Justice For The Living [by Sirlips]

Here’s an awesome post from regular contributor Sirlips. Enjoy…

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Before I start, let’s be clear on why this case is such a big deal. You may think that people care because a man lost his life, that shouldn’t have had to die. You may think it’s important because it’s a death penalty case and a woman may lose her life. You may even think it’s become such a popular case because of the involvement with the “weird” Mormon faith, young good-looking people or the high drama prosecutor. None of these things are the real reason. Hundreds of young men died during this trial, no one paid much attention to them. It’s not about the death penalty, last year 43 people were executed and 3,146 people were on death row waiting to be executed, yet entertainment media was not dramatizing each of them 24/7. I would guess that there is not a single national entertainment media rep that had heard of JM, gave a shit about the fruity Mormons or needed to travel to AZ to find good looking victims/accused people. No, none of these things are the reason this trial has brought on the attention of the masses.

“So”, you may ask, “what are the real reasons”?

I believe there are 3: The first is S the second is E and the third is X. It’s that simple. Sex. Sex sells and the entertainment media jumped all over it. Ass humping, cock blowing, pussy eating, salad tossing, “tie you to a tree and ass rape you” SEX.

So, now that we know why most people are here, or “over there”, please allow me to tell you why I am here… Justice.

Its cliché, but it is the truth. I have not and never will consider this to be about “justice for Travis Alexander”. He is dead. I do not believe there is such a thing as justice for a dead person.  No matter the outcome, the dead person will still be dead. A guilty verdict will not change that. I suppose some may think this is wrong, but then I suppose those same people must think that the person is waiting in the after life for redemption. How else can the dead get justice? Well I don’t believe in god. I don’t believe in the after life. Sorry, but I don’t believe in fairy tales about a carpenter that did magic tricks like walking on water or turning water in to wine. And, if there IS a god, I doubt that this wonderful God would say “murder is soooo wrong, that if you do it…I’ll murder you”, regardless of what some HUMAN poet wrote in a book 1600 years ago and labeled it “the bible”. (or, the lizard alien man from zooloo, if you’re Mormon)  Call me a dick, but at I’m more concerned with the living. I believe in humanity.

So, I’m looking for justice for the living. A small part of that is for the Travis Alexander family, a small part of that is for Jodi Arias and her family, but mostly it is for our society.

This case, because of the huge amount of public access, has given me an inside look at how our justice system works, or doesn’t work, depending on your point of view. There are a lot of aspects to this case, a lot of personalities and a lot of rules to consider. This truly was, in my opinion, the “perfect storm” of cases.

Anyway…back to the sex: (I gotta keep the readers involved)…

So, are you all ready for the MASTER DEBATE? Juan has RAMMED his own testimony down the juror’s DEEP THROAT’s. The Judge has SCREWED the case up. The defense has  PULLED OUT every stop. Now the jury gets to decide who is FUCKED. Trust me, regardless of the outcome, someone is going to feel like they got fucked.

(now back to our regularly scheduled program)

My need for justice is simple. I take it very serious that MY laws are being used to judge this defendant. This legal system is run in my name. Just as it is ran in your name. We are the people they are taking about in “We The People”. This is real, this is OUR law.  I have the right to voice how this system should run. I would go even one step farther and say I have a responsibility to voice how the system is run. I vote. I chose these laws. I created or help maintain what was already created in the law when I became an adult in this society. We are a republic/democracy. I paid these people that are working for “us”. This is my responsibility.

I have never spoken out about it, as I didn’t know. Now I have a chance to know. So I have a responsibility to speak up if it is broken.

If a person is convicted unjustly, and I stayed silent, I am no better than a bomber in Boston, a Ricin letter sender or any other murderer. We have to get this right, don’t we? It’s not enough to just let the jury members take the responsibility of this. That’s not fair to them. These court cases are being decided by juries deliberating on behalf of all of us. Supposedly (wink wink) they will not read this until after the trial, but maybe the next juror on the next trial will read it now.

So here it is, my “voice” after seeing how things really work: “Holy shit balls, this thing is broken! Not cracked, not chipped, its full on drunk bitch falling off the bar BROKEN.”

My message to the prosecutor, defense, Jodi and Jury:

The prosecutor: I almost feel like this is a practical joke or a reality series on MTV where it involves real people but most of the drama is staged for entertainment purposes. Is this guy for real? Who hired this guy to yell at a defendant? Who asked this guy to manipulate the questions to get a specific response? Who decided this guy, above all others, should become executioner? I sure as hell didn’t. It’s not his job to “punish” her.

Juan Martinez - Jodi Arias Is Innocent - com

I hear Pro Pros saying things like “how do you expect him to treat a murderer”? What? Go back to bed, your mom is getting cold, hillbilly fucktard. I expect him to treat her like EVERYONE ELSE. She is not guilty until AFTER the trial is over, if ever. He is an officer of the court, if he doesn’t internalize this as a core belief, he shouldn’t be in that position. Is this part of his “master plan”? Somehow he will elicit a wanted response from the witness or the jury? We have a name for that, it’s called a “trick”. If you have to use tricks, then you should not be prosecuting murders, rapists, terrorists or jay walkers. I don’t care if it works or not. Your job isn’t to “make” a person guilty, your job is to prove a guilty person is guilty.

If this means that sometimes a guilty person walks, so that an innocent person doesn’t get convicted, FINE. I would rather release 1000 murderers than convict 1 innocent person. You don’t have to like this, but you also don’t have to live in this country. Pack your shit skippy, get on a boat, and head across the big pond to a place that doesn’t have these ideals. These are the ideals of a free country. If an innocent person gets convicted it is “society sanctioned murder” and just because I don’t pray to Buddha, doesn’t mean I don’t have morals or ethics. Murder is WRONG, and that would be murder.

(since the prosecutor doesn’t listen very well to long winded rants, I’ll shorten it up for him)

Mr. Martinez, I did not hire you to convict Jodi Arias. I hired you to provide facts that prove she murdered, so that a jury can convict her. You are NOT the jury. You are an officer of OUR (that includes Jodi Arias’) court, if you can’t do that, find a new job. You have a talent, its just not intended for this setting.

The Defense attorneys: Unlike the prosecutor or the judge, you did not have a choice in taking this case. I commend you for your efforts. I can’t say I agree with everything you have or have not done. But I think you played the hand you have been dealt, as good as anyone could have. The fact is, your case really doesn’t mean much to me. I don’t care what Jodi said, she lied, and so now we cant trust her. (I would have lied too…I would have done a better job, but the fact is I don’t blame her for lying) In fact, If she had not lied, I still wouldn’t trust her. She is trying to save her life. That would be enough reason for me to lie, anyone that says they wouldn’t do the same is….lying.

Jennifer Willmott & Kirk Nurmi - Jodi Arias Is Innocent - com

The truth is, this case is only about the state proving that certain things happened, not the defense trying to prove they didn’t. If the defense can “disprove” things, that’s all the better, but it is not needed. You have “disproved” several things and added GREAT doubt to many other things that I may have considered “proof” until you gave us an alternative to consider. You did your jobs.

Jodi: You are a fruitcake. LOL. But, so am I. Strange behavior doesn’t mean shit to me. Do back flips, cartwheels, and handstands all day. What does that have to do with this trial? I didn’t know that flipping your hair, doing hand stands and/or singing shows anything other than you are different than most people. I wouldn’t have done these things, but I’m pretty sure I would have done something else most people would have found “strange”. THE GOOD NEWS… We don’t convict people just because they are the tilted picture on the wall. Truth is, put the magnifying glass on most people, like they did you, and your actions would probably seem pretty damn vanilla. (keep in mind, we live in a country where 14% of the population believes in Bigfoot…look it up)

Jodi Arias - Jodi Arias Is Innocent - com

You killed a man, or at least you tell us you did, and I believe that is probably true. I am not convinced it was not self-defense. (Re-read that, the wording is very important). You may have murdered a man, you may have planned AND murdered a man, you may have been set up by aliens and the farmer with the mask on from Scooby Doo… But no one has shown me proof of any of those things. I would find you not guilty of Pre-meditated murder. I would find you not guilty of Felony Murder. I would find you not guilty of Murder 2. I cannot answer, until instructions are read on Friday, if I would find you guilty of Manslaughter. At this point I would find the self-defense theory as possible, so I would acquit, but I am still not 100% clear on the “over kill” instruction with self-defense. I do believe that it is possible that the overkill can be explained with “snapping”.

I used the example of Mel Gibson in the movie “The Patriot” as a good example of how a person could start swinging and just not be able to stop…not out of hate, but out of an accumulation of feelings all pouring out into one displaced and uncontrollable  action. (Click here to see what I’m talking about.) This is a good man that has been pushed to the brink. He is a good father. A good lover. A good friend. He also is a brutal killer, when the emotions finally catch up to him and he has to defend himself and his family.

I don’t know if you are this “good person”. How could I? I don’t know you. It’s not our job to judge this about you anyway. We don’t find people innocent/guilty just because we think you are good/bad. As humans, we will guess and assume, but that has nothing to do with this trial.

Jury: I sure wish you could read this, but you all had to “pinky swear” not to, so I’ll pretend like you can, just like I’m sure some of you are pretending like you can’t.

Think of the evidence on a scale. Does the “hair color change” alone prove guilt? Of course not, so we give it a 10 % chance that it was real proof. Can you convict Jodi JUST on the gas cans, if there was no other evidence? No, so we give that a 20% chance that it proved murder. Can you convict Jodi on the gun theft alone? Of course not, so lets say that would be proof 70% of the time. You DON’T get to add up 10+20+70 to get one piece of evidence that is 100% proof. There is a chance 21% chance that each were all wrong. If that chance is 1/10,000 then it’s Possible. 100 items that turned out to be real proof 99% of the time, is not enough. You only need 1 item that shows 100% proof. What is that item? If you don’t have 1..just ONE, then you cannot convict.

