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The Mysterious Boot Print (revisited)

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Not withstanding the blatant state-sponsored evidence tampering and the accompanying unbridled assholery witnessed throughout the trial — there are still countless unanswered questions relating to the events & specific whereabouts of certain people of June 4th, 2008. This includes the photograph of the (still) mysterious boot print (aka “the shoe impression”) found on the tiled floor in the bathroom at the end of the hallway — which was duly photographed, labeled up & documented by Heather Connor, the relatively inept crime scene & latest print examiner.

That same evidence was brought up (and into evidence) by Kermit & Heather Connor on the morning of Trial Day 3. It’s all covered within a short section of the trial video below starting at 13:50. The chart detailing the exact position of the boot print appears at the 14:20 mark…

From my recollection, the morning of Trial Day 3 was the one and only time the boot print evidence was discussed in any capacity.

This begs the question: WHO DID THE BOOT PRINT (“SHOE IMPRESSION”) BELONG TO?

It didn’t appear there “by magic” – and it’s not an optical illusion… so it can only have been put there during the event… or later that same day (June 4th)… or possibly the day after. In all probability, the blood would have dried after 2 days – so a print from fresh blood would not have been possible.

Taking into account the monumental lack of attention to detail throughout the trial, and the State’s insistence with concentrating on irrelevant items (such as the gas cans, gas receipts, Jodi’s hair color & underwear), it’s hardly surprising that this possible piece of key evidence was bypassed. I mean, why would Kermit want to mess things up for himself and spoil his fairy tale?

After all — and relative to another “high profile” trial — had there been a mysterious bloody shoe/boot print found in the toilet cubicle that did not belong to either Oscar Pistorius or Reeva Steenkamp – I kinda think it would have been thoroughly investigateddon’t you?

In this trial though, that didn’t happen. It was wheeled out in evidence on Trial day 3 and never heard of again.

And there’s this from trial day 5 (October 28th, 2014):

In reply to jurors questions after his direct testimony (the 2nd time around), bungling Flores confirmed that one of the roommates was in the property on June 4th.

MK tweeted it as follows:

jodi arias retrial tweetingz 5
By the way — this is not a cue to start up any Ninja story BS again – so let’s not go down that rocky road. We know WHAT happened on June 4th – and we know WHY it happened. I’ve written this post merely to generate feedback on the boot print itself, and more to the point HOW it might have got there, when, why and who put it there.

To finish off this post, here’s the crime scene photograph of the boot print (circled), followed by the diagram Kermit produced showing the boot print location (arrowed):

crime scene - shoe impression 1

shoe impression 1 - crime scene plan

I’m can’t speculate any further at this point… but it would appear (from the boot print location & direction) that someone was well aware of the bathroom contents several days prior to MCSO showing up – and being knocked over by the documented stench of decomp.

Just sayin’…

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UPDATE: The recent JAA Appellate Fund Matching-gift Campaign raised $91,805.45 — thanks to a generous matching donor and all the supporters that donated to the fund. Let’s now be sure to keep the momentum growing so the fund total can push through $100,000, and even closer towards raising sufficient funds to help cover the legal fees associated with appealing Jodi’s wrongful conviction.

All donations via Justice4Jodi.com go directly to the fund. It is also the ONLY website authorized to collect donations.

In addition, please DO NOT, under any circumstances, donate through any other website or Facebook page/group claiming to be “official” and/or acting with Jodi’s approval or authorization. The same applies to any “Jodi Membership Clubs”, groups or fake Trust funds that have been set up. These sites are bogus – they continue to steal money from Jodi’s future – and they should be actively avoided. If you are aware of any such sites, please help Jodi by clicking here and reporting them.

Remember…

we are team jodi - and we will be victorious. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .

If you missed any of our previous posts, click on the links below:

Child Porn & The Joy of Executions
“ALEXSCAMMERS, this one’s for you… my compliments” – (by Jade)

“Monumental Incompetence” (a post by Jade)

Today’s BS Hearing, 6/22

The Mysterious Stench of Decomp & BS
My Reply To Kirk Nurmi’s BS

Survivor Day – June 4th – Celebrate The Day!

Sky Hughes – Email Exchange r.e. TA’s Pedo Antics (June 2010)
Chris Hughes – Liar & Pedo-Hugger (trial testimony from 2013)
TA’s Pedophile Letter Handwriting Comparison – (Part 2)
TA’s Pedophile Letter to Jodi Arias – (Part 1)
Juror #17 – We Thank You
Jodi Arias Victorious Verdict Day: Video Coverage
The Jodi Arias Verdict: My Thoughts On “Pedo-Huggers United”

. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .

If you’d like to send Jodi a letter or postcard, click here for the current address details & guidelines.

To access every court document & motion relating to this trial, click here or click the Court Docs link from the main menu at the top of the page.

In the meantime…

WE ARE TEAM JODI – AND WE WILL BE VICTORIOUS in our quest for JUSTICE FOR JODI.

Never question it.

Never doubt it.

Prepare for it.

Leave your boot print related thoughts & comments below…

SJ
Team Jodi #WINNING <<<

Click the banner below to read Jade’s post – “Justice Denied: Why The Jurors Got It Wrong & How The Facts Decimate The State’s Case Against Jodi Arias.”:

Read - Justice Denied - Why The Jurors Got It Wrong & How The Facts Decimate The State's Case Against Jodi Arias
Click the links below to read Jade’s previous posts in the series:

The Photos Tell The Story (by Jade)
Stephens, Sandbagging & The Six Month Crap-Fest

Corruption, State-Sponsored Murder & Twelve Angry Men

The Immaculate Deception: Exposed

Michael Melendez – Perjury Exposed
The Presumption of Innocence
The Great Mormon Porn Swindle

157 Comments

  1. So many unanswered questions, I don’t think we will ever know unless someone comes forward and admits they know more than they do. It’s so unfair for Jodi to have to sit behind bars just bc she fought for her life. Self defense IS NOT a crime!

  2. And why just one print?

    Did the person who left it hop on one foot the rest of the way out of the house?

    Fly?

    Or did someone CLEAN UP the rest of the prints and miss one?

    • Exactly!!!!!! What we’ve always been saying. How can anyone leave just ONE footprint? Even if they stopped, realized they were leaving bloody footprints behind, went to the faucet and wash off their shoes, wouldn’t they go back and clean up the one effing footprint left behind?????

      The bloody footprint is one of many unanswered questions.

  3. I believe that footprint’s origin has a perfectly reasonable explanation and one probably not germane to the case at hand. First let me explain why I believe this and then I’ll venture a guess at the cause.

    Whatever one may think of JM, the one thing everyone must acknowledge is that he is a shrewd prosecutor who played the jury and defense team like a fiddle. And he brought up the issue of the footprint, but never bothered to offer up an explanation. And that begs the question – why not?

    The shoeprint is there – no questions about that. If he does not address its presence he leaves open the possibility of the DT making a big deal about that omission. So he has to bring it up. Now, assume for an instance that there is a perfectly reasonable explanation for its presence. If he brings up the print but offers no explanation for its presence the DT has two options – offer up an explanation – which is either harmless to the State’s case or one for which JM has a rebuttal, or just leave it alone. In either case they can’t blame the prosecution for not bringing it up and attribute some nefarious motive to the omission. And I believe that’s just what happened. They knew all along what made the print, and that its presence had no bearing on the case – JM mentioned it was there, with no explanation and the DT left it alone.

    Now onto speculation of what cause it. Looks to me like a left shoe print heading away from the shower area. The shower stall still had wet blood and body fluids – remember the testimony of various and sundry people who were there, and also the smears left when the body was removed. Assume that someone had to get into that shower to either move the body or gather some other evidence. It’s possible they got some of that fluid on their shoe sole. Sloppy Crime Scene processing, no doubt, but that’s just something that happens all the time. Now assume the person has this fluid on their left sole and they step out of the shower stall with their right foot and then take a step towards the hallway. The shoe print is less than six feet away from the stall. I measured this in my bathroom. I’m about 6 feet tall. If i stepped out of our shower stall with my normal stride, with my right foot coming out first, my left foot landed over six feet away from the shower stall. So if my left shoe had some material on it, the first print would be six feet away. Depending on how much material was on my sole, that may be the only print left that was visible to the naked eye.

    • Yep – that seems a reasonable explanation. Especially since many here noted what appeared to be a print in the fluids left in the stall after the body was removed.

      And, in their original collection of crime scene photos, HLN had a picture of a bloody scuff mark, there on the front base of the shower, that looked like it was left by the same treaded shoe…. MARKED WITH AN EVIDENCE TAG! It disappeared from their site soon after it was mentioned here.

      HOWEVER – that print COULD have been used (by savvier defense attorneys, apparently) as yet ANOTHER example of the shoddy, inept, lazy and downright UNPROFESSIONAL manner in which ALL of the so-called ‘evidence’ in this case was collected. How could the jury – how could anyone – accept the evidence and conclusions gathered by such a bunch of corrupt and bumbling boobs?

      • It could have been used for showing shoddy police work. But the problem here was in other areas, namely:

        1. The defendant was acknowledging she was there, and did the killing. The issue then becomes one of reason for the event, and not an actual whodunnit type of situation – so shoddiness in that part of the crime scene collections becomes immaterial.

        2. With no other witnesses to the actual events to some extent the decision rests on the veracity and credibility of the defendant and that’s what JM was going after. And I don’t believe he had physical evidence to back up his claim so he was just going to have to brazenly blast his way through using Horn, et al to cook stuff up as he went along.

        3. Jodi was hampered by a DT that really didn’t give a hoot. During the trial I was jumping up and down yelling about how this DT looked to me like they were just trying to avoid the DP and not get a “not guilty” verdict. Turns out I was right.

        The shoddy collection, processing and analysis of crime scene evidence, and the investigative efforts of the police only become an issue when you need to prove that the defendant in fact did the deed. That was not an issue here. Jodi acknowledged that TA died at her hands. The question was why? What led up to the actual event, and I don’t believe, under the circumstances, any amount of crime scene analysis was going to prove the defense’s case or disprove the state’s. The crime scene had been fubared by Jodi way before the state ever got there. So this was a mucky situation at best.

        I just don’t think there’s any there with that shoe print.

