guys, I am outraged at these commentators example: Vinnie Napolitan, Nancy Grace (I stopped watching her) and the others. The things they’re saying, it is just sooo bias! Example:
    1-Travis couldn’t have flipped out when Jodi dropped the camera: HELLO! as an abused woman, I know that an abusive man would flipped out over burned spaguetti! Additionally, just because he did not flipped out over the damaged car, it does not mean he was not violent. Domestic violence is a cycle. Sometimes the abuser might be kind and calmed in a certain situation, and then flip out in the same situation during one of the violent cycles!
    2-Jodi seems to remember a lot of things very clearly (photographic memory, said Napolitan) how come she has no memory of how she stabbed TA?: Again, are these people dumb? A lot of psychologists and psychiatrists know that the mind will blocked out traumatic events and therefore amnesia would be the result!
    3-Jodi appears cold and like she didn’t care, was bored, and uninterested during that new video of Travis telling a scary story: Did these idiots (Travis’ friends) and the media putting them on tv, ever heard of shy people who feel awkward socially?? She is obviously feeling uncomfortable; I know this because I am the same way, and it doesn’t mean I do not care or that I’m uninterested. I believe that the media and opponents are just seeing things and analyzing everything with a one track mind. They’re all siding with Travis and the haters, and not seeing things the way they’re really are! Thanks for listening to my ranting, I just had to vent! I hope Jodi gets justice!

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