The Jurors - Jodi Arias Trial - Jodi Arias Is Innocent - com

Look at it this way:

Your job, as OUR jury, is not to consider what is “probable”. You are tasked with thinking about what is “possible”. These two words may seem similar. They may even mean the same thing to some. However they could not be more different from each other.

Is it POSSIBLE that Jodi didn’t pre-meditate this crime? I don’t care if you “think” she did it, I simply ask that you be honest with yourself and ask that question….”is it POSSIBLE?” You find it “very hard to believe”, that means it is possible. You can say to yourself “it is extremely unlikely”… but that means it is possible.

Is the Jodi arias story “probable”? It does not matter one bit. You are not asked to judge this based on what’s “probable”. The story only needs to be “possible”.

What are the odds that ALV was correct on her diagnosis of abuse? 1 in 5? 1 in 10? 1 in 100? If it is 1 in a million, that means it is STILL “possible”.

What are the chances that Dr. S was correct about PTSD? 1 in 10? 1 in 100? If it is 1 in a million, then it is STILL “possible”.

What are the chances that Dr. D was WRONG? 1 in 5? 1 in 10? Even if she gets it wrong only 1 out of 100 times…It is still possible.

Say it with me jury…”IT IS POSSIBLE, regardless of how improbable.”

In our court of law we have another name for “it is possible”. We call it “reasonable doubt”.

Thank You SJ for inviting me to post today’s lead post. Regardless of what people on “the other side” may think, this site is a great thing. It provides for thought provoking debate. Critical thinking about the legal system and a place for those not bitten by the hate bait entertainment media to just say what is on their mind without being attacked by small minded, mean and ugly spirited people. We all thank you!

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Leave your comments below…

SJ
Team Jodi

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Comments

  1. Al says:

    !st.

  2. Al says:

    Good morning everybody.

    Morning music. It’s cowboy polka time

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9YE7mOuf5sU

  3. Debbie says:

    Wonderful post Sirlips Thank you :)

  4. FLNANG says:

    Justice is the most important thing in this case. I agree with Sirlips that Jodi may be a fruitcake but you don’t convict someone because they’re a fruitcake. I hope there’s justice in this case.

    • Lura says:

      I like fruitcake:-) and believe in God! Pray for God’s Will to be done. I believe with all my heart Jodi will be free soon. Praise God!

    • geebee2 says:

      Jodi at that point in her life was very mistaken about many things, especially Travis.

      But as we grow older, we gain experience, and start to discern what is good and what is bad.

  5. BeeCee says:

    holy smokes! i missed this awesome post by sirlips!

    Thank you for making it a page SJ!

    We truly have some fabulous writers on this forum.

  6. cindy jewell says:

    SJ.. Talk about a wake up call. We all needed that thank you…

  7. cindy jewell says:

    Sirlip… Thank you for putting it all in perspective. This was brilliant.

  8. joan kamen says:

    a very intelligent commentary by sirlips. This trial was promoted by Insession and HLN long before
    it began, much like we promote the Super Bowl or the world Series. It had all the elements of
    a soap opera, but this is real life and Jodie s life is at stake.
    I have watched many trials and have never seen a prosecutor disrespect witnesses like this one
    does. There was not need to do this.

    I feel the defense attorneys did not represent Jodie as well as they could. They should have used a
    crime of passion defense. That is my opinion. I also believe that this never have been charges as a
    DP.I live near a big city and each week there are murders, very few are DP charged.If the people of Az.are
    unhappy with the cost then this is the biggest reason, it is a dP case

    • mzmollymack says:

      it is hard to say why they used this defense. It is possible that Jodi told them that she would not accept any responsibility for what happened and this was their only option with so much evidence.

      Not sure if you ever saw it but there was a video of a woman who tortured a man for days for being a snitch (not on anyone she knew or herself just in general). She told interviewers she was not sorry and she would do it again if she had the chance and she did not get the death penalty. If Jodi gets death (which I sincerely doubt) then it will confirm the magnitude of this case and that the jurors were unduly influenced by Nancy Grace types.

    • Heather1 says:

      Thank you sirlips, a great post. We all needed that but most of all I hope the jury needed it, too (but don’t tell judge inapickle) ;)

    • Wes says:

      joan, the defense is not limited to one defense, so they may add defenses for which there is supporting evidence
      also, as they can’t see into the future, they may add defenses as indicated during the trail
      i believe the defense has added the crime of passion defense

      the defense team has more than one defense for the jury to consider

      the jury’s job is as fact finder, to consider the truth of the evidence, it’s weight, credibility, relevance and other criteria

      then apply the law, as set out by the judge, to the facts of the case

      the law, includes the charges, and each element of each charge, and similarly all the defenses, and other pertinent law

      i do not know, nor would i presume to state the relevant law here

      this is only a general explanation

      next the judge will instruct the jury as to the burden of proof and on whom that onus is placed

      the judge instructs the jury that a special burden of proof is placed on the state throughout the entire trial, it never changes, and the jury must dismiss a charge if they find that the state has failed to prove any element of any of the charges, beyond a reasonable doubt

      separately the judge will advise the jury of the law on the defenses

      here there is a big difference, they are not mirror images of the other

      the defendant does not have to prove a defense to the same standard, it is much lower

      the defense has a duty to raise a defense, sometimes termed an affirmative defense, which once met, is placed on the state to disprove

      here are some links to start your research
      it is voluminous

      Legal burden of proof
      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Legal_burden_of_proof

      Self-defense (United States)
      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Self-defense_%28United_States%29

      Right of self-defense
      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Right_of_self-defense

      Zimmerman’s Low Burden of Proof on the Issue of Self Defense
      by Professor Will Huhn on April 13, 2012
      http://www.ohioverticals.com/blogs/akron_law_cafe/2012/04/zimmermans-low-burden-of-proof-on-the-issue-of-self-defense/

  9. Jennifer says:

    I said it before and I am saying it again I think some of the brightest individuals in the world post on this site. I have found more intelligent conversation on this page then I ever did in my law classes in college.
    Last night I was thinking about Jodi and how scared she had to of been. When I first looked at the post mortem photos of TA I wondered about the wounds on his back. When my ex would beat me many times he would have me pinned to the ground. So I am wondering if that is how TA got the wounds to his back…Did he have her pinned to the floor and somehow the knife was within her reach and she grabbed it and began stabbing him to get him off of her?

    • Bystander says:

      Agreed, agreed……some great minds post on this site. Definitely some intelligent folks here.

    • cindy jewell says:

      I have always thought that. if it didn’t happen that way the cuts what a been deeper. they wouldn’t be in the shopping pattern. Sense Jodi didn’t recall where the knife was left I’m going to say it was in the bathroom. Travis grabbed it and came after her. That’s all I think is probable. I’m still leaning towards someone else being there.

    • BeeCee says:

      Jennifer, some of us here do think that is how the back wounds happened.

      I have seen you post before and I’m glad you found this site…and glad you are not with that ex anymore.

      • maria rigadopoulou says:

        geebee’s exquisite work on the back wounds made it much clearer to understand what happened during the fight and why the cluster of 9 wounds was more like chop wounds than deep back stab wounds.

    • The wounds are shallow so I believe it is the best explanation.

      If his back were to her the wounds would be deeper, IMO.

      I definitely don’t deny the possibility of someone else being there either.

      • mzmollymack says:

        I know that this was implied by the defense when Horn was originally questioned. I think that both sides made a mistake in focusing more on the emails and vacations than by talking about the actual sequence of events on the night in question. I hope that some nice little ribbons get tied up in closing arguments.

  10. maria rigadopoulou says:

    Thank you Sirlips for this really witty,on the spot post.It was an excellent read!

  11. Jennifer says:

    I mistening to a song by Eve. I am not typically a fan of rap music but this ong is an acception. Its aboutDomestic Violence. Here is a link to the song Its called Love is Blind.
    http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x15hvo_eve-faith-evans-love-is-blind_music

  12. Jennifer says:

    Sorry about typing errors. I am on bedrest and using an ancient laptop. My good computer I left in my car.

  13. Ann says:

    Great post.

  14. Janeen Russo says:

    Good morning, afternoon, evening…Sunday…..folks….

    SJ, AL, SR0606, ANN, MARIA (hugs), JENNIFER, CINDY J, BYSTANDER, BEECEE, JOAN KAMEN, FLNANG, and DEBBIE! :-)

  15. Bystander says:

    Is anyone else worried that if Jodie is convicted of a lesser charge, the Judge will impose the harshest and LONGEST possible sentence? Also, I have a question – will victim impact statements be read by the Alexander family regardless of the verdict reached? Or is that reserved for the DP?

    • maria rigadopoulou says:

      I dont trust a bit that Judge who will try to look as good as possible in the eyes of the public.She wants to be re-elected ,is that true?

    • Ginger says:

      Yes i don’t care for this Judge

    • Debbie says:

      As far as I am aware, victim impact statements are only made in the case of a death penalty but I could be wrong. Since they have spent so much time in chambers they have probably already let her know time and time again how they feel.

      • Debbie says:

        Sorry I think I am wrong there. Victim impact statements are reserved for the sentencing phase of the trial.

  16. Milan M says:

    I think that was an excellent post by Sirlips!
    This is the only place I’ve seen where people can post thinking posts. Any attempt to analyze the facts in a reasoned way is maniacally slapped down by the slavering, ravening masses.

    Thank goodness other people think the same thoughts about Juan Martinez as I’ve been thinking. Sirlips, you nailed it regarding JM. Who made him God? What gave him the right to disrespect people, and punish them just because he wants to win? Because for me, that’s all he’s about, is winning. He doesn’t care about the truth, he only cares about his ego, how he looks and most of all winning at all costs. It’s horrifying to me, that someone’s life could be at stake and he thinks he’s starring in a reality play.