        • It appears Nurmi may be agreeing with Al. In Part 3 of Nurmi’s interview with Monica Lindstrom published today, he said: “:…if there’s a claim of ineffective assistance at counsel which there probably will be…” So it appears Nurmi expects the appellate lawyers will be pointing their finger at him (or both of them) for a botched job.

    • While thinking about this shrewd, tiny frog I remembered this quote:

      Half a truth is often a great lie.
      ~~~Benjamin Franklin

      Hmmm

    • Al, your comment has a reasonable explanation about the boot print BUT I am still with what Journee said in her comment previous to yours: IF someone stepped in the shower area and got fluids on their boot(s) then how come there’s only one print? Wouldn’t it be more reasonable that there would be more prints following that one?

    • Good work Al but Flores said that before anyone when into the house they put on protection on there feet to prevent this from happening so are you say that when they were messing with things in the shower they were wearing shoes

  4. I just reviewed Flores report. He indicated that protective footwear was worn and changed routinely to avoid contamination. The body was not moved until Connor and ? had been at the scene and collected the evidence and the crime scene photographs were taken. In the report, Flores states that the floor cleaner was still there. The roommate had thought that perhaps Enrique had straightened up some furniture that had been out of place.

    I agree with SJ that somebody had been there before.

    • Of course investigators would wear protective foot coverings. They don’t just charge into a place and complicate their own work with new foot impressions. If that were general procedure, they’d all have to have their footwear treads recorded so they would be identifiable later and ruled out – a non-starter.

      This case was handed over to the tabloid media by Jodi herself. Viewers were intrigued with her various explanations, and unfortunately her reputation preceded her by the time she met attorney LKN. But why did she do that? If she had a consciousness of guilt – and by this I mean a full consciousness, not snatches of memory – her story would not, IMO, have changed three times. Each version diminished her credibility and she is too bright not to have seen that for herself. She was foundering. She apparently did not realize then that she had a legitimate claim of self-defense and that a proper investigation could have resulted in a Manslaughter conviction at worst.

      A significant amount of memory loss is more than likely, given the ghastliness of the injuries and the aftermath. It would appear that Jodi’s several attempts to publicize this case could have been a cry for help amid her confusion. Unfortunately, the tabloid media had this story firmly in its talons by the time of trial and Jodi found herself with a defense attorney who asked her repeatedly on the stand why she wasn’t “done with” this boyfriend as she revealed the relationship’s sordid details. The exasperated tone of this line of questioning by her own attorney only fed the prosecution’s “obsessed” scenario.

      Jodi testified that she didn’t remember the knife fight at the time of the first trial, but her memory is slowing returning. It is possible that she couldn’t remember much of the fight at all during her interrogations, and also possible that she will never remember the totality of what occurred that day with any clarity.

      Meanwhile, the allegedly “obsessed and jealous” young woman who supposedly gave a few people who didn’t know her very well a “creepy” feeling, has been a productive, model prisoner for over seven years, a well-liked inmate who helps others who are incarcerated with her. We only hear about this from family members and friends. She doesn’t broadcast her good deeds.

      Like so many other things in this case, the boot print was not adequately investigated, and that it wasn’t is indicative of the seemingly insurmountable prejudice that has mounted over time against Jodi. She deserves due process, not a courtroom filled with individuals who don’t care whether the investigation was conducted properly simply because she had been evasive earlier on, and eventually admitted to the killing. Jodi’s claim of self-defense must be taken seriously, not merely mocked by tabloid, even mainstream ‘legitimate’ media and swept aside in a court of law by way of a “typo” on an autopsy report. That’s not good enough for a decent society.

      • Sex, “obsessed and jealous” are No.1 ‘selling’ points for media! How are they suppose to sell a story if it’s about something serious as Domestic Violence & Self Defense is?

        The only thing that the media is doing is allowing abusers to continue to abuse and the victims, to ‘take the emotional and physical beating’ since the law has proved that it doesn’t protect the innocent!

        If you kill someone that is abusing you in self defense fearing for your life, you’ll get jailed and maybe even sent to the death chamber, so shut your fucking mouth, take the beating and say thank you… eventually you’ll die from your abuser… and then the media will be like “Awwwwwww, poor person. She/he was being abused and never said a word! What an asshole that abuser is! I hope he/she rots in jail!”

        So apparently Jodi had no way of winning: Because she fought her abuser and survived: she’s a witch… if she had not fought back and had been strangled, she’d be the poor dead woman!

  5. Thanks Al…but You must have a longer stride then me and I,m over 6 ft….3 ft. per stride that’s a long stride..but possible. I would think that all investigators would have on slip ons but who knows with that bunch.It just seems very odd that one boot print(LARGE) is there. A third person seems to have been there or MORE? How strange that all lined up to go on HLN with the same line.The young lady who called 9-1-1 how she had to ask…what’s Her name….J..O..D..I..? but the men went in to view t-dog so why use this twit to pass on a message when they could talk themselves with a phone in their possession. Why would they even want woman to be in the house….First the break in to his home(never invited…right?) and with a CREW!talk about a WTF moment.Who does that…other then a movie or someone who knows what is there….?As for the clean up…well Jodi did it or SOMEONE else…..and that side would do anything for a WIN. When I saw and heard a sworn police officer state in court that she planned on killing Jodi….well that did say it all….thanks sam for showing the true evil in that family.his family embraces violence and the mob embraces them…think of the juror …diane…mouthing I,m SORRY….and then with mary lou off these two go to feed with the family…now if that don’t make You cringe….what would.

    • You’re right CC, I was wrong – the floor cleaner was still out, it was the furniture that mysteriously returned to order and both commented on the return to order, neither said they did it.

      “Protective footwear,” though, consists of paper booties that keep investigators from contaminating the scene with foreign matter. They would still PICK UP contaminants within the scene and could transfer the tread impression if the wearer stepped in something wet/sticky.

      • Connor seemed quite professional for MPD. She was too precise for kermit’s liking in her testimony. If the police staff had made that print that day, it would have been still sticky wet. My impression of her is that she would have noted that or even ask the detectives about it. Whoever did it, had to have been there when the blood was still wet and the blood in Flores’ report was noted as “dried”. Except for the large pool at the end of the hallway, it should have been dry within a day or at most two wouldn’t it?

      • To be clear, I am not arguing that LE (more precisely, the coroner’s staff that retrieved the body) DID leave the foot impression – just echoing Al’s suggestion that they might have…. had the same thought months ago when everyone was talking about spotting the foot impression left in the decomposition fluids in the shower.

        Because if the coroner’s staff DID leave that footprint in the shower, they would have most likely left a sticky print on the way out. Would a CSI who found the print a short time later actually TOUCH it to find out if it was still wet? Don’t think so – that would be tampering with the evidence. And, as CC points out, Connor is a straight up gal. Connor would mark it and photograph it.

        • From what I know about blood you can tell when it is wet by looking at it and it was photographed before the body was moved. In the photograph, it’s appearance is the same as the other blood in the photo.

          • What day was that testimony? That the photo of the footprint was taken before the body was moved? The day 3 testimony above doesn’t say when that photo was taken.

            • I found it in the Flores Report under Search Warrant Information. It starts at the bottom of page 8. The search warrant was issued 0953 hours and Connor & Schreel were on scene. The medical examiners arrived at 11:00 hours. It is on page 10, 4th paragraph were it states that all the evidence collection was done prior to body being moved.

              Flores does not mention the footprint, but he does mention on page 9, 6th paragraph dried blood and that in some areas, the blood was deluded. (I think he means diluted).

              I noted on page 8 that Zach was asked and consented to a buccal swab.

              • What it says is:
                “The items in the immediate area surrounding the shower were photographed and collected prior to alloying the OME investigators to examine and recover the body. This was done knowing the potential of scene contamination once the body was moved into those areas.”

                What it does not say is whether anyone had even noticed that faint, reddish brown stain on that mottled finish reddish brown floor – the one that can barely be seen at all in the photo because the environment is so dark – before OME arrived. Let alone documented and photographed it.

                Crime scene investigators in that house for three days. They didn’t collect all the evidence before 11am of day one.

                • During Connor’s testimony starting at 11:25 they go through the photo #’s with the collection placards. Photo 120 shows 5,6, & 7 – hair or possible fibres, photo 121 shows close up of #5 with the baseboard behind & photo 122 shows the shoe impression, which is labelled impression #1. This had to have occurred in sequence with the other photos and the collection of items from bathroom.

                • It had to have occurred in sequence – why? Because he evidence item #s are all in a row? Because a picture shows all those markers lined up in the hallway? Do you know when that picture was taken? Markers didn’t go down til after the body left. And stayed there until Mesa PD was done with the house.

                  For all we know, they didn’t spot “impression #1” until they were on the floor placing the other markers. Did you ever hear mention made of an “impression #2”? Can you know for a fact that an “impression #2” was documented and photographed before OME cleared the scene?

                  Hell, for all we know Flores stuck that little disclaimer in his report because he knew damn good and well no one spotted that print til after OME left and couldn’t know when it had been put there – but Flores BELIEVED at that point that more than one person had to have committed that crime. Yet the only lead he had was this little waif of a girl. Might’ve thought he’d use that footprint to get a name out of her. JM was still trying to do that at trial!

                • Each photo is an exhibit number. Throughout Conner’s testimony, the photos were entered in batches. She started with the garage door, and then the washer and dryer area. She then went through the lower floor, beginning in the office. Exhibit/photo #s 47-61 – downstairs & stairway, #s 62-72 – entry of master bedroom, closet, and a portion of master bedroom, 76-87 – photos of the victim in place in the shower & articles in bathroom including cup, #s 88 -116 – master bathroom, sink, closet in bathroom and cartridge casing, & #s 117-140 – hallway, master bedroom & bathroom with markers. That’s where I stopped watching because the photo of the footprint is in that last batch. The photos that show the body in the shower also show the markers. The photos of the cartridge show the markers. If it had been taken later, the photo number would be out of sequence.

                  This came up in the OJ trial, and the defence proved that the photo of Furman and the glove was not taken when he said it was, but before he went to Rockingham.

                • Evidence exhibit numbers are just arbitrary numbers, CC, assigned by a clerk pulling one item after the next off of a pile of items that need identifying numbers.
                  Sure, it makes sense that photos of each area will be grouped together, but that doesn’t mean they were taken at the same time. In most every grouping there were pictures with and without those ID tags the CSI team was using – had to have been taken at different times.