    Plus, there are so many things that don’t add up, and don’t go along with what the media is screaming. One example, if Jodi is such a liar about everything, then why has she steadily maintained that Travis Alexander was so wonderful? I am being stalked every day, my property vandalized. The stalker’s favorite pastime has been trashing my reputation. I haven’t seen Jodi trashing TA’s reputation, at all, even now. Did she isolate him from his friends? No. But, he isolated her from her friends and family, and turned his friends against her. He was in the position of power, not Jodi.

    I’ve been in a situation that was similar, in a way. I married someone I met online. I went to his town, and his country. We had friends in common online. He started to tell lies about me behind my back to those mutual online friends, unbeknownst to me. Such as, that I thought this one lady friend was trying to flirt with him, which was a total lie. I was angry with him for talking to her trying to decide important things about our lives with her instead of me. So her anger festered for years and I had no idea why she was pulling back. I found out later he had done this with all of my “friends”.
    When we split up, after he tried to choke me and I called 911, he was arrested, etc., I had to minimize what he had done in order to safely get back home, out of the country. I had NO support, whatsoever. Everyone in the town was a friend of HIS (I had been dealing with a very difficult pregnancy, and had no energy left over to make new friends in the town where we lived). In exchange for getting out safely with my child, I made it so he got out of the arrest with less trouble than he should have. I had told NONE of our online friends about any of it, because I had sensed their attitudes, without knowing why.
    I left, allowing him to save face. I didn’t say what really happened. I told them that I had to leave because I did not have the opportunities for personal growth where we lived (the truth was, he was terribly abusive) and left it at that.
    Much later, he posted on a board that we both had frequented that I was “crazy”, etc.
    I wrote to those former friends, trying to clear a few things up and tell them what had really happened. That was one of the most naive, stupid mistakes I’ve ever made.
    Not one of them stood up for me. Not one of them believed me, because it went against their carefully constructed ideas of who he was, and who I was. (I had disagreed with their political idealogies on occasion)
    They all acted like they had been there in the house with me, throughout the relationship and they knew that I was a horrible, lying monster and he was a wonderful saint.
    I had thought they were reasonably intelligent. But I watched as they ignored facts and stampeded over everything in their determination to believe that I was evil and he was wonderful.
    That experience really opened my eyes to how people think, how they perceive things and how they can be manipulated.

    I can’t help but think that the same thing has happened here. It’s very scary, it’s unjust and unfair. It makes me think that most people are dumb animals with giant egos, and very few people can think their way out of a paper bag once they’ve made a snap judgement that helps them feel superior.

    Anyway, it’s nice to see people who stop and think, without stampeding along with the crowd.

    • maria rigadopoulou says:

      So nice to hear you escaped from that living hell Milan.The perspective and nature of things depends on who looks at them,I’m afraid.Meaning what’s true for one may be another person’s lie and vice versa.
      Jodi was trapped in such a situation and look where it has brought her to:a killing,years in prison,her name dragged through the mud,unimaginable pain.TA was a master manipulator not only when it came to Jodi herself but the entire ‘court’ of friends he so shrewdly convinced that the false reality and identity he had builr and projected for himself was indeed the true one.

      • Milan M says:

        Thankyou Maria. I am very glad I escaped it too. Many others are not so lucky, as you pointed out, Jodi Arias being one of them, I think.
        I think he was a “master manipulator”. One thing that I thought was very interesting when I saw this last ex-girlfriend talking – Linda – (the one he was supposed to have been planning on giving the ring to) was that she said she couldn’t support TA in his chosen field of “multilevel marketing”! LOL! It was the reason she gave for breaking up with him. I know what I think of multilevel marketing and pyramid schemes, it’s a big scam. Yet, TA was thriving in that “business”. Whereas, Jodi was unable to support herself when she became involved with it. I think she said it was the first time that she hadn’t been able to support herself when she was on her own. What does that say about the whole milieu?
        You would absolutely have to be good at scamming everybody to be involved in that mess.
        Another thing none of the lynch mob mentions, while they scream that she’s the worst monster that ever lived, is that Jodi was working very hard, many times at two jobs at a time, supporting herself throughout her life when she left home. Waitressing is a very hard job, requiring an excellent work ethic. Does anyone ever comment on that? They try to pin all of these horrible labels on her, I just don’t see it. It doesn’t fit in with the profile of someone who is a habitual, chronic liar and psychopath to be able to support themselves waiting on others.
        Just a few other thoughts I had on the subject.

        • Heather1 says:

          Oh Milan, I’m so very sorry you have been through that, so much of what Jodi went through, too, frighteningly similar.
          I hope all this is very much behind you now and you can have the life you deserve.

    • joujoubaby says:

      Welcome from me, Milan. My heart goes out to you. I wish you much success in your journey to healing.

      • Milan M says:

        Thankyou, Joujoubaby. I appreciate that very much. I am thankful, really, to have been able to get out and work on healing since then. You sound like you know something about the subject.

    • Nikki says:

      Milan, you wrote,

      “I left, allowing him to save face. I didn’t say what really happened. I told them that I had to leave because I did not have the opportunities for personal growth where we lived (the truth was, he was terribly abusive) and left it at that.
      Much later, he posted on a board that we both had frequented that I was “crazy”, etc.
      I wrote to those former friends, trying to clear a few things up and tell them what had really happened. That was one of the most naive, stupid mistakes I’ve ever made.
      Not one of them stood up for me. Not one of them believed me, because it went against their carefully constructed ideas of who he was, and who I was.”

      Milan, I hope you find a way to not regret addressing this man’s allegations against you. You had a right to protect your reputation, just as Jodi has a right to testify in her own defense.

      Thank you for joining the discussion here! I really think you went straight to the heart of some of the public’s reaction as it relates to DV when you wrote:

      “I watched as they ignored facts and stampeded over everything in their determination to believe that I was evil and he was wonderful.
      ……very few people can think their way out of a paper bag once they’ve made a snap judgement that helps them feel superior.”

      Those words of yours are so telling that I had to post them again. It is sad to me to think that some of those who call for Jodi’s execution might be people wanting to deny their own victimization by telling themselves that they are tougher than Jodi – that they could have indefinitely taken the insults and the blows, minimized the damage and then stoically covered up….and that their willingness to do so (or their having done so in the past) makes them “superior” to Jodi. They may have “carefully constructed” a belief that they are “good soldiers”, that they are more loving toward their abusive intimate partner than Jodi was towards Travis – because she doesn’t have enough scars to qualify for some type of medal of honor that might otherwise have been pinned on her.

      If Jodi had been willing to be mutilated, maimed, even killed, what then? Do the deniers present medals posthumously to those who did not survive DV?

      If someone suffers domestic violence or intimate partner abuse, the answer is not to minimize and cover up, or to blame someone in the defendant’s position by protesting that they themselves have suffered far more. Anyone who is enduring DV and is tempted to try to feel superior to Jodi Arias should watch this trial more carefully and listen to the expert defense witnesses. Perhaps they could then gain more understanding about their abuser, instead of buying into the prosecutor’s and tabloid media’s “carefully constructed ideas” about the defendant and the deceased in this case.

  17. Al says:

    Great post Sirlips.

    I think you’ve nailed it exactly. I don’t think we’ll ever really know what happened that day. If you believe Samuels and the Baby Doc, there is a possibility that at this moment there is no living person who knows what exactly happened. And that is the issue with this case.

    Scottish law allows three verdicts, guilty, not guilty and not proven. In my opinion this case falls squarely into the third category. And by the American system that is a Not Guilty. And that is what the jury has to see. Our rules for criminal procedure do not rest on concepts of guilt or innocence. The verdict is either guilty or not guilty, and the state has a burden to prove that guilt beyond a reasonable doubt. Proof for that guilt cannot be replaced by gut feelings, exclusions, probabilities, etc. It must be about as rock hard a proof as is humanly possible.

    So you put aside all flights of fancy, on both sides, look at the evidence as presented by both sides and determine, whether a reasonable person can say that there is no possibility that the states narrative could be wrong. If that is so then the verdict is guilty. If not, then its not guilty. It’s as simple as that.

    And in this case the state has two burdens. Prove their charges and disprove the self defense claim, both to the same degree of certitude.

    And as of date I don’t think they’ve done either.

  18. cindy jewell says:

    I feel very blessed To have found the site. I’m just a simple woman from the .Midwest. I wouldn’t cave to the people around me… I still hold the belief that Jodi is innocent of. Murder. its been along 4
    months with no one to talk to about this case. I thank God I have found you all. I don’t have a degree in anything except life. thank you for answering my questions and listening to my views. I prayed the jury well look pass all the crap and see the real story.

    • Heather1 says:

      You sound a very lovely woman, cindy. I don’t have a degree either, but there’s no degree like intelligence and the school of common sense. ;)

      Everyone is so nice here and I’m pleased I found this site, too.

      I’ve been to the Midwest, in fact I think I’ve travelled more in the US than the majority of Americans have! ;)

      • cindy jewell says:

        Thank you…… I’m in Michigan on the west side. have you ever been here?
        .

        • Heather1 says:

          Hi cindy, the name does ring a bell, it was about 17 years ago. I was staying with someone I met on the cruise ship, the Pacific Princess, we went to Michigan to visit some of the people we met, had a lot of fun on that ship! :)
          I was staying in Indiana and went into Chicago quite often by myself on the train, I loved it, its a beautiful city, albeit very windy!! I also remember going to Michigan City for the clothes outlets, though that’s a different place entirely!