                • An unidentified footprint in the middle of a crime scene is a reasonable doubt, something prosecutors love to avoid and defence attorneys pounce upon.

                  Conner’s method of collection appears to be very methodical. She begins with photo #1 being the exterior of the house, works her way through the garage door to the washer and dryer, covers the bottom floor, up the stairs, through the bedroom and into the bathroom. Her photo exhibits end with the photos of the hallway, the stain on the carpet and the last ones showing the fingerprint powder and the palm print #139 & 140. Conner testifies that correct procedure is to take photos first with no evidence placards to capture the scene just as it is found and before anything is introduced into the scene. The yellow placards are then placed by and photos are again taken. She testified that she kept track of evidence collection by her notes and the photographs. Cameras keep track of the order even if the person doesn’t. If you don’t believe me, ask Barry Scheck.

                  To move the body through the crime scene before collection would not only compromise the crime scene, but it could compromise any evidence on the body as well, dependent on the circumstances. If you don’t believe me, ask Barry Scheck.

                  Also, the placement of the footprint and its direction is in the wrong location to fit your theory. If it had been made by one of techs when moving the body, it would be made on exit not entrance and it would point toward the door and not be off to the side of the hallway like it is.

                  My impression of the photo is that someone stepped into the liquid. If someone accidentally stepped into some undried blood, it would be very easy to take your shoe off and get the heck out of there.

      • Even w/ the ‘protective footwear’, how much fluid was it that it would be able to soak the footwear so much so it could leave that impression? The only ‘fluids’ around were the ones travis was sitting on. The rest had drained or dried up! Plus in the shower, I don’t seem to see any ‘footstep’ that would be made had someone stepped in the fluids.

        • I didn’t see it either, Pan – but months back in a post where Jade was scrutinizing the photos, several other posters said it looked like there was a shoe impression in the goo that was under the body – and THEY were all connecting it to the unidentified shoe print but saying. Which made no sense to me because that would mean the impression in the shower had to have been dry even before the body was put there.

          Makes more sense to me that the struggle to get the body out of the shower necessitated someone getting into the shower, and that person could easily have left a track in fluids no one had even seen before the body was moved. The fluids might even have been semi-dry – at the sticky stage, where a transferred impression would be tacky, not ‘wet’.

  6. I have always maintained that Jodi did Not cut his throat, this I am 100% positive about, same as she did not drag the body alone.

    I think it was a double dose of Self Defence.

  7. There would be no way she could have put the body in that shower in such a small space on her own. He would have to have been lifted, so I deduce from this the shoe print belonged to a man.

    The shoe print is evidence of that.

  8. I am guessing that when Travis went for Jodi and she stabbed him, she screamed.. someone came to her aid..
    Travis got jealous and the 2 men fought.

  9. My question to Nurmi is this:

    “Would you still not have even tried for a ‘not guilty’ verdict if you had believed her innocent?”

    What kind of justice system do we have where the kind of defense you get depends on whether your attorney believes in your innocence. When did the attorney become the judge and jury? And if a verdict of guilty is a given with a death qualified jury then once the State has put death on the table, why even have a trial? Why not just go right to the sentencing? It seems like a trial at that point is just an expensive sham.

    • Justus,

      Actually you have two questions in that post.

      This first one, I’m assuming is posed to Nurmi – “Would you still not have even tried for a ‘not guilty’ verdict if you had believed her innocent?” I guess that comes from his comment about this been a forgone conclusion because of a death qualified jury and his numerous comments about a capital case attorney’s job being to save the life of his client. I guess I disagree with that comment of KN’s because actually the first job is to defend the client in the guilty phase by testing the state’s case.

      The second question , possibly rhetorical, is
      “What kind of justice system do we have where the kind of defense you get depends on whether your attorney believes in your innocence. ” I think that’s a more complicated issue and one that’s actually open to all sorts of debate.

      Before I move on let me say that even for all his protestations I believe Nurmi did a miserable job. In this case, I don’t believe the state had enough evidence to prove what they were alleging, and the DT should have driven a Mack truck through the holes in the state’s case for M1. However, the question raised above has wider issues.

      So let’s look at the situation. You have a defense attorney, who interviews the client and looks at all the evidence presented in discovery (at least to the point where he has to make this decision). He then looks at the totality of what is before him and has to make a decision on how to proceed – i.e. given the client and the evidence does he have a case to defend. Now assume that given the evidence and the clients statements the attorney believes that :

      a. His client is guilty as charged, and
      b. The state has enough evidence to make their case.

      What does this attorney do? I guess he could just withdraw – and leave it to someone else to handle the case. Actually Nurmi tried to do that.

      The attorney could also counsel the client to accept some sort of a plea deal – maybe even an Alford plea. I’m assuming this was done because a plea deal was in fact offered up by Jodi and turned down by the state.

      Or he could present a strategy to fight the case in court. And to do that the attorney and client must come up with an end goal – a not guilty verdict, a verdict on a lesser charge, or, as seems to be Nurmi’s intent in this case, to avoid the DP.

      So now you have an attorney who is stuck with a case he does not believe he can win, and a client he does not believe. What’s the guy supposed to do. I am not an attorney, but in this instance I would have gone after the state’s case a lot harder in trying to get them to prove their theory and also poke holes into their case. But I have no experience as an attorney, and I have no idea how that would have worked out. But maybe, just maybe, KN was onto something here. Look at how this turned out. I don’t believe the state proved its M1 case. I have no idea what went on in there, but, even with the case as tried, I don’t see proof beyond a reasonable doubt for what the state alleges. However, 12 good folk from AZ did. If the attorney trying the case had enough experience to be able to predict this then maybe he made the right decision.

      The other issue of course is what the defendant wanted. And, to me that’s the real issue. So may be the attorney believes he’s got a client guilty as charged, and so tries to drop the case. But he isn’t allowed to. Next he convinces the client to offer up a plea deal and that isn’t accepted. Now he goes out to fight the case. But at all times the client is allowed to direct the defense, and the attorney must do what the client wants. And I don’t know what that was.

      It seems to me that in this particular case, right from the get go, the case was handled in an effort to avoid the DP. And Nurmi seems to have acknowledged that. The question then is whether or not Jodi was aware of that tactic, and whether she concurred with it. I also don’t know whether, during the guilt phase she ever told the judge that this was why she wanted KN off the case. But somehow, somewhere, the case proceeded with KN and the DT’s case as presented. I guess if there is a record of Jodi saying that’s not what she wanted, and the judge forced it on her, then that’s an appeals issue. If on the other hand there is no record of that, and if she concurred with the approach taken then that point is moot.

      After all this rambling – I guess the answer to your question is actually pretty simple. The way our justice system, or any fair one, is formed the quality of your defense is definitely going to be dependent on whether the attorney believes in that clients innocence. We have a weird justice system, in that it relies on being able to convince 12 common folk, without any specialized knowledge of what goes into a case, about the guilt or innocence of the accused. There are no qualifications to being on a jury, no need for an understanding of the law, or criminology, or physics, or chemistry, or biology. There are no prerequisites to a level of intelligence, no minimum standards for comprehension, or logic or anything. Given that situation the presentation of a case becomes a sales job at the lowest possible level. And that system sucks, its just that all other systems are probably worse. So in most cases the Defense attorney is really trying to do a sales job.

      In doing so, the attorney needs to challenge the evidence, and is also bound by rules that disallow the presentation of false testimony, etc. If the attorney believes the evidence as produced by the state, which means he can’t see the holes in it, that by definition ties his hands in the sort of defense that can be provided. The right thing to do is for the attorney to get the heck out of there. But if that is not allowed then the attorney needs to clearly define the best result they can hope for and go for it. And that result may not match the actual case – but that is how it is.

      • Thanks, Al. I do know that an attorney need not believe in their client’s innocence (else we’d have a whole plethora of folks wasting away in jail cells, unable to retain an attorney). My beef is with any lawyer who, based on nothing more than their own speculations and gut feelings, decides they’ll just let the State trample all over their client’s right to a fair trial. His principle job, even beyond getting a ‘not guilty’ verdict, was to force the State to play by the rules and to make them prove it was not self defense. But because he had already decided it was not self defense he even put himself in the camp of not wanting to dirty the person whom he, on his own, had already decided was “the victim”. The case before the court was a self-defense case, no matter what he believed, and as such, until the jury rendered a verdict, we (Including Nurmi) did not know who “the victim” actually was. But Nurmi says numerous times that he wasn’t going to help Jodi in her endeavor to besmirch poor Travis. How does a defendant prove self defense with those kinds of restrictions, especially when those restrictions are placed on them by their own attorney? It was like Nurmi was Travis’ attorney. And no wonder – the main focus of his practice was all about protecting poor innocent men from all those lying females out there. I believe his lack of effort was not based simply on an unfounded belief. It was downright blatant bias.

        • Very insightful, Justus. Nurmi also refused to pursue things that Jodi asked him to pursue — such as having Neumeister do the examination of Travis’s computer for porn. That was finally done before retrial when Jodi was acting pro se, resulting not only in the massive evidence that she had been telling the truth about it, but also in evidence of the state misconduct with the computer and, in my view, at the original trial. Nurmi rejected a number of Jennifer’s ideas as well.

          I will say in his defense that I don’t know what else he could have done to get Stephens to rein in Martinez’s bullying. That was not his fault.

          • I agree, alan. I really shouldn’t blame him for a runaway courtroom controlled by a megalomaniac. That was Stephens’ doing. But Nurmi sure didn’t make any effort to put challenges before the State and require them to prove their preposterous theories, particularly about what happened in that bathroom. He let that all slide because he didn’t want to piss off the jurors? All he had to do was reach one juror, not all of them!

            • If nurmi’s spies are anywhere around here looking for input for vols2,3 , then maybe they can pose to mr. slouch why he didn’t cross the most important witness against Jodi, that being horn, especially when frog handed slouch his ass by claiming the gunshot was last. That’s where the defense lost the case. Hey nurmi I mean slouch,, why didn’t you anticipate that one?

            • It wasn’t like Nurmi hadn’t asked for the computer’s hard drive. It was JSS that kept accepting Kermit’s excuses. They also were given that mirror image in Dec 2009, that according to Neumeister must have been incomplete. The defense was being fed a bunch of phony evidence. JSS seemed to get very concerned about her rulings when Jodi was acting pro per.