  19. AH says:

    Thank you, Sirlips, for your wonderful post. I have not posted on this site before, but have checked in every once in a while. The thing I have found most frightening about this trial is that so many people, in spite of apparently being glued to trial coverage and the seriously awful HLN, have absolutely no understanding of our legal system. Constantly vilifying the defense team and defense witnesses is unfair and inaccurate. Wilmott and Nurmi are doing their jobs. On the other hand, on some of these other sites, and with a complete lack of any kind of rational or civil thought process, Martinez, a belligerent, insulting so-called officer of the court, has been sanctified as being brilliant. Fact is, this prosecutor, needed a strong judge and a contempt of court citation.
    We have, in this country, something called the Constitution of the United States. It is one of the most eloquent, elegant documents ever written and is the cornerstone of our judicial system. Some people apparently don’t see any need for the Bill of Rights and are comfortable acting as judge, jury and executioner. This kind of angry, ignorant mob mentality is truly frightening.
    Okay, I’m rambling now. I really just wanted to thank you, Sirlips, for your very smart, insightful post.

    • Ann says:

      Yes, This kind of angry, ignorant mob mentality is truly frightening. These people would kill a mocking bird.

    • Right, and what people are forgetting is that it doesn’t matter if they like or dislike Jodi – she is still a citizen that has the right to a defense protected by the Constitution.

      Kirk Nurmi and Jennifer Willmott are doing their job to the best of their ability and why wouldn’t they? They obviously believe in what they do and the expectations of their profession. They could also be held accountable if they don’t.

      The mob mentality is very UnAmerican. You can’t get any more UnAmerican than the belief that people are guilty until they prove their innocence. It’s like people want to pick and choose who the Constitution applies to or who it protects, well that’s not how it’s supposed to work. That’s why there’s been the civil rights movement, the women’s movement, the LGBTQA movement, and other activism to keep those who represent the Constitution accountable for ensuring it protects us ALL.

      • Milan M says:

        The mob mentality is very KKK. That’s what it brings to mind when I think of lynch mobs and see people commenting about this case and blabbing on tv about it. That is extremely un-american, yes.
        I agree about people forgetting that it doesn’t matter if they dislike Jodi or not. It’s pretty creepy to see all of the coverage of her standing on her head and stuff in the interview room. Geez! Who cares?! How boring would life be if everyone were so cookie cutter that they never did anything different from anyone else? How does standing on her head make any danged difference? Sheesh. The voices in the media are so strident and full of hysteria.
        All of the smug people who get a rush out of feeling morally superior, how do they know how they would feel if they were stuck in an interview room for hours and hours? You might start feeling a little faint. Maybe a headstand would be just the thing to get the blood to your brain, who knows and who cares.

        • Beautifully said Milan.

          Remember the Italian media made a huge deal about Amanda doing a cartwheel. She was in the throes of infatuation with her new boyfriend, and they made it out to seem like she was a cold blooded murderer.

          I don’t believe that, not after reading about her life experiences and the hard work she did to go to Italy. She had no reason to use her life savings just to go to another country to murder someone. It’s ridiculous.

          And like I said in a later post, Americans point our fingers at Italy and say, “aren’t you glad we aren’t like them?” But aren’t we, if we’re judging Jodi for the same reason Italy judged Amanda?

          I agree – the haters are so much like the KKK. Say the word and they are out with torches ready to hang someone.

      • Nikki says:

        MB, Thank you for another great post.

        For a range of reasons, this trial seems poised to run off the wheels of due process at almost any given moment. But Jodi’s decision to testify in her defense, IMO, was what really hooked the media and the public’s reactions.

        Can a person testify as Jodi has and still receive a fair trial? We shall see. We will be watching and witnessing.

      • Britney says:

        “You can’t get any more UnAmerican than the belief that people are guilty until they prove their innocence. It’s like people want to pick and choose who the Constitution applies to or who it protects, well that’s not how it’s supposed to work.”

        *clap * Well said!!!

  20. Sirlips says:

    Thank you everyone for the very kind words.

    • cindy jewell says:

      Good morning. so tell me why do you think jodi is a fruitcake

      • Sirlips says:

        Great question, mostly because she seems to look at the world a bit different and act a bit different than others in the same situations. Because of this she is intelegent, artistic, well spoken and chooses to act out in ways most others dont. In my book, that makes her a fruitcake. I dont consider that a bad thing, i consider it unique and a quality that others should strive for.

        Think of it like the Austin Texas slogan…”keep Austin Weird”. Thats not always a bad thing.

        I consider myself crack nut crazy. Yet, i think im a good father, a good lover and a friend.

        • Sirlips says:

          …good friend.

          • Aly says:

            Right, Sirlips.
            I know the feeling.
            I like the way James Durbin talks about his tourette syndrome.
            He just says he embraces his weirdness. : )
            That is a good out look, IMO

            I’m not someone who just follows or believes what they hear.
            I like to think for myself and not have someone think for me.
            I like to ask questions.
            AND I do think people like that tend to be a good person and loyal friend.

            A friend of mind thought Jodi was guilty.
            He didn’t know there were roommates living in the house.
            He didn’t know that friends that he was supposed to be with in Cancun
            were there and had gotten the word before 5 days.
            In fact he didn’t know Travis was not found for 5 days.

            When people start hearing things that only the media pounds in the head 24 hours,
            they believe it.
            Of course they had not watched the trial at all.
            So you have at least 85 percent of the public believing she was guilty and had heard
            none of the facts.

            So the media not only lies and leaves out what they want to and they cause a war amongst
            the citizens, so IF they are aqcuitted they still can’t have a life.
            That isn’t justice.
            That’s just wrong

    • Pat says:

      thanks Sirlips..you are a scholar and a gentleman!

    • Lura says:

      I love how you choose a photo of the defense team dressed in white! The winning team!

    • Canada Carol says:

      I respectfully have to disagree that jurors should be receiving ANY information outside of the courtroom. They must only consider that which has come from the witness stand and evidence entered. If they are reading your post, they are reading the haters and even enjoying the antics of HLN . The jury is actually representing Jodi, selected for her. If you believe in your justice system then you must have faith that they have the intelligence to carry out their responsibility. I have not seen so many state witnesses committing purjory since the OJ Simpson trial, but that jury saw the forensics and testimony for what it was. I think anyone who can go 18 days with that screaming little man shows a strength of mind and character that even some of the expert witnesses had difficulty maintaining. She does have a blunted affect, but that comes with the PTSD. I am so looking forward to seeing Dr. Attitude put in her place on Wed. The way that she conducted her testing and herself during testimony leaves her wide open for attack.

      • Nikki says:

        Canada, I agree with all these good points you made (don’t know about the state witnesses and perjury in the OJ trial but do know that one of the detectives admitted that he had returned to the house with a blood evidence vial in his pocket; that this error in procedure contributed greatly to the verdict of not-guilty). As regards Jodi’s blunted affect, this trial must be contributing another layer to Jodi’s PTSD. How overwhelmingly shocking it must be for her to see people parading around the court with such smug self-righteousness in the name of putting her to death.

        • Canada Carol says:

          It was an amazing trial to watch, with the defence proving that evidence was planted, most importantly the socks and blood spot on back gate. At least two of the leading detectives committed perjury. The final arguments are on Y-Tube which kinda sum up all the things they did to try and win at any cost. The long wait to finally get KN and JW after how many public defenders leaving the case must have been so hard to deal with, and now her trial taking so long. JM will ask the same question for 40 min. to get the answer he wants, and when he gets the answer he wants, he still asks the question over and over until someone objects. Hopefully, those smug people won’t get their way.

      • sirlips says:

        Yes Canada Carol, they should not be reading my post, as I said in the post, but I think we all know there is little chance that pinky swear promise is being kept by all of them. SO, if they are going to read, hopefully the find this to consider also. If not, GREAT, that’s how it should be.

        There are people here that will be on the “next” jury, maybe this will help them consider things.

  21. JC - TEAM JODI ADMIN says:

    Great post sirlips! I do believe in the carpenter who did magic tricks and walked on water ;-)

    • Sirlips says:

      JC, I wont hold it against you..lol, just kidding my friend.

      Unfortunatly my belief system doesnt work on what “what i want, wish or hope for”. So, unless i have reason that outways my disbelief, then i have to be honest with myself and say i dont believe. Belief is a great thing for many people and can/has brought much happiness to them. It can also cause great pain and hurt. SO it is important that I continue to try to educate myself on the possibilities and hopefully i can some day find a answer..if there is one to that great question.

      Religion? (thats not the same thing as spirituality) Religion can take a long run off a short bridge, IMO. But lets not get into that again here.

      Thank you for the compliment.

  22. Al says:

    Since everyone’s all wound up, I thought we’d have some mid-morning music.

    Here’s a great cover of a Johnny Cash standard (if your pleasure tends that way)

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gOHGCTlVrCM

  23. abusesurvivor says:

    Thank you Sirlips…fabulous posting, very inciteful and thought provoking. Kudos to you !!! Hit the nail right on the head so to speak !!! HALLELUJA !!!

  24. FreshAirBreather says:

    Another first-time poster here, but don’t worry–I’m a believer. Unfortunately, I was not aware of the existence of Jodi Arias until the trial was already into the AL phase. As a survivor of domestic violence myself, I was horrified by the messages I was hearing on HLN and the hater sites and found yours right away. It was pretty obvious where the analytical thinkers were hanging out: here. I hope that in closing arguments the defense at least mentions frontal lobotomies to plant the seed that if the bullet did pass through Travis’s brain it was essentially an accidental frontal lobotomy, which contrary to the ME’s testimony is quite survivable. The earliest forms were very similar, entering through a temple. And accidental ones such as Phineas Gage’s resulted in inability to control temper and other emotions rather than having a calming effect. Question: Can someone please point me to an appoximate date when the damage to Travis’s legs would have been discussed by the defense, if they were? Or by any of you? No need to rehash what the haters say. I have missed too much and do not have time to go through all the footage and comments but have caught up rather piecemeal. Thank you!

    • BeeCee says:

      great first time post FreshAirBreather!

    • Sirlips says:

      Im not aware of injuries to the legs. Can you explain more about what you heard? thank you, and welcome to the site.

      • Nikki says:

        Sirlips, the injuries to his legs are bruises on his shins.

      • FreshAirBreather says:

        Thank you both for your welcome! The injuries I’m thinking of are listed in the autopsy report under Blunt Force Trauma and are to the lower legs. There are photos in the autopsy or police pics. They look to me like something you would receive during a fall but onto what? I do not have a good sense of the environment or whether they could have been received during the struggle by writhing violently against a doorframe, for example. Edge of shower stall? If I could make sense of them I could reconstruct more details in my own imagined narrative of how things went down that evening. I think some of you are way ahead of me on that!

  25. Michele says:

    Great post Sirlips !My interest in the system started for me about 5 yrs ago when I knew a young man who was coerced into taking a plea.He spent 2 years in prison for a crime he did not commit.The color of his skin should not have made a difference,I thought,Well, how naive was I?The treatment by the investigator was beyond words.I watched all of this happen feeling helpless.This, did not just take 2 years of his life but it also has had negative consequences almost everyday since. It is hard for him to find employment,housing etc..I think sometimes people believe that it could never happen to them.Somehow,these defendants must be quilty or they wouldnt have gotten arrested.The farthest from truth.It could happen to you or someone you love.I admit I used to watch that no name “entertainment” channel when they would try and find missing children etc.I will not and cannot watch another second of the trash.Its like reading the Enquirer.
    I started out looking for an explanation in this trial of why,why did this happen?Then the DV issue became a hard hitting awakening to my emotions( all of them).My goal has been in the recent years to not be a victim anymore and not stand by and let others be victimized by anyone including the judicial system.Coming to this site has helped me to feel enpowered,I know this sounds a little hokey,but I didnt know where to start to fight.This has pushed me to act and not feel helpless and pushed me to seek out my passion for justice and the rights of all.So long story short. I respect the people on this site,not because of just what you say, but also, the passion and the committment behind those words.
    Jodi is no longer a victim of Travis in some ways but is being revictimized over and over, since this trial started.I could not imagine my whole life on this “stage”for the world to twist,turn and judge.It it wrong,and I will not stop to do my part in demanding change.Thank you Sirlips for putting into words,the ones I may lack,to express my opinions and feelings.One more thing,I read through the post daily and by the time I am done,I realize I usually have no more to say,I usually agree with most of what is written.JODI IS A SURVIVOR and should be set free immediately.With that said,I am grateful to have a place to come to see the words I cannot always speak or write.YOu all kick ass!

    • Introspective says:

      Michele,
      A very good, impassioned post by you! As you already know that here you will find a group of ‘thinking thinkers’, who don’t accept just any view. As the minds wheel start churning, it is analyzed, dissected, viewed from all angles, yet left open to welcome other viewpoints – you won’t find much ego, pride and displaced hostility here. Also, along the way, we all learn so much. You will find acceptance, kindness, respect, willingness to give credit when and where credit is due, and a place where you can grow. Much thanks to SJ, for fostering such an atmosphere and tolerating nothing less here. :)

  26. cindy jewell says:

    I was flipping through channels And happen to stop on hln. One of the attorneys Made the point That Jodi never said she was sorry.. I personally think it would have made impact.

    • Michele says:

      The system is set up not to allow her that.She killed him in self defense.She said she was sorry that this all happened but should not and cannot say she was sorry for saving her own life.

    • That’s such bullshit because she said she was sorry while testifying! She said she would take it all back if she could. She also sent flowers and an 18 page letter to the family. Oh, that’s right, she’s condemned for that too.

      Clearly these people are not paying attention to the very trial they are covering. What stupid stupid people. >:(

      • joujoubaby says:

        I’m not sure at what point it happened, but I’m not mad at the HLN “pundits” anymore. I am trying to figure out why. I think it might be that I have to feel a modicum of respect for someone in order to be angry, and it’s gone. With me they have no credibility, no judgement, and from me, not a whit of respect. I quite literally have more regard for the crack whores turning tricks on the street than I do for those people. At least with the streetwalkers, I can comprehend and sympathize with the circumstances that would lead a person down that path. The HLN “professionals” have no such excuses.

        • I’m mad because they present themselves as experts about a trial that they aren’t even paying attention to. They’re in a position to influence to weaker willed/less intelligent and are doing a damn good job appealing to emotion over reason and facts. IMO they are going to ruin the country if they keep doing this.

          And I agree – I have more empathy for prostituted women than I do those people.

          • joujoubaby says:

            Until recently I felt the same way, and I am genuinely trying to figure out the shift in my feelings. I still harbor anger toward the owners of the network, but my attitude toward the on-air personalities is different for some reason. The loss of respect thing is a hypothesis, but I can’t account for certain for the change. I AM curious if anyone else has experienced anything similar emotionally speaking. Guys, I know you don’t express emotions the same way that we do, so that’s more directed to the ladies, but I welcome your input as well, of course.

            • cindy jewell says:

              Nope still calling them every name in the book. can’t say I hate them I detest they’re commentary. Their money grubbing whores No Pimps! it’s really sad to know that as long as the money is there so will they be.

            • Dorothy says:

              joujou,
              I feel sad, in a way, or perplexed that ALL of the “reporters/commentators” (or whatever) opted to debase their profession to such a low in order to save their jobs. I have to believe that this is what happened: Although some are just naturally disGraceful… a few of them have actually altered their factual reporting AND their demeanors to conform to this horrendous sensationalizing, over the top, inaccurate ACTING that evidently brings in the money. I believe that, for a FEW, this MUST go against their grains. I wonder if they were given an ultimatum…do it THIS way or lose your job. I can’t believe that it sits well with some of them. I have said it before and I will say it again: How, pray tell, do they sleep at night knowing they sold themselves? They are, in essence, prostituting themselves.
              I agree with you in that one needs to feel a modicum of respect toward another in order to develop anger. So, with that in mind I do feel a bit of anger toward those who I never expected to sell themselves out. I am also angry that they have been ultimately faced with “do it OUR way and pay your bills, or start looking for a job. It sickens me.
              I have to say that when Turner took over, it was VERY obvious and I stopped watching because I am not, in the least, fascinated by sensationalism. I see so many people here commenting and becoming irate at what they saw on HLN. My question is: Why do you continue to watch it and why bring it here? I am not the least bit interested in what they are up to, why are so many drawn to it? I suppose it is the same thing in me that always wondered why people would buy those ridiculous magazines like the National Inquirer and then talked about the info they read and BELIEVED it all to be truth…
              I don’t bother myself with it at all. It is a waste of my time and feel it is beneath me to chalk up their ratings.

            • I remember talking to someone who said she had “outrage burnout.”

              I don’t know if that’s what you’re feeling, so what do you think of the verbiage? Does it fit?

              Hopefully one day I’ll get to the place where you are at and I’ll be able to understand or even verbalize the process of getting there.

              • joujoubaby says:

                Not really, because I am still furious at the situation. It’s just kind of like a shift for the on air personalities of contempt to pity…but not exactly that.

                • Al says:

                  joujou

                  Maybe after a while they become irrelevant. And when that happens there is no internal need to expend emotion on irrelevancies.

                • joujoubaby says:

                  YES, Al. That’s it! But I don’t consciously think that they are irrelevant. They are still churning up the misinformation and hate, and trading in it, that caused This trial, Willmott, and ALV all of her problems…But you are right, they ARE irrelevant …to me. I guess that’s why I maintain my anger toward the CNN people, and the HLN execs specifically.

          • Introspective says:

            An example of the NG/HLN instigation tactics: Watching one of NG’s latest ‘wrap-up’s’ of the week, she would deliberately use words such as when describing the video where TA is regalling everyone with his story and JA is sleepy and lying on his lap… she said “JA lying on TA’s CROTCH” vs lap! Every JA issue that NG describes is an exaggeration with word and meaning substitution. She is responsible for perpetuating the lie (with no proof) that JA stole the ‘engagement’ ring, the stalker issue, tire slashing, and many, many more. This is repeated by the brain-dead masses that follow her and spreads like wild-fire and is then treated like it is the ‘bible’ on what ‘really’ happened. These are the same people – who thanks personally to all at HLN – now converted into blood-thirsty mongrels, who cry afoul that TA has been cast unfairly, and without proof that he is a pedophile, liar, and anything else that JA said he was, who turn around and say, as if they KNOW for a fact, that JA stole the ring, came in through the doggie door, was always there at TA’s uninvited, a stalker, a slasher – just because TA said so?? For one who was clearly leading a double life – with proof in his own words and voice, a confirmed liar – they believe to be the one telling the truth!!

            I hope I didn’t go off on a tangent. I am irritated and downright angry at ALL at HLN and other media types who have the responsibility to report the facts, not each and every figment of their warped imagination. This includes not just the owners of the stations, but also the individual anchors and hosts of the programs through which these irresponsible and inciting actions and words are spewed out like a virus to infect everyone is its path! Some are immune, many are not. These are not children, but adults who sit at that podium and instigate and perpetuate harmful, hurtful, damaging, and even permanently affecting one’s reputation, livelihood, and life. Who gives them that right to distort and condemn even when they know it MAY NOT be true? Turning a blind eye by ignoring and ‘not watching’ them really does not change much, becoz even if its only one person that watches and then believes, its one person too many!! – sorry, it turned into a rant.

  27. cindy jewell says:

    Honestly I thought she did too the first day she was on the stand

    I swear they’re not watching the same trial

    • joujoubaby says:

      Cindy, I think that the problem is, they don’t realize that this IS a trial. They mistake it for a sporting event, or a soap opera, or an extension of the Real Housewives franchise. They probably think that Andy Cohen will be doing a reunion special in a few weeks.