              I have to stop holding my breath waiting for Nurmi’s next book because he hasn’t even started it yet. I thought he had them all written. I was surprised that he is watching the trial, seemingly for the first time, before he starts. I hope he watches the full versions so he doesn’t miss all of the 🙄 & 😮 ing from the front row that he missed during trial.

        • Justus,

          I agree with you wholeheartedly. A defense attorney’s job is to represent his/her client to the best of their ability. However, in a more generic sense, if you do have an attorney who does not believe their client and so feel they cannot represent said client to the best of their ability, then I believe they have a responsibility to not take on the case. And I believe no judge should ever force an attorney to take on a case against their wishes – or you end up with a really bad situation. That being said and done, Nurmi’s case is totally different, with one exception – he did want off the case and JSS forced him to stay on. But once that was the case he should have fought this case to the best of his ability – and maybe he did. May be this IS the best of his ability.

          From day one I have exclaimed to anyone who listened, that Nurmi was not fighting this to win an acquittal on the M1 charge. He was fighting this to save Jodi from the DP. And that has now been proven to be the case. In as far as not wanting to besmirch TA – seems to me that’s an afterthought because the DT showed absolutely no qualms in dragging in all sorts of pretty damning stuff to show TA’s true colors. I think all this baloney KN’s spouting now is just revisionist history.

          My real problem with this case all along has been with the fact that this DT did not go out and present a case against M1. Yes, KN did raise an argument during closing, but that was too late, almost a sort of afterthought. He laid absolutely no groundwork for the whole thing and by closing arguments it’s too late.

          The problem arose a lot earlier. I have said this many times before but to reiterate – if you look at this case as an impartial observer from the outside, there are just too many issues with respect to the evidence vis a vis the state’s theory, for that theory to make sense. And the problems lie at a much deeper level than minor issues with respect to porn on computers etc.

          The state presented a narrative that basically had Jodi deciding to murder TA before she ever left Yreka, and they said she rented a car, dyed her hair, stocked up on gas, turned off her phone and all that, because she had planned this from the get go. The DT made absolutely no effort to make a concerted effort to rebut any of that stuff. For example – ask the rental car guy if he knows how many people rent cars when they take long trips, even if it’s just to avoid putting the miles on their own car – I know I do. Or bring someone in to speak to that. Where was the expert who would talk to the reliability of someone remembering the color of hair on a single customer after many months. Heck some states are now giving jury instructions about the unreliability of eye witness testimony. I know KN argued the issue about her having all sorts of opportunity before the alleged time of the event. But he never laid out the narrative for that.

          I think this was just a piss poor attorney, without the gumption to actually fight this case, and all this other stuff is an attempt to overcome his own shortcomings.

          That being said and done – there is one aspect that has always been a mystery to me. Given the circumstances of the case, the whole case of self-defense relies purely on Jodi’s word. There were no other witnesses, and just like there is no reasonable evidence to show M1 there is also no evidence to show that this was self defense on that particular day. All the evidence presented by the DT just shows that self defense is viable because TA was abusive. So, in order to make the self defense argument stick, you have to have the jury believe Jodi. It doesn’t matter what the law says – as in once the claim is made, the state has the burden to disprove the case. I think that would only hold true with an average jury (not a death qualified one) and also only in situations where the defendant’s word was unimpeachable. In all other cases, regardless of the facts, the defense must weigh the consequences of pursuing a self defense case vs something that might lead to a lower sentence. Why didn’t they do that in this case?

          They did offer a M2 plea. So did Jodi suddenly get an iron will after that was turned down? Or did someone else come up with a defense strategy? And did the attorneys not point out the possible consequences to her? Look at what she was up against on a self defense case:

          1. A death qualified Jury.
          2. A defendant telling various different changing stories, which leads most people to question the person’s veracity.
          3. A case presentation that relied to some extent on a narrative that talked about memory loss/repression.

          This was a disaster waiting to happen – and it did. Did no attorney tell her that they ought to have tried this differently? Sometimes, it’s better to take your losses at a minimal level than to gamble the whole thing – especially when the deck is stacked against you. So either Jodi was incredibly delusional (or naive) about the world – or the defense attorney’s are incredibly incompetent. And it wouldn’t surprise me if it’s a little bit of both.

          • The evidence to show that this was self-defense was the wounds on TA and the crime scene itself…Read the essay by Herr Speights which explains each and every wound on TA in a precise medically scientific manner which is indisputable…Also look at the equivocating speculative testimony of Horn that he gave in order to fit with the fantasy theory of the state….the bullet “must have” penetrated the brain…”IF the lung was nicked….” without this equivocating speculative testimony of Horn there would be no case for the state and this is why Horn’s testimony will come under a mountain of scrutiny by the appellate court just as his testimony has been scrutinized in past cases (Lisa Randall and Harold Fish)…his speculative testimony was relied upon by this stupid jury and without it there would have been no conviction……it is all there in the medical evidence to show that the gunshot was first, not last, meaning that the fight continued on and TA continued attacking Jodi..the wounds on TA tell the story of what happened if anyone cared to listen… that this was a life and death struggle with Jodi trying to fend off TA’s abusive attack…so yes there is evidence that this was self defense…but none of the jury wanted to look at the truth..they just wanted to kill Jodi, period and the truth be damned !

            People lie, but the forensic and medical evidence tell the truth…that is if it’s not tampered with, destroyed, or hidden for years….

            and of course you had the pint-sized Napolean ego-maniac wantabe rock star at the helm and so we had the perfect storm of injustice..not seeking truth and justice IMHO but seeking fame and fortune with the goal to kill Jodi Arias….

            All IMHO …

          • Don’t agree at all, Justus. Not a bit. More than two years before trial began, Jodi made a decision to finally tell the truth and hope to be believed despite her earlier lies. No one can rightly criticize her for this 2010 decision, or argue that honesty was not the best final policy. If the truth was dismissed at trial, in my opinion it’s not her fault, but rather the fault of her lead lawyer for not trying his best to support her story with forensic evidence. And her jury was wrong not to recognize obvious reasonable doubt.

            • I don’t agree that there’s no evidence to suggest it was not self defense. The picture of the ceiling and light over the shower was taken about three feet off the ground per testimony, but it’s also measureable from the picture itself. How could that picture be taken while in the process of attacking TA? For it to be taken the camera had to be set to auto mode or someone click the button or the camera was pressed against someone for that particular shot to be taken. According to prosecution theory that picture was taken while the attack was underway. Also that photo doesn’t appear to be a flash photo. Why turn the flash off? So between the last flash photo showing TA’s legs while seated the flash was turned off while in the middle of the knife attack or just before per prosecution. Hmmm. If we go gunshot first in the shower when was that picture taken? Before or after the shot? That one photo alone put a lot of doubt in the prosecution’s case in what was supposed to be a rock solid case. It goes further downhill from there IMO. A sort of inversion happened in this case. Even though JA got convicted, things went from a powerful prosecution case to one built on sand and a defense case that didn’t capitalize on it. It makes for a fascinating case that’s not particularly satisfactory.

          • The evidence to show that this was self defense were the wounds on TA’s body and the crime scene itself…read Herr Speights essay on the wounds that explains precisely about each and every wound on his body…the forensics and the medical evidence doesn’t lie..

            The evidence was there but no one wanted to look at it…and look at Horn’s testimony…without his equivocating and speculative testimony…the bullet “must have” penetrated the brain….”IF the lung was nicked….” oops there was a “typo”…..there would have been no conviction…but this is why Horn’s testimony will hopefully come under a mountain of scrutiny by the appellate court ala Lisa Randall and Harold Fish cases…then you have Inspector Clouseau’s admitted perjury in the Chronis hearing in order to secure the death penalty aggravator….. the jury was too stupid to understand this stuff or they already had their minds made up, either way, Jodi suffers as a result…the evidence at the scene and the medical evidence in Horn’s own autopsy report shows that the gunshot was first which is what the state believed until Jodi changed her story to self defense then suddenly oh so magically the bullet was no longer first but last, wow what a miracle that was, not……the bullet was first meaning that the fight continued and Jodi was defending herself against TA’s attack, but alas that didn’t fit the state’s new fantasy theory…but the appellate court will hopefully not be so gullible as this jury was….

            There was a viable defense available for Jodi, but the DT chose to go down another path….

            You couple the forensic and medical evidence with all the other evidence that shows that the prosecution hid, destroyed, altered evidence, committed Brady violations, along with the perjured testimony of state’s witnesses and you have what’s called REASONABLE DOUBT….but IMHO the jury had their minds made up and were blinded by their desire to kill Jodi Arias and of course their leader, the pint sized wantabe rock star ego-maniac just wanted to win..you know another notch in little Juanita’s lipstick case….in my view both sides lost…the state lost their bid to kill Jodi Arias and the defense lost because self defense is not a crime and a life sentence for self defense is obscene !

            All IMHO

      • Al, I don’t agree that your three “end goals” are inconsistent. In the first trial, I thought the defense did an excellent job of making self-defense psychologically plausible through Samuels’ and ALV’s testimony about Jodi and her relationship with Travis. (The two psychologists at retrial might have been even better.) But all of that also served to make Jodi a more sympathetic murderer, in case the jury decided, as they did, to reject self-defense. Thus, the actual trial showed that it was quite possible both to argue innocence and to fight a DP at the same time.

        Given that, self-defense should have been much more strongly argued, with forensic experts to interpret the crime scene and a leading pathologist to rebut Horn. Nothing I’ve heard from Nurmi’s book excuses the failure to do this, which you yourself have emphasized.

        Also, I don’t see how Nurmi could have legitimately concluded before trial, as you suggest, that the state could bear its burden of disproving self-defense beyond reasonable doubt. As it turned out, all they had to offer (besides premeditation evidence which a local defense attorney, Vlad Gagic, described as “pathetic”) was Horn’s statement that Jodi’s story was impossible, plus Martinez’s evidence that Jodi (besides lying in the past) lied to the jury about two things, porn on TA’s computer and the third gas can’s return. That was it. Given that ALV and maybe Samuels too seemed to believe Jodi’s story, Nurmi should have pounded on reasonable doubt about self-defense. Surely a lawyer who didn’t despise Jodi would have done so.