  28. LC says:

    Goodmorning everyone, I have a lot to do today, I just wanted to say, “GREAT POST SIRLIPS” and I really hope if the jurors are on the net, they do come across your post.

    Have a nice Sunday everyone!

  29. Renee' (HRS) says:

    Top of the morning peeps. I am going back to bed.

    I woke to a friend request on facebook from Gus Searcy? wth?

    • cindy jewell says:

      No way…..

      • Renee' (HRS) says:

        way……………… I am not kidding.

        Gus Searcy wants to be friends with you on Facebook.

        • joujoubaby says:

          Just tread lightly and don’t buy any prepaid legal.

        • tonya says:

          maybe he want to talk to you because you are such a firecracker when it comes to the vermon that come on this site begrade jodi and you go into attack mode and i sure love you for that dont think they come back or did they had to get off computer at 8pm

          • Introspective says:

            Tonya, FYI, I replied to that conversation were having on Friday, at the bottom of the same page on a separate post. I hope you saw it. :)

        • BeeCee says:

          renee’, he is friends with sandra, so if that one is friends with sandra it is real.

          :)

          and, hopefully I will be able to find you again soon on FB…

    • tonya says:

      be sceptical of this make him give you proof of him being gus

    • maria rigadopoulou says:

      He sent me a friend request more than a month ago.It’s no biggy! Probably because I am on many FB support groups,especially one he’s also a member.He doesnt have a screening process,he just sends a bunch of friends request because I remember the day he sent me the request he had also sent one to basically every person in that group.

  30. cindy jewell says:

    I have always thought they were.

  31. geebee2 says:

    I have something TRULY AMAZING for you!!!

    See this

    http://jodi-arias.wikispaces.com/Hallway+Blood+Trail#martinezsharkjump

    :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :)

    • Basse Krokke says:

      I want to take comfort in Juan’s stupidity, but it scares me; so many people blindly accept what he says as fact.

      Your Wiki is fabulous, btw.

      • tonya says:

        geebee2 if the cleaning was done it was not jodi she cleaned his home before I cleaned homes before and I would not have left blood the cleaning spots are in the places that she described were in the bathroom they cleaned to remove there foot prints the wall the have half moon blood pattern is the same someone trying to remove hand prints from the wall and left jodi’s she said she was trying to get him up and out but could not they stoped her

        • geebee2 says:

          tonya

          Go and look at the page for five or ten minutes, and you will see how devastating this is for Martinez.

          http://jodi-arias.wikispaces.com/Hallway+Blood+Trail

          I’m stopping work now on this case. I’m going to enjoy Amanda Knox’s book launch, and then enjoy Jodi’s triumphant procession to freedom.

          JODI WILL BE VICTORIOUS,. I am now completely sure about that!

          Horn’s horrible testimony the other night forced me to sort out the crime scene, and it has now borne fruit.

      • geebee2 says:

        No need to be scared. This issue is one where Martinez has to win, but even a six year old could understand why this is a trail of blood from Travis’ gunshot wound and NOT a random pattern of blood with the middle part “cleaned”.

        Juan has lost everywhere, but this point is so very, very clear that I can now stop worrying entirely.

        Horn’s testimony did worry me, because it takes a little bit of nouse to understand how biassed he was being. The jury jsut might have bought it,. But this is like drawing with a crayon!

        • geebee2 says:

          Juan Martinez : Not the brightest crayon in the box :)

        • maria rigadopoulou says:

          Oh no,he is not stupid! If he were I could at least feel some sympathy for his inability to build a strong case due to his low IQ.Yet,this isnt the reason.I agree with geebee,he’s orchestrating meticulously this entire mischaracterization of events and distorts evidence and facts just to make way for his dirty plan.He needs to win this thing and nothing will or has ever stopped him from doing so.He’s RELENTLESS!

          • Basse Krokke says:

            Now I’m scared again! Help me, geebee2.

            Maria — Martinez is just such a weasel. Ugh.

          • Introspective says:

            Maria, yes you are right. There is something I am working on with something posted on Blink on Crime re. the memory cards and types and what JM presented in court. Not sure why DT did not notice or object or were unaware of what was going on. JM has a reputation of messing around with evidence etc in his past cases, so why did the DT not be extra careful and cover all their bases with him. I know that you can’t predict every single move and unexpected things pop up. But, not getting their own ME was unforgivable (I think) as this sequence was the crux of the matter, esp. when JM himself changed his own opinion on what he finally ‘decided’ the sequence to be to suit his DP justification. Sly and sneaky little (and little he is) bugger! Gotta keep your eyes on him at all times – slick an slippery eel.

  32. tonya says:

    just woke up had sore throat my brother was watching NASTY NANCY GRACE and just said look she is wearing hand cuffs around her neck. I just had to share that with you he never talks and all of a sudden he is the detective. I have seen that around her neck for months and that was the first time I saw it as hand cuffs. HOW ARE YOU ALL TODAY? :roll:

    • joujoubaby says:

      Good morning, Tonya!

      • tonya says:

        good afternoon joujoubaby

        its taken awhile to get here first the good read above by sirlups and then seeing a lot of new names here and seeing geebee’s link to the blood what is the theft w anderson cooper

    • Basse Krokke says:

      They’re back? She was discussing their theft w/Anderson Cooper not long ago.

  33. veronica says:

    Absolutely great post.

  34. joujoubaby says:

    Sirlips, you are so good at what you do. Thanks to you, and to SJ for having the great sense to tap you for the lead post today.

  35. coldcase53 says:

    A couple of great quotes on Twitter

    Michael S. Laquerre ‏@mikelacare 1h

    “Capital punishment is the most premeditated of murders.” – Albert Camus

    “Vengeance should never be construed as justice.” (no author given)

  36. annieEP says:

    I like how the state vs Jodi fb page are showing Jodi artwork and showing the pics they think she copyrighted. Who cares if she got her idea off something else

    • Basse Krokke says:

      Seen it. WHY are they so over-invested in everything that poor woman does?

    • joujoubaby says:

      She’s been in jail for 5 years for goodness’ sake. I don’t know what you are referring to specifically, because i can’t stand to torture myself, but I’d like to see the art those creative colossi have produced themselves. I’m sure it’s “tremendous”

    • BeeCee says:

      I saw that too. first they were trying to say she was drawing skeletor, now they are matching them to other things.

  37. Al says:

    There’s an old saying in legal circles that, depending on your case, you either argue the facts or the law. Seems to me that in this instance the defense can argue both the facts and the law.

    The state’s case is one that requires the jury to start with an assumption of guilt and then fit the circumstantial evidence to fit that scenario. That is all JM has. His case for premeditation rests on his now familiar narrative bolstered by the following:

    1. Jodi decided on this after the May 26th spat with TA, and his rants about her having been the worst thing that ever happened to him.
    2. She set up a meeting with Ryan Burns following this communication.
    3. She staged the burglary at her Grandparents to get the gun.
    4. She rented a car in another town.
    5. She borrowed gas cans on her way down and told Brewer she was headed to Mesa.
    6. She dyed her hair sometime between renting the car and the Walmart, possibly when she stopped to get her “nails” done.
    7. She turned off her phone to avoid tracking in AZ.
    8. She entered the house with a gun and a knife.

    And he uses the “conscience of guilt” argument to explain her story after the killing to explain the lies.And his only argument against self defense lies in trying to convince the jury that TA was not abusive and Jodi lied on the stand as proven by his gas can story.

    That is his narrative and taken by itself it would seem damning. But in someways this story is analagous to most conspiracy theories. You can always take a set of disconnected facts and knit them into a narrative. But just like most conspiracy theories, this story too falls apart under careful scrutiny.

    So when JM presents his closing, just as he did in his case in chief, he is going to keep it short and generally offer the jury the “thirty thousand foot” view. A sort of impressionistic painting of the case, with very little detail.

    And this is where the defense gets to make his case. They need to point out to the jury that you have to start with the facts and evidence, not the final conclusion, and then see where those facts and the evidence leads you. And that the prosecutor is not allowed to fill in the gaps with conjecture or speculation.

    For instance the fact that they have pictures of Jodi with dark hair in early to mid May, albeit with highlights punches a big wide gaping hole in JM’s story. He must now show, beyond a reasonable doubt that Jodi did in fact dye her hair after May 26th. He can’t just assume she did, or imply she did. Those pictures in the car don’t mean a thing. Because he has a 2-3 week gap between dark hair with highlights and dark hair without highlights doesn’t allow him, or the jury to assume that the hair was dyed on June 3rd. The rental guy was obviously mistaken, because if he wasn’t Jodi would have had to go back to blond between May 18th and June 2nd, and again there is no evidence to say she did. On the other hand the possibility that he was relying on the license picture is clear and distinct. By the way it wouldn’t hurt to have Jennifer or Nurmi ask the jury how many men don’t notice when their wives or girl friends get their hair done differently.

    The same holds for the gun. Yes its a coincidence that the gun stolen from Jodi’s grandparents was a 25 and TA was shot by a 25. There is no evidence to point to either Jodi as a culprit for the burglary, or to the fact that the same gun was used on TA. And the jury is not allowed to make that leap, because that’s an assumption not backed by any evidence. In fact the bullets were different and the Yreka police acknowledged that they had a rash of thefts at that time. Plus, JM’s own argument of the shot coming last belies any credence to the premeditation argument, since why would a person with that bend of mind and a gun, use a knife first. It challenges the credibility, and any such challenges cannot be answered with a we don’t know without ruling i favor of the defense.

    In as far as the car rental is concerned JM must show that there was no logical reason to do so, whereas the evidence is that Jodi’s car had problems and that in fact Redding was on her way, and that Yreka is rental car challenged. Again, remember the jury is not allowed to speculate in order to find her guilty, and as sirlips said if a possibility exists that the reason as stated is valid, well then that’s what they have to rule on.