        Beyond all that, one can easily challenge Nurmi’s basic claim that avoiding a DP is his paramount duty in a capital case, superseding all others. Justus has remarked on this before. I’ll merely add two points. First, no one disputes that appellate courts are far more likely to overturn a conviction with a DP attached than one without a DP. Second, all appeals are state-funded after a DP, whereas Jodi is now struggling to raise enough money for federal appeals. Thus, it’s not even so clear that she’s better off now without the DP which Nurmi says was his sole focus. Surely these points should go into a consideration of trial strategy somehow. If I recall correctly, a huge proportion, something like 80%, of AZ death sentences are eventually overturned. However, I’m extremely relieved Jodi escaped a death sentence, so I won’t press these points..

        • All Martinez needed with a death-qualified jury were the crime scene photos. They are the only evidence and that the jurors seemed to pay any attention to.

          This case is a perfect example of death-qualified juror bias and over-charges for the type of crime by a fame-seeking prosecutor who would stoop to any devious act to win.

        • Alan,

          I think the overriding issue with the strategy and presentation of any case is actually what an attorney sees as the predilections of a possible jury. In this case I would recommend you to ColdCase’s post below. That’s sort of what you are up against. I think it’s a fairly well known fact that juries make up their minds on aspects of the case other than strict adherence to the law. In fact the jury instructions allow them to consider, or for that matter not consider, any testimony, evidence or witness that is presented to them. I know that they are read a bunch of jury instructions, and these are available for their review during deliberation, but considering that these instructions become points of argument even among legal scholars makes me wonder how juries in fact interpret them.

          That being said and done, I would assume that any attorney needs to make a serious calculation of what to present, and how to present it to the jury he would be facing. In fact I believe that often times attorneys opt for a bench trial (i.e. one without a jury, only a judge) when their client is not deemed sympathetic by the public, but they feel they have severely technical grounds for acquittal. So in those sorts of cases the attorney has in fact decided to forgo a jury in it’s entirety.

          Now moving onto this particular case – I think you are actually making my point with refernce to your statement

          “Also, I don’t see how Nurmi could have legitimately concluded before trial, as you suggest, that the state could bear its burden of disproving self-defense beyond reasonable doubt.”

          Obviously it is unequivocally the state’s burden in AZ to disprove self defense. But that’s the legal aspect. I don’t believe the attorneys on either side felt the state had to do that to THIS jury. (It’s almost a sort of reverse jury nullification scenario). It is very apparent that JM felt no obligation to do that – he didn’t even try. And it seems KN had the same impression – or so he seems to claim now. And obviously it seemed to have worked for this jury, because despite JM’s complete lack of evidence disproving self-defense the jury found her guilty of M1 (or something like that – I’m still completely confused about that whole “x” people voting for both M1 and felony murder thing – does that mean that the rest voted for one or the other, and did you have a unanimous verdict on any one of the two charges?).

          Here’s why I believe the attorneys had this belief. Firstly of course they had a death qualified jury which seems to typically be made up of ignorant tight asses. But secondly the case had a defendant who had just way too much baggage with resect to credibility. They knew the tapes with the initial interviews, and the whacko phone calls to Flores, and her parents interview and the TV interview and all that was going to come in – and then you have a sudden change of story, but also one with a huge, gaping blank in it. Unfortunately, this does not build a lot of confidence. Now couple that with a death qualified jury and you’ve got a real problem for the defense. And I think any defense lawyer could predict that up front. I do agree with you that had this DT mounted a solid case for self defense they might have stood a chance. So instead of treating this case by AZ rules – i.e. the state bears the burden of disproving self-defense, they should probably have used a proactive proof defense, as would be the situation in a lot of other states – one where the defense must prove self-defense. They would then have had to put up a lot of forensic evidence, etc (much as you say) to actively prove their case. But obviously they decided not to do that. Did they opt to not do that because they believed that they could make the jury adhere strictly to the letter of the law, or was it because they believed they couldn’t prove it? It would have been a drastic issue if they had an expert review the situation, and come up with a report that matched the state’s theory. And that would of course be the fear an attorney would have if he didn’t believe his client.

          So, to wrap up another rant, I believe the DT had three options here:

          1. They could hold out and just make the state prove it’s case for M1, without a proffer of an alternative.
          2. They could have gone with a self defense case – but I believe they would have had to prove it.

          3. They could have gone for a lesser charge.

          Obviously they could have used a combination of all of the above. What they did in fact was present a case, that seemed merely aimed at avoiding the DP. There was no attempt made to rebut the forensic evidence, except for a last minute, afterthought type attempt at rebutting Horn – but even there they didn’t use a forensics expert, but merely a psychologist! There was no effort made to delve into any of the myriad of amorphous proofs presented by JM.

          Regardless of what one might think of JM’s tactics, and behavior and personality, the guy is an awfully successful prosecutor. His win record is substantial. That says to me that he knows how to handle an AZ jury. At the same time his reputation for being a sort of sleazy player seems pretty widespread as well. I would hope that attorneys coming up against him know what to expect, and are able to tailor their cases accordingly. Obviously this DT didn’t.

          • I would say they did 2 in the end, just neglecting all the forensic evidence. If I am not mistaken, the DT could have hired a crime-scene analyst and a well-qualified pathologist, and if the reports of either or both were adverse to Jodi’s story, they could have just buried them. (Indeed, some of the Dupes have suggested that exactly that happened, explaining why no such defense experts testified.) There’s no defense counterpart to the prosecution duty to disclose evidence adverse to its case. Only the state must do so.

            Jodi was convicted of M1, which had been charged “in the alternative” as premeditated murder or felony murder. Either one counts as M1. Seven jurors voted for both, 5 only for premed. So there was unanimity on premed. That is very unfortunate, since there are a pile of ways the felony-murder votes could have been attacked on appeal. But now they’re irrelevant, imo — harmless error at best.

          • All Nurmi had to do was prove self-defense to one juror, or even just the possibility, at least enough to create reasonable doubt. (Isn’t a hung jury supposed to be better than a conviction?) But from what he’s saying it was like, well, if there was little chance of convincing every juror (because of the type of people chosen to kill other people) then he just wasn’t even going to try.

            But, also, I believe because he despised Jodi so much and wanted her to be guilty that he dismissed as bogus anything that didn’t fit that story. Look at the way he handled the forged letter issue, even after his own expert gave it the highest rating possible as being Travis’ handwriting. He writes, “How, if Ms. Arias did write these letters she was able to author them, get them out of the jail and have them emailed to me? This is a more difficult task than you might think given that she was living at the jail and everything she sent out was inspected and her phone calls were all recorded. Adding on to the difficulty of the task of Ms. Arias creating these letters would be the fact that she would have to do a good enough job at simulating Mr. Alexander’s writings to fool a handwriting expert.” But then, in his very next breath, he just offhandedly dismisses all that and says, ”Putting these difficulties aside, once the 3 by 5 card was found, it was my belief that Mr. Arias wrote the letters.” His approach absolutely reeks of confirmation bias.

            He decided she was guilty early on and it turned him into a lazy sloth. He was going to do his best to save this killer’s life. (But I’d like to know how he thought telling the jurors that he also hated Jodi was supposed to go toward saving her life. Asshole!)

            • Right, Justus, I agree. And the 9/10 comment makes a lot more sense after his book. I only disagree that he “turned into a lazy sloth.” The fact that he wouldn’t even proofread his own motions, or let someone else competent do it, suggests that he has a character defect or at least little true self-respect. Some of his motions were very well-argued — he has a good legal mind — but he wouldn’t even do elementary polishing after dictating them.

              • I believe you’re saying that the character defect was probably already there before Jodi ever came along. Low self-esteem maybe – a weakened ego that takes helpful suggestions as a threat, implying he doesn’t actually know everything? I certainly believe he’s threatened by strong-willed women. He viewed Jodi’s attempt to have some say in her case as “manipulation”. Would he have viewed a 30 year old male defendant’s friendly mannerisms as “flirtation” or “manipulation”? I doubt it. I believe he’s got some major issues and shouldn’t be in the business of defending any woman in a court of law.

            • I would add the fact that Jodi was in an 11 x 7 foot well-lit cell with a couple of Joe’s worst never far away to Nurmi’s list. With just a tiny little table to work on, she was supposed to have created 18 pages of ‘forgery’ that was good enough to fool experts.

              His train of logic does not lead to his ultimate conclusion.

      • A defense attorney – to be successful in proving his clients innocence – must believe in the client. It’s obvious that nurmi not only didn’t believe Jodi but he couldn’t care less about her!

        He did next to zero to try and debunk the prosecution’s theory. As Alan stated, it was only when Jodi went pro se that very important evidence was presented. This evidence of porn, tampering w/ the computers, perjury, and all the other stunts that the prosecution and the detectives pulled would have had a significant impact on the first jury if it was presented then! The verdict of M1 would have never been an option! This evidence would have caused more reasonable doubt if even some still refused to acknowledge self defense!

        And I will once again go to Casey Anthony case:
        Jose Baez was against all odds: a corrupted prosecutor, a judge that hated him and Casey, a death penalty case, the frenzy media lusting for ‘sales’ and the public wanting to see Casey ‘fry’! Casey was a ‘notorious client’ due to her lies and party life. BUT he DID NOT try for the simplest of all: avoid the death penalty. He wanted to win his client’s freedom. To get a verdict of innocence! Almost every day he had everything against him but he never gave up on his client! He fought a good fight and that’s the way attorneys should be! And that’s why Casey is a free woman. I’m sure that if Jose Baez was Jodi’s attorney, we wouldn’t be here talking about all this…

  10. I believe this must be the study that Nurmi referred to when referencing white male victims.

    “Because of this, jury selection in capital cases often takes weeks, if not months, as “conscientious objectors” are winnowed out by prosecutors. Women and minorities are removed from the panels at a much higher rate than are white males. (That may explain why capital juries are approximately 43 percent more likely to sentence a killer to die if his victim is white.) Numerous academic studies show that those who survive the death qualification process are not only biased towards death (instead of life imprisonment), but conviction. People who have no qualms about the death penalty just tend to favor the prosecution – whether the crime is shoplifting, drunk driving, or murder.”

    http://www.cato.org/publications/commentary/are-you-death-qualified

    Others:

    Harvard Law Review: “New Data on the Effect of a Death Qualified Jury on the Guilt Determination Process – George L. Jurow

    Study of Potential Death-Qualified Jurors Reveals Bias – Death Penalty Information Centre

    “Young’s evaluation of polling data also revealed that death penalty supporters are more likely to convict the defendant. When polled, they were nearly twice as likely to say it was worse to let the guilty go free than to convict an innocent defendant. “By allowing juries in capital cases to be stacked in favor of conviction, the courts have created a system in which certain defendants – especially those of African American descent – in essence must prove their innocence beyond a reasonable doubt,” said Young, who analyzed data from the 1990 to 1996 General Social Survey – a leading barometer of social trends in the U.S. He notes that those two findings reinforce each other and make death penalty juries more conviction prone, particularly when the defendant is black. (Washington Post, March 21, 2004)

    It is a very sad truth …..

  11. Here’s how Nurmi viewed the evidence (page 50): “The defensive wounds on his hands and arms also demonstrate the fact that he was alive and struggling during the ordeal, that he was alive and struggling before the fatal blows were delivered.”

    Her own attorney doesn’t even question why, in actuality, there were absolutely no wounds anywhere on his arms, something you would expect on someone supposedly trying desperately to fend off a slasher. Nurmi not only doesn’t question it, he doesn’t even notice it. Probably because he wasn’t looking for anything that might go contrary to what he already believed.

      • The rest of them are idiots too because if you present any of them with this same question they each come up up with some bizarre scenario (which you can see is devised simply to justify their hypothesis) no matter how ridiculous. For example, “He was too weak to lift his arms”. But if you point out that he had enough strength to lift his hands, which happened to be attached to the end his arms, they just come up with another even more bizarre scenario. All instead of just looking at the obvious.

        • And here’s one obvious line of reasoning. She was running away from him until the final attack when she had the knife to protect herself and she went nuts on him out of fear. Everyone of those knife wounds took place in the final few seconds of the violence. He never got a chance to harm her and he received those five minor wounds to his hands when he tried to back off but it was already too late; he was attacking a woman who was hell bent on staying alive.

  12. Yes, the only way to have handled this was to poke holes into each and every item offered up as evidence. Jodi was her own worst enemy granting interviews, changing stories, etc. Because of this each and every item needed to be tested and retested, this was a capital case for God’s sake. Jodi’s parents also did her no favors in their interview with Flores. This is precisely why the DNA evidence, footprint, roommates alibies, hair color, and porn on his computer needed to be truly investigated. Did the DT just take the States word that there was no porn on his computer. – I would have raised holy hell and gotten to the bottom of that. A full investigation needed to be launched without question. I think the inconsistencies with Flores & Horns testimony should have been a much bigger deal than was. Here you have these professionals “making mistakes” in a capitol case!!!! It’s not like they flip burgers for a living and this is just a side-job. Come on!!!! Any Defense Attorney worth his/her weight would have barreled right through those holes making them bigger and bigger. There is no way that JM should have gotten away with his brutish behavior and disrespect for the court. I guess Nurmi’s filing multiple grounds for a mis-trial can possibly pave the way for appeals on those grounds but that should have only been part of the equation. His primary job was to convince at least 1 juror that she was not guilty. Keeping her on the stand for 18 days did NOT help that cause. Whether he wanted to be there or not should have had no bearing on the quality of Attorney and defense she received. She got screwed big time.

    • Nurmi never believed Jodi and that’s one of the reasons (besides him being a lazy fuck) that he didn’t investigate the possibility of porn on the computers. And that’s one of the reasons he hates Jodi so much: she made a total fool of him! In a matter of a few weeks that she was pro se, she managed to come up with more evidence of corruption that he did in all the years of the trials!

      As for Jodi? I think that she should have asked for an attorney from the get-go. Not speak to Flores at all! Of course, Jodi trusted that the media (thus the interviews) would help show that she is not a monster. Little did she know that those interviews did the exact opposite.

  13. 12 good people DID NOT DO THEIR JOBS…they betrayed their oaths…just view any interview they gave…such hate , vile and yes lies…..FACTS as to why they convicted….NONE! The questions alone showed their hate or insanity or both…that thing diane mouthing i,m sorry. All judges have a duty when they see wrong doing…..as a Mass. judge in the 80,s did and struck down a wrongful verdict…live on CNN! That judge could care less and that seems common place in az…..guilt WAS never in doubt….play the lotto pal! In society We all have a duty to justice,and this speaks volumes to their evil as they would only make a deal for LWOP and NO APPEALS….any judge would call that corruption at it’s worst.Do as the family wants or we will kill You…some choice.The I would never take a deal mind set…well when Your life and freedom is on the line do as You wish,and good luck.Why was THAT family allowed to run that trial? More show then ever trial.And what do they fear? It’s not Her as She roamed free for 35+ days even though the were told Jodi did it….as sam wanted to do a little 1st deg. too.As for fat boy he did all to not help Her….a good person does his job and that’s it. Lets do a reverse on this….into the operating room You go and the surgeon tells You and all…9 out of 10 I don’t like this patient …..Is there another Dr. in this room…one I can trust?Works for lawyers,judges persecutors, and juries also.

      • That’s for sure, Carol

        Attitudinal Differences of Death-Qualified Jurors

        Death qualified jurors are attitudinally distinguishable from their jurors ineligible for capital jury service. Death-qualified jurors are more likely to be racist, sexist, and homophobic (Butler, 2007c). They are more likely to weigh aggravating circumstances (i.e., arguments for death) more heavily than mitigating circumstances (Butler & Moran, 2002; 2007a). Death-qualified jurors are more likely to evaluate ambiguous expert scientific testimony more favorably (Butler & Moran, 2007b). They are also more likely to be skeptical of defenses involving mental illness (including the insanity defense) (Butler & Wasserman, 2006).
        Death-qualified jurors are also more susceptible to the pretrial publicity that surrounds capital cases (Butler, 2007a). They are more affected by the victim impact statements that occur during the sentencing phase of capital trials (Butler, 2008b). Death-qualified jurors are more supportive of capital punishment as it relates to the elderly and the physically disabled (Butler, 2008a). They are more likely to evaluate mitigating circumstances more negatively when a combination of strong and weak mitigation is presented than when only strong mitigation is presented (Butler & Moran, 2008a).

        http://www.thejuryexpert.com/2008/05/caveats-of-the-death-qualified-jury-ways-capital-defense-attorneys-can-use-psycholegal-research-to-their-advantage/

  14. IMHO, the boot print belonged to the Mormon man who helped place Travis Alexander’s body in the shower stall in a ritual position.

    “Then you will know the truth, and the truth will set you free.” John 8:32 NIV

  15. Nurmi points out in his book two Maricopa County cases which occurred while Jodi’s case was pending:

    – man stabbed wife to death, stabbing her approximately 27 times and then driving her body to the PD as if he was going through a drive-through – charged with second degree murder and pled guilty.

    – Jerice Hunter who was accused of the torture and murder of her 5-year old daughter – charged with 1st degree but no death charge.

    I blame a system who gives the likes of the prosecutor in this case, the power to decide what charges to impose. Ridiculous!

  16. A question re: writing Jodi;
    Xmas cards do not meet the #10 envelopes only regulations. Is she not allowed to receive Xmas cards?

    • I’ll ask someone who probably knows. I’ve sent about four large manila envelopes with Internet prints, and none was ever returned.

        • I’ve sent Jodi regular cards before and they have never been returned. I’m thinking the cards can not be overly fancy . . .mainly just regular holiday cards. . . . we just have to keep it simple for now. Hurry and send them now! It takes some time to go through all of “that red tape” crap. 🙄

      • I too have sent large manilla envelopes and know that they all got to her. The only mail ever returned to me was when I failed to put her ADC number in the address. (I don’t know how many Jodi Arias’s they have at Lumley but I guess the rules are the rules.)

        • Bureaucrats, Justus. Thanks Justus and alan. I see, according to SJ’s information (on second reading) that greeting cards may be sent if they are less than 8.5 x 11 inches so I’ll send Jodi a Xmas card. I’m also sending that article about that conviction that got overturned because the prosecutor called a defendant a liar and other names (prejudicing the jury) and the trial judge didn’t intervene. If, for any reason, Perryville doesn’t accept the Xmas card or the legal information, I’ll type it out and send it in a #10 envelope.

  17. Jodi had 4 different public defenders in the 14 months prior to Nurmi being assigned the case. How easy for a sneaky, underhanded jerk of a prosecutor to hide evidence. The visit to computer room in June 09 and then a couple of months later, there is another change in counsel.

    At arraignment – James Hann.
    9/19/08 – Maria L Schaffer & Judis R. Andrews
    12/18/08 – Maria L Schaffer & Gregory T Parzych.
    5/22/09 – defendant submitted a request for a change of counsel.
    6/19/09 – Schaffer and her co-counsel looked at the computer in a room with Deputy Maricopa County Attorney Juan Martinez and Mesa police Det. Esteban Flores.
    8/10/09 – the Court received and reviewed a motion from both public defenders to withdraw from representing the defendant. The Court found sufficient cause to allow them to withdraw and noted that the trial was set for February 2, 2010 so there is adequate time for new counsel to be assigned without putting the trial date in jeopardy.
    8/18/09 – Victoria E Washington and Kirk Nurmi appear as counsel along with Maria Schaffer and Gregory Parzych at evidentiary hearing re Aggravating factor re death penalty.
    8/18/09 – Victoria E Washington (secondary) and Kirk Nurmi (primary) are assigned as new defense counsel.

  18. Now fat boy complains about not making enough $$$….how old is this guy and can he not do math? he took a job and knew what the pay …WAS! As for defendants being difficult…WOW that says it all. A good lawyer must be able to defend his worst ENEMY…like or hate has nothing to do with justice or does it …NOW. Casey A. got away with murder the haters say but this one JODI….no way. RAMP UP the hate 24/7…..imagine the cost to railroad Her and the $$$ it made for hln and the rest of them two faced things.But what of the cost to justice…should We the people put the show to the trial next time a politician is charged and scream and shout him or her down…ask any Would You want to be tried like Her? And if they say YES…call for a Dr. they really need help.How many times in that trial did hln put so-called EXPERTS on…body language…the way She spoke,too many ums…WTF is that ?SALEM MASS?How many poor souls have lost their lives to such evil….Crazy julie and her I see things…but idiots eat that crap up.As for the jury questions I thought the..HOSPITAL…forgot to lock it’s door.The jury showed their hate and with glee and they got to talk to one another before the case went to …the jury….each day of trial they were asked….have you talked to any one about this trial……gee judge isn’t that what the questions …ALLOW.What a great system for the state…maybe a judge should have asked a few questions to the state witnesses…are you lying or do you have convenient memory problems or BOTH. And to the jury…stand up and own this question and take a CONTEMPT charge.Is it to much to ask any to do their job?