    Brewer testified that Jodi did in fact tell him that she was borrowing the gas cans because she intended to drive down to LA, AZ, and Utah, and that’s a perfectly good reason.

    Jodi had been talking to Burns for a while now and they had been planning to get together. That last conversation with TA may have solidified her resolve to move on. That is well within the sphere of possibility and so must be taken into account by the jury.

    So why in fact did she end up in Mesa. That’s the 64 million dollar question and that’s where the testimony of ALV comes into play. This was textbook codependent relationship, and apparently is not so rare in such cases. Jodi’s persona is marred by low self-esteem. And even prior to this she kept going back to TA and his abuse. That much is clear. This had nothing to do with jealousy, or a last ditch effort to win him back. As her journal clearly indicates, she had acknowledged that there was no future for them. For lack of a better word this was an addiction. And her behavior, and the psychological tests all show a person with esteem issues and the traits of the submissive person in an abusive relationship. That, right there, is a viable and explicable reason for the trip back to Mesa.

    So based on the requirement of proof beyond a reasonable doubt, the state has nothing. That case is so full of holes and speculation that it just doesn’t cross the level of the standard required.

    The conscience of guilt issue is argued against by the PTSD and the shame of the relationship. Regardless of what the Baby Doc said we have two other psychologists who’s tests showed PTSD. In fact DeMarte’s own testing using the MMPI-2 showed PTSD levels above clinical. So it doesn’t matter whether it was a bear or a tiger, the PTSD is there and I’m sure Geffner is going to vouch for that once again. Couple that with the shame of the abuse and the natural instinct to not always tell the cops what you have done, and you have a reasonable explanation for those lies.

    But before JM even get’s to make his premeditation argument he has to disprove the self defense case, and all he has there is don’t believe Jodi because she lied. It is ironic that he often uses her own words and actions for other stuff to prove a point, but when it doesn’t suit him he falls back on the lying. Somewhere in there is an inconsistency that the jury will have to reconcile, and they really have only one way out in such circumstances. They must either believe her in the entirety or throw everything out. Anything else, now has to be weighed against other corroborating evidence and there is none. So if JM wants the jury to believe that she was pushy or firm when she confronted Juarez or Bianca or TA, because she acknowledged it, or that she told folks the truth about hitting her Mom, or any of those other issues, then they must also acknowledge that there is a real possibility that she’s telling the truth about TA’s behavior and the self defense. Plus in at least the abuse part there is corroborating evidence in the emails and texts.

    Also regardless of what JM implies, something set the whole ball of wax rolling. Just too much time, and too much amorous activity passed between the time she got there and the killing, and the killing happened at a time where there was activity that involved the both of them Imagine the scenario where they are in the bathroom and, if JM is to be believed Jodi suddenly went got the knife and started attacking TA. This is almost 13 hours after she got there. Just impetus for why then and why there is inexplicable, as is the fact that by JM’s story she decided to use a knife as opposed to the gun she allegedly brought with her. When something raises that many questions, it is by definition reasonable doubt.

    So, with the evidence presented properly, and the law argued cogently, JM’s case just doesn’t rise to the standard of proven beyond a reasonable doubt.

    Now whether the Jury decides to punish her because, at the end of the day, someone died, is another story.

    • Basse Krokke says:

      ” … all he has there is don’t believe Jodi because she lied. It is ironic that he often uses her own words and actions for other stuff to prove a point, but when it doesn’t suit him he falls back on the lying.”

      That right there is the most maddening part of this entire circus, to me. The same goes for the morons posting on the Team Travis sites; they call Jodi a liar, and insist that not ONE WORD Jodi says can be believed, EXCEPT for when she said she killed Travis. “SHE ADMITTED IT!” Since when do we deem someone a pathological liar whose every word is suspect, unless what that “pathological liar” said fits into our accusations? On top of that, they pick and choose what is true and what is a lie IN THE VERY SAME STATEMENT BY JODI. Arg!

    • Angela says:

      We also have the autopsy report that states that the dura mater was intact, the bullet could not have penetrated the brain, we have a half ass investigator who lied , they did not know her shoe size, yet the print at the scene was not delved into, the scene was not secured, the testimony from the witnesses did not make sense with timelines……

    • maria rigadopoulou says:

      Al,your post gave me palpitations.It so accurately explains what a sane and objective mind should consider when they are presented with any case,let alone an overcharged one. Ever since the Judge announced the closing srguments date I’m overwhelmed by a sense of powerlessness,knowing that this case’s fate lies solely on the hands of the Jurors.I’d give anything to know if even half of them are as brilliant as posters here like you are.

  38. Al says:

    geebee2

    Further to your comment about JM and the crayon. Throughout this trial I have watched JM and some of his behavior with great perplexion. I find it hard to believe that he could truly be as dumb as he seems to be. At times I thought this was a language issue, and that he was not well versed in the idiom and semantics of common spoken English (or the American version thereof). At other times I wonder if his act is merely meant to confuse the jury, or create a confusion where none exists, with evermore tangential lines of questioning.

    Remember that whole thing with the rope not being able to stay up looped behind the bed. What part of the fact that this is a sexual role playing exercise did he not comprehend, and that she could keep it tight by pulling at it and yet have it loose enough to slip out of did he not comprehend? Instead we spent 10 minutes with him ranting and raving about it and going off into all sorts of tangential directions.

    Also, just like the forensics persons testimony in your shark jumping video a lot of the state’s testimony seems to rely on “this is possible”.

    Does he not realize that he needs proof beyond the standard of it is possible?

    • geebee2 says:

      Yes, he really is truly dumb.

      I don’t want to harp on about this, being dumb is not a sin.

      But he is not fit to act as a prosecutor, or indeed as any kind of lawyer.

      He needs to go get an education, both moral an intellectual.

      I suspect it is too late to start at his age.

      He should be given a pension or a job where he can do no harm.

      • Heather1 says:

        I wish he could be grilled by someone 10 times worse than himself, have a taste of his own medicine, if that were at all possible.

        Actually I’d like to lock him up, he’s a nasty piece of work, let him feel what its like to be locked away.

        It might humble him.. on second thoughts, I doubt it.

        • Basse Krokke says:

          Until Martinez recently questioned Flores, I was wondering if he was capable of a civil tone at all. Now that I know he is capable, I am especially disgusted by his courtroom demeanor.

  39. Basse Krokke says:

    Posted on Inconceivable Truths:

    Basse Krokke The prosecution is playing fast and loose with the “FACTS”, so I’ll use their same standards: In 2007, I saw photos of Lindsay Lohan playing with a butcher knife. Where was LiLo on June 4, 2008? REASONABLE DOUBT.

    http://live.drjays.com/index.php/2007/06/05/vanessa-minnillo-and-lindsay-lohan-are-a-mess/

  40. Renee' (HRS) says:

    Okay. I am not a paranoid person in general. BUT some weird ass shit is happening to me. I respectfully blow you all a kiss and bid you adieu for now.

  41. Edward says:

    Thanks Sirlips for the excellent post.
    To summarize, I’ll say that the ‘Prosecution’ HAS NOT proven Premeditated Murder…or any type of Murder, for that matter, beyond a ‘Reasonable Doubt’….NOT EVEN CLOSE. If one just considers the ‘crime scene’ alone….nothing else….it becomes ‘in your face’ apparent that this was NOT Premeditated.
    I believe it WAS ‘Self Defense’….as Jodi claimed. Here’s why:
    We all know that Jodi is quite intelligent…agree? When I saw her on the stand testifying in her defense, I thought…Wow…how well mannered and well spoken she was. Point is…She’s intelligent. If she was the liar and actress that the Prosecution claims she is then she could of made her ‘Self Defense’ claim a lot more believable. Here’s how:
    Jodi could have said that after she dropped the camera Travis began screaming and insulting her and threatening her with punishment (this she testified to). Punishment = smacking her around and sticking it in her…..you fill in the blank. So she runs while he chases her, she grabs the knife to fend him off, he tackles her so she starts starts attempting to stab in in the back while he is on top of her on the floor. The fight ensues with Travis becoming more enraged. She manages to get free and runs out of the bathroom with the the knife. He chases her. She runs through the hallway / bedroom entrance to the closet, grabs the gun, back through the closet entrance in the bathroom. She turns around and there is Travis–enraged. He lunges / she shoots. But it’s still not enough to stop him. She is now in extreme fear for her life. She starts stabing him with more ferocity this time whereas he winds up on top of her again, which culminates with her slitting his throat to stop him.
    Jodi is a smart woman and she could of easily come up with this story on her own, if she was the liar and manipulator the Prosecution claims she is. This synopsis fits perfectly within ‘Justifiable Self Defense’. But, Jodi told the truth, stating the gunshot came first, which only enraged Travis and led to his demise.
    But you ask, Why didn’t Jodi admit to self defense early on. Here is my thoughts:
    First, it was disassociation. Then after learning of the horror of the crime scene she most likely knew it would be very, very hard to explain the ferocity of her actions in defending herself against Travis. She knew everyone would be horrified and see it as extreme overkill. BUT, no one can say how they would have reacted given the circumstances of what Jodi had been through, and the fear and adrenaline she was experiencing on that fateful day. I believe she indeed believed she was fighting for her life and it all just came out of her at once.

    • D says:

      “Jodi could have said that after she dropped the camera Travis began screaming and insulting her and threatening her with punishment (this she testified to). Punishment = smacking her around and sticking it in her…..you fill in the blank. So she runs while he chases her, she grabs the knife to fend him off, he tackles her so she starts starts attempting to stab in in the back while he is on top of her on the floor. The fight ensues with Travis becoming more enraged. She manages to get free and runs out of the bathroom with the the knife. He chases her. She runs through the hallway / bedroom entrance to the closet, grabs the gun, back through the closet entrance in the bathroom. She turns around and there is Travis–enraged. He lunges / she shoots. But it’s still not enough to stop him. She is now in extreme fear for her life. She starts stabing him with more ferocity this time whereas he winds up on top of her again, which culminates with her slitting his throat to stop him.”