  19. The COA rejected Jodi’s lawyers’ arguments that the Attorney General should not have been given access to sealed trial material by a Superior Court judge without their being notified and allowed to object. No reason given. It seems the panel may have simply accepted the AG’s statement that the investigation has nothing to do with Jodi’s appeal.

  20. “Beyond Punishment: A Miami Herald Investigation” is a 3-part series (continued on Wednesday & Friday) on the sexual and psychological abuse of female inmates by guards and of inmates dying under mysterious circumstances at Florida’s Lowell Correctional Institution, the largest women’s prison in the USA with 2,700 inmates.
    http://media.miamiherald.com/static/media/projects/2015/beyond-punishment/index.html

    I just read Part 1. It’s pretty horrific. I don’t know how Perryville stacks up against other prisons in the USA. I don’t know how Jodi is treated in Perryville by guards or by other inmates. I have heard rumors she is liked by other inmates. Jodi doesn’t seem to complain about her conditions. But, I don’t know if she could complain even if she wanted to since she is in a powerless position as an inmate. She seems to adapt and withstand intolerable conditions that would have me climbing up the walls. I suspect her “celebrity” and support (financial and emotional) from friends – like us – protects her from abuse at present but I don’t know this to be a fact. The Miami Herald article provides a look at the inside of one prison. I hope it is an aberration but I expect it is not.

  21. nurmilaw.com Kirk Nurmi discloses he has stage 3 cancer. I am not sure if it has already been posted but he indicates he found a lump in August and has had surgery and chemo. I wonder of the stress and its impact on his health. Anyway no matter what one feels about his effort on Jodi’s case, it is not great to see anyone go through the fight for their own life in the form of cancer.

    • Judy, there’s some discussion at the bottom of the Happy Thanksgiving page. I know that I saw an interview of Nurmi talking about it, but I simply cannot find it now. He spoke optimistically and said he felt well.

      There definitely is a link between stress and the autoimmune system, which the lymphatics are a part of.

      • Thanks CCarol. The dynamics that continue swirling around with these people are most interesting. Life is so unpredictable and it is amazing to me how one’s body deals with stress until it can’t any more. Big lessons in how much human beings can absorb and deal with, even when they look like they are coping quite well. As the Christmas season approaches, wishing all good health and peace.

  22. CC53…I too would be crawling the walls….that’s why I told a pal ,I would trust that young woman with My life ,She is a true BRAVE HEART. Unlike a lot of men I’ve worked. I could hear his heart break when he heard this…. Remember She faced an abuser once and survived and will again if the need be…..as She told ryan in that interview. Be it in prison or the street NO ONE HAS THE RIGHT TO ABUSE ANYONE…and when good folks stand up for HER and themselves it will end. This I don’t care what happens to them(P’s) shows TRUE EVIL and I will out any and all who do such…We all should.Yes no one should have to get cancer but some do….so just maybe spend more time getting better then trying to make money and harm a former client. Who would ever trust him again..? Maybe in the end he’ll see what harm he really did….this i saved her…..LWOP just takes longer…what an idiot. CC53 You are so right on being there for Jodi…..imagine what it must be like to have no one on Your side other then family….and according to kn they lie too! So k You can prove that…RIGHT? Keep talking pal and you might get a court date.

  23. ♥♥♥ DON’T FORGET TO SEND JODI & HER FAMILY PRAYERS, LOVE AND POSITIVE THOUGHTS FOR THE CHRISTMAS SEASON!♥♥♥

    “Christmas gift suggestions: to your enemy, forgiveness. To an opponent, tolerance. To a friend, your heart. To a customer, service. To all, charity. To every child, a good example. To yourself, respect.”
    ~ Oren Arnold

    ♥ ALSO, IT’S A GREAT TIME TO DONATE TO JODI’S APPELLATE FUND! ♥ FREE JODI AZ!!!

  24. Many of my 25 questions are ones that I had hoped Nurmi, during his closing argument In the first trial, was going to put before the jury. I don’t think these are obscure questions that might never come to mind unless, of course, you are among the many who already knew The Truth and didn’t need to ask questions.

    http://justice4jodi.wikispaces.com/Summary#Questions

    I was appalled at his closing – this mousey argument punctuated with the fact that he also hates Jodi. Nurmi is apparently someone (and he verifies it in his book) who already knew The Truth.

  25. Ah the walmart gal…first she DIDN’T find anything….then on second thought or is that trial….the store moved and not to sure if all the cash terminals did too…who knows what got miss placed…duh. Now I would ask all to view it as this …just how far would dear old walmart go to prove She returned the KERO can? I remember old ford and the pinto problem…FIREBALLS,as the gm1/2 ton trucks doing the FIREBALL also.What’s in it for us?Imagine all the money walmart may have lost helping Her?Corps DO put $$$ first until caught.But did walmart gal show up with a lawyer in tow as a man of faith did…I guess GOD on your side is not enough. As for the …BOOT PRINT….well that’s not going to help us….said THE STATE….it’s all about the win…don’t let truth or facts ever get in the way. The whole case is based on JEALOUSY…..well if that’s what it is you do need a jury of hate….if any woman wants a man dead….just tell him and show him what he’s missing…most men I know of would kill themselves…..or the WOMAN over that…I wonder if pants on fire ryan was brought up as t-dog just had to know….ALL.Few men I know want woman to date others then have a melt down when they do….Really was the dog ever a man? Who knows what went on in that house after She left and by who…..as they say cleanliness is next to…GOD. Would She even have time to do all that clean up? 4+ days is a long time.

    • That does not fit the 2006 statistics in this summary — http://www.bjs.gov/index.cfm?ty=tp&tid=23 — which says that only two-thirds of felony defendants in the 75 largest US counties are convicted “eventually,” and most of those charged were released before trial. The figure I’m familiar with is that 95% of all convictions come from plea bargains. I would be surprised if 95% of criminal trials result in conviction, since guilty defendants have a strong incentive to avoid trial, pleading guilty to a lesser offense in order to be sure of a milder sentence.

      • It sounds like we need clarity on what “95% of cases end in conviction” actually means. Does that mean 95% of all cases that go to trial end in conviction? Or does it mean 95% of those charged are convicted, which would include those who take a plea deal?

      • Thank you Alan. Sunny’s comment related to the hung jury mistrial in Baltimore and she did not explain her statement. I didn’t know where to start looking to check. Are there stats that are more recent? People and the world have changed a lot since 2006.

      • As I search further, it seems that in 2002, in 75 counties embracing half of all reported US crimes, the acquittal rate at trial for felonies in general was 22%. However, murder was a special case, with a much smaller acquittal rate at trial — either 2% or 6%, I can’t tell from the summary which. So I guess I was mistaken.

        However, conviction presumably includes conviction on lesser offenses. So the stats wouldn’t mean that 95% or 98% of defendants who go to trial on M1 charges get convicted of M1. The stats I found also include nonjury, or bench, trials.

        • Doesn’t surprise me. M1 cases are probably only brought to court with fairly solid evidence, and also after people have failed to reach a plea bargain. So a 95-98% conviction rate is probably not surprising.

      • Actually conviction rates once cases are filed are extremely high. The 2012 rate for federal criminal rates was over 90% but of the cases filed 97% ended in a plea deal. Only 3% of all federal criminal cases filed actually ended up in people going to court. This actually rather interesting if you look at the numbers:

        Assume 1000 cases were filed and the conviction rate was 90%. It means 900 people were convicted. Of the people convicted 97% pled out the case – which means that 830 people settled for a plea bargain, or that 170 people went to court. But the total number of people convicted was 900. Which means that 100 out of the 170 people who went to court were acquitted. That means if you have a defense the chances are like 58% that you will be acquitted!

        State courts typically have lower conviction rates.

    • I think it was 20/20 where I saw that 95% of the murder cases get overturned on appeals because of the way Arizona prosecutes their cases. They were talking about a case that was similar to JODI’s and the murder was in Arizona. They didn’t cite JODI’s case or compare it to her case either. But I saw it right at the time JODI’s trial was taking place before her sentencing. So I know JODI will be free again sooner than later. NO DOUBT

  26. No, you made an arithmetic error somewhere in the computation. The source I assume you’re using (footnote 4 in Wikipedia article, “Conviction rate”) gives the following figures for 2012 Federal cases:

    87,709 defendants’ cases terminated
    80,963 defendants convicted (pled or found guilty) = 93% conviction rate on cases filed
    78,647 defendants pled guilty, before or during trial = 97% of those convicted
    2,655 defendants went to trial, or 3% of all defendants.

    Subtracting the third figure from the second gives

    2,316 defendants convicted, but not by plea — therefore, by trial verdict

    Subtracting 2,316 from 2,655, we find that 339 of the 2,655 defendants who went to trial were not convicted by trial verdict, for an acquittal rate of at most 339/2,655 = 13%.

  27. Thanks you guys. These stats certainly point out the difference between federal courts and Maricopa. Federally, 97 percent of cases are settled in a plea deal whereas in Maricopa, all three of Nurmi’s cases ended up in court. Even with odds like these, prosecutors still feel the need to cheat.