      The problem with this scenario would be that there was no blood found in the closet. So this scenario would never fly.

  42. coldcase53 says:

    I was reading about the “Son of Sam” law preventing prisoners from profiting from their crime or from the notoriety of their crime by writing books, selling interviews, etc. If Jodi is convicted, I suppose there is nothing to stop her from painting but she (and her family) will no longer be able to profit from her paintings. Or, perhaps an arrangement can be made where she could sell her paintings but all profit would go to Travis’s siblings or for court costs, whatever. Apparently, there have been First Amendment challenges to the Son of Sam law. Arizona has been finding ways other than the Son of Sam law to stop prisoners from profiting from their creative works.

    Anyone have any thoughts on what could happen in Jodi’s case? If she gets a “short” sentence, would she be able to stockpile her paintings and sell them when she’s released? Or, does the law prevent her from ever profiting from her paintings even after she’s out?

    • JC - TEAM JODI ADMIN says:

      From what I understand, she can never profit if convicted of anything relating to travis.

      • LC says:

        She can still profit off her drawings right?

        • JC - TEAM JODI ADMIN says:

          Nothing. She cannot turn a profit on anything from what I understand. I know this was talked about with the ABC lawyer and he said it’s legal for her to sell art until she is convicted. IF the state has the son of sam law, it means a murderer can’t profit off of their notoriety meaning nobody would have heard of them if the crime wouldn’t have occured. Nope. She can’t make any money. Unless she finds a way around that, but I think she could get into trouble. Id love to be wrong about all this too ;-)

          • maria rigadopoulou says:

            Oh no…. :(

          • I’m so frustrated with this JC. Jodi is NOT getting a fair trial and if convicted, can then not make any money for appeal. This is outrageous.

            It’s like what I was telling you about Casey’s situation. She can’t get a job thanks to the media, and if she doesn’t get a job, she’s accused of loafing around. Well which is it? HLN took away her ability to hold down a job or have a place to live without worrying about harassment. She’s still in hiding, and they have the gall to get mad that she lives off the kindness of strangers? What do they want? Do they want her to live on the streets where she could be raped or killed? What sickos.

            So upsetting!!!

  43. I agree that this case only matters in the media and their mindless hoards because of sex. Sex sells and it’s all about the money.

    But it means a lot more to a lot of the people who post here. A lot of us don’t care about the sex, we don’t think it’s a shockingly big deal that Travis and Jodi had sex. We find it a shockingly big deal that the media (including tv and social media here) is willing to cover up and/or normalize physical, emotional, and sexual abuse; and at the hands of a Mormon elder at that. We find it a shockingly big deal that the image of an abuser is more important than the rights of victims, after all the progress our country made and how foolish it is that people want to throw it away over misogyny, petty jealousy, or other stupid reasons.

    I don’t believe Jodi acts strange at all. I don’t really have a reason to. I don’t know how I would begin to make that assumption in the first place. I don’t recall anyone here saying they have been in the position to kill another person, how would WE know how anyone would act after the fact? Overkill is not unheard of in abusive relationships that culminate in murder – Susan Wright stabbed her husband over two hundred times for fear he wouldn’t stop abusing her. Then after she buried his body in the back yard, she kept worrying that he was going to come up out of the ground and get her.

    IMO Jodi has been put through what no person should be put through. The Green River Killer was convicted of murdering 48 women and nobody has ever analyzed, pathologized, or put him under the microscope of social media like they have Casey or Jodi. The dude is a CONVICTED mass murderer and is treated better than women who are SUSPECTED of committing crimes. Doesn’t that say a lot about how Americans really treat women?

    I agree with the legal analysis – the justice system is about proving a case, not making someone guilty or locking someone up based on supposition and the blind belief someone is guilty. Our courts are *supposed* to have a higher standard than that of the public opinion, unless Americans WANT to live in a society that accepts lynch mobs as “justice.” If that’s the case, then I predict there WILL be a mass migration of intelligent Americans seeking better and more progressive countries that actually care about reason, facts, sanity, and basic human decency.

    • Michele says:

      Well said,so sad and sooo true!

    • cindy jewell says:

      Truer words have not been spoken. Not one of us knows how we would act in the same situation.

    • Milan M says:

      “the media (including tv and social media here) is willing to cover up and/or normalize physical, emotional, and sexual abuse; and at the hands of a Mormon elder at that. We find it a shockingly big deal that the image of an abuser is more important than the rights of victims, after all the progress our country made and how foolish it is that people want to throw it away over misogyny, petty jealousy, or other stupid reasons.”

      YES. I agree. It shocks me a great deal also to see so many women rabidly attacking Jodi as well. Kind of like the latest girlfriend who thinks the guy won’t abuse HER because SHE’s better than the LAST girlfriend who DESERVED it!

      This is shocking to me also. That all of these people are so willing to give TA a pass, that, “boys will be boys” wink, wink – then, “how dare she! What a whore!”

      Also, all of the people who think that it proves something that TA didn’t abuse Deanna Reid, or the other girl, what?! Hasn’t anyone ever heard of the madonna/whore complex? Classic among patriarchal societies, and there are none more patriarchal than the Mormon church!

      The saintly madonna woman deserves to be put up on a pedestal, she’s pure as the driven snow, untouchable – but god forbid there’s a whore-woman who wants sex and likes sex! She deserves whatever she gets.

      No one misunderstands the sicko serial killers who go after prostitutes, do they? And do the police go crazy trying to catch them as soon as they start happening? Is it some kind of strange coincidence that the Green River Killer killed 48 women? That is just ONE case, there are many, many cases just like it. There was one in Vancouver, Canada, a creepy pig farmer who killed a huge number of women before the police even became concerned. Why? Because they were thought to be prostitutes.

      It is a basic underpinning of the beliefs of all abusers of women. They believe, in their heart of hearts, that they are superior to women. That is what allows them to objectify them. Once objectified, it is then easy for them to abuse them. Objects don’t REALLY have feelings, do they.

      You really got to the essence of why this whole thing outrages me, one of the main reasons anyway. You said it. They are so blatant about covering up and normalizing abuse of women. Very profound. And all of the self-righteous women, who are supportive of this system, do not understand what’s at stake. They do not understand why this line of thinking is dangerous. They think that if they are “good girls” it won’t happen to them. It only happens to the “bad girls” who deserve it.

      • BeeCee says:

        Milan M, lots and lots of valid points in your post…

        • maria rigadopoulou says:

          Exactly! It’s not the killing itself who makes the haters indignant,it’s not that TA was killed in the prime of life. That’s just the mask and excuse they are hiding behind in order for them to basically attack what patriarchal societies have always been afraid of-an independent woman,a sexually active one who,in her having embraced her sexuality and womanhood,poses a tangible threat to everyone.It’s no coincidence that Jodi was seen as a dangerous femme fatale by the other mormon wives (wasnt in fact one who claimed so on TV?) and that the Media made sure right from the start to label her as the Whore who seduced and led the innocent victim to his Fall.So reminiscent of the Adam and Eve archetype,it’s sad.Sad because we’d think that our society has moved on and has broken free from the biblical blinders imposed on people just to maintain a sense of order in the early societies.Also,it’s no coincidence that this case reeks of the mormon teachings-it’s in fact this type of religions that hold womanhood captive and thrive on superstitions and all kinds of prejudice.
          When a serial killer case comes up,I bet this kind of people do their duty as righteous citizens,meaning they shake their heads,call the guy a ‘monster’,maybe express their disgust and simply let the matter be and move on with their lives in a matter of seconds,right?Where is all this mob mentality and surge for Justice in pedophile cases?Or DV cases?It’s just not there,isnt it?Because these people as well as the Media satisfy their primordial need to keep women where they think they belong.The women driven by their fear or jealousy of another female would rather call her dangerous and a whore who had it coming,the men secretly lusting her prefer to normalize the guy’s behaviour or put him on the pedastal.
          As many have said before me here,I’m saddened by the fact that once in a while I get my hopes up that our societies have learnt their lesson that it’s never good when you look back.But I guess I was wrong.Maybe looking back and not letting go of even the most outrageously unprogressive things is all we’re capable of.

          • seek2understand says:

            I don’t even want to know how many women have been stabbed to death in the U.S. alone since 6/4/2008.

          • Katarina says:

            Let me say first that I truly despise all the media coverage on this trial. How could anyone think you can have a fair and impartial jury with all the headlines? However, I think what actually drives the true Jodi-haters are the lies she has told, repeatedly, the reason for which is never really addressed by the defense team. They should quit ignoring the fact that she has been caught lying and use it to help the girl – she obviously has something going on that causes her to make bad choices, act impulsively, and to truly believe the things she has said. I think it’s a bad choice for the defense team to keep trying to prove that the things she has said are true. They should admit that she has a problem and get her some help – not life in prison for crying out loud!

            • Aly says:

              You’re right Katrina about the metia, BUT it is
              true that she MAY have been telling the truth in the beginning and was made to change her story. It happens all of the time.
              I believe it is a cover up.

              I still can’t understand how he got back in the shower and why would Jodi want to take him from where he was shot to the shower. It’s just crazy and doesn’t make ANY sense.

              I sure can’t believe it was Jodi.
              When my husband fell and broke his femur, the 2 peremedics couldn’t put him on the stretcher themselves. it took 2 neighbor help and my husband weighs 200 pounds.

              The media keep saying Jolies lies, well we can’t tust the media. I think if they keep calling her a liar, the public buys it. They are worse than what they say Jodi