  28. Really it just does not matter if it’s 95% or higher the real thing is why…..NO ACCOUNTABILITY from GOV. In any court why is it SOME can break all the rules? 23 jurors would now be in prison if they were asked …just how did you convict Her….this is proven in any interview they have given…they judged ONLY on hate, vile ,and STATE lies…..and proud of it. Even a JUDGE has showed the world how he hates Her….guilt was never in doubt…talk about contempt of court and that’s what these things did…in contempt there is no trial just jail….Unless You have proof of just what You believe….lets say calling that trial a SHOW TRIAL…well just look to Germany WW2 and the old U.S.S.R. I believe that az. surpassed them two nations for true evil….unless they don’t have to follow the U.S. CONSTITUTION…..Convictions rates will always be high when there is NO ACCOUNTABILITY….why not? Who would not want to play GOD….see paul sanders the 13th juror and his know all mindless way….it thinks it was sent from above to AVENGE all who he deems saints…You know like a man? who talks of 12 yr. olds…but only 3 times in just one min……sorta like eddie snell in Al. at a ppl talking about KILLING….some haters think? that’s so …funny. Was t-dog a PEDO? well lets look at this with an open mind……3 times he spoke…about 12 yr. olds….always wanted the braids when they were alone…..when eles did She ever wear the braids other then a child? ( I.ve not seen that.) As for the p/c and nothing found…LOL. Well that’s what the state tried to do by messing with it. Seems much evidence of porn was found or why would tiny blame the defence team for messing with it UNDER police control…if nothing is there don’t worry about it tiny. Sounds to Me like a guy walking down the highway just happens to walk into a porn shop…..a LOT! opps! t-dog made another mistake…JUST like calling an 8 yr old…on that highway…gee did this guy have bad luck or what just liked FISHING for small fry…and children. I can hear the haters go nuts….right about now…PRAISE T-DOG…he who LOVED all children…SOUNDS RIGHT to Me….if abusing children is love….NEVER! Always making excuses for an excuse of a man…don’t hate him just pity him…as a bishop told Me…that young man has a lot to answer for…as I said …YES HE DOES. This GOV. and the need to win….apply that to a budget sometime!

  29. Its so obvious that all the mormons bought/paid for this cheating cover up and conviction of Jodi!:( they were already in the spot lights for scams and child molestation! Travis was out of control and they knew it! Im sure they got a ear full from the angry father of the 8 yr old that travis called/text. Travis was the dragon that chewed off his own tail including theirs and their daughters! Frog and all the rest of the states type o’s ,lost lap tops “must have” been bribed! In a real court all that so called evidence would of been thrown out! They were puppets, well paid at that! Its sickening to see Jodi’s defense playing patty cake, laughing with each other instead of digging up the truth clearing Jodi in a clear case of physical, mental self defense case! I choose to believe and hang on to Joe’s meaningful words!:))) http://youtu.be/9oZXJD1NYW0 #1SJ-TEAM JODI FFJ

    • Not all Mormons are against Jodi. I come here to read about how Jodi is doing and then see Mormon hate. I guess this is not a site for all Jodi supporters. You all complain about the Jodi hate out there by people who don’t know Jodi, but you spew Mormon hate having never met every Mormon, having never met me. Have you ever thought you might be driving some of Jodi’s supporters away? Some people might read some of these posts and think they are Jodi’s personal views and not like what they see. I know, all comments are moderated and mine won’t pass the test and will not be posted even though I am not a “pedo-hugger”. That is okay. Maybe I will give you something to think about.

      • Yes Penny, you gave us another way to look at things with the Mormon faith but here at JAII we have mainly dealt with the “Lying for the Lord Mormons” that have raised Travis Alexander to Sainthood. We haven’t heard from to many Mormons who dare to speak favorably for Jodi. It really is a shame since she entered your faith with an open heart ♥ Good to know that there are still some who will bother to think for themselves. Thanks Penny, and have a wonderful Christmas. ♥

  30. Well Pam I am glad You are open minded…so very nice to see Your post. But I must say this….anyone who hides behind any book of faith is LOST. Often I have heard from speakers…We must always protect the church….this is the one true church….well then it would not need protecting would it. I have talked to more then a few Mormons on this and have caught most in a lie or they just would not answer simple questions. I asked the bishop why travis was not kicked out of the church…excommunicated…well he’s dead…but the church does baptise….THE DEAD…right? That’s different. Really? What man of faith talks of children as that man did and still gets a pass from a church…makes one wonder. Once an elder claimed he knew nothing of the case other then Her name and what She had done…1 month later We met and he had been vetted well on this case while on his MISSION! That is against the rules. I visited the church more then a few times and oh my what a look of hate. And my how the leaders avoided Me for the most part…strange for that group. The church proved it’s problem when that bishop had a lawyer in tow…I would expect that from the mob,….but as We know behind every lynch there is a mob. From what I know She has never spoken out against any church and on this page these are our words and thoughts and in my case spelling and grammar mistakes…LOL haters did I make your day…..I for one would love to argue Her case against tiny….I’d show the world what a true creep it is….he must make his folks sick. This is what works for the state….sad. We try to speak for Her and bring truth to this injustice. There are only two sides to this case…a fair trial or a show trial…PICK ONE. As for every Mormon…odd how a faith that has suffered much abuse…LEARNS. What person of faith would ever want to bring harm to Her? Have You as others not heard his vile words of hate and seen his hateful actions as eddie and PLEASE don’t call killing people a joke…it is not ever a joke. As for Our hate …really I do not see it in a body bag or calling a man who has talked about children the way he did…to Me it’s his truth and sad it is ,and one day I must forgive that very troubled young man who was lost.Please never view their sites unless You really want hate as that’s all they know. I for one and I believe most Thank You for Your post…..as for the trolls…..move on.

  31. I love reading The Griz’s comments! He so has a way with words :))) he is BOLD, WISE AND HAS GREAT STRENGTH!!! What a wounderful heart/soul , God Sent.. HE IS/Has !!! (((GRIZ)))

  32. I am so very excited!! I received my first letter from Jodi yesterday. I will not go into detail of what she wrote, but I am a bit concerned for her. I will just say that her words were so very loving and caring toward my family and I. How anyone could dislike her is beyond me. Happy Holidays to all!!

  33. Not two bad four a drop out…rite…LOL Well Me gots to give the haters some thing…I only have two fingers for that….o I’m gonna get it for that. R. Love and Pam…in My heart! It’s good when one’s heart grows….tiny will never know that feeling…NO HEART. I hear that jamean is having him for Xmas dinner….BURP out the hate. she’s a woman…right?I know it’s not a …man….birds of a feather do flock together…right. When We get Our letters or cards or calls from Jodi…how the sun does shine….and with that We just must work so much more for Her and JUSTICE. No game for Us. So to all a good time this Christmas,Peace Happiness and Much Love,and good will to men and more good will to WOMEN. And as for some of My posts…gee I’m new at this thing….and I though I was done with this …learning…LOL(once I thought that was LOTS OF LOVE.)Duh!As for Our Jodi…this time of year is hard on most….but trust Me on this each and every kind word We send does make it so much better…She knows that She is surrounded by LOVE. Now who would not want that…..hmm…LOL…well then We should pity them…just a bit. I for one know Her new year will start out just great….$OON! Bless You all.

  34. Dizzyingly enough; wading through all the reasonable doubts; none of which, were entered into the bogus trial, for a higher court, to throw out this travesty… I note again, the minor detail, of a five year concealment of exculpatory evidence, while the spastic hypnonauseating, carnival act, Manchurian Marionette Martinez, entrances the braindead judge, and the jury dullards, with his dancing with the stars, audition, there’s the significance of the fact that, five years of the representations, that netted an interstate kidnapping under color of law, claiming that Jodi, in order to equal Travis’s martial arts advantage, had to have shot him, first. Actual evidence proves as known all along, while embezzling Jodis,’ five years, that, as I preached for years, there were no gunpowder particulates found in the combined blood handprint, proving that, Jodi had not fired a gun, and in no way could have overpowered, Travis; but, a Ninja could have taken him down and out, within the less than two minute time frame…as stamped on the pictures, Jodi, took, that were good enough for the spaz, to lie about, claiming she dropped the camera, so, she must have been the one holding it…. Finally, after five years of the three stooges perjury of process, all three recanted, after the spaz, ratted himself out for inventing the gunshot first soap opera, disproven, also by the fact of the ejected bullet shell, landing upon dried blood, leaving no blood smear, on the brass, or, indentation in the blood dried island; proving that these were two crimes, as opposed to one contiguous crime, as if, the precision kill, was followed up, five days after the fact, then, laundered by the theatrical, pecking away stabbings, and, a gunshot, none, of which bled, because, dead bodies don’t bleed….floating the lie that, ” validated,” the extradition, the spaz, recanted, to confess to the three stooges, perjurial antics, at law, backpeddling the prosecutorial format, then and there, admitting, that the gunshot was last, so, how did a130 pound girl, overpower a martiart kickboxer, weighing in at over 200 pounds, fighting for his life…??? Not a chance, and, do note that the two governors, were not petitioned to rescind the interstate kidnapping at law, and two million dollar ransom demand, despite the three stooges,’ confession to their orchestrated, and, suborned perjuries; at law… The socalled trial, then was continued 180 degrees from the scene one soap opera, in reverse, as if no matter which back to back, perjuries, the three stooges, recant, to reverse, innocense is no excuse, there in Wonderland, Arizona…. Seven years, many of us have posted, proofs, that, the three million dollar defense bribe, kept from any appellate court reversal; and that may be why they haven’s issued arrest warrants, for all these thieves…. Free Jodi, and, arrest them all….Snidely….Edgrrr…

  35. …………..Martial arts kickboxer, I meant; and, this conspiracy of process, was floated on by, as the, hohum, braindead judge bleated not a gasp; and, ditto, the Sheeple on thje jury. Also, not a bleat out of the Feds, jurisdiction over kidnappiong, and, the two governors, all, allowing the spaz, to repudiate his own made up lies at law, then, to sleaze off into the opposite tirade, without any investigation as to the spaz, doublecrossing, the other two, leaving them stranded before the court, to make feeble noises about being misunderstood….without, ratting out the spaz for, his bright idea, involving them, in his theatrics, holding a girl hostage, while “the system,” tries to grow evidence….Now, how many eons will go by, while the lizards, sleaze…??? Snidely…Edgrrr….

  36. The trial was a nullity, because, the initial soap opera, was perjured into existance, as was the second trial, in reverse of the admittedly recanted soap opera….of scene one… as cessation of the primary format, was terminated; voiding, a reversed soap opera, without, another arrest, and all the due process rights, to validate even, a first arrest; then recanted, and, on to a second arrest, which never happened…. while the spaz, tapdanced his dancing audition, performing, for the stacked jury, and, brain dead judge….First arrest abandoned; second trial, based upon the same recanted format, as if, two wrongs make a right, there, in the twilight zone…..Snidely…. Edgrrr….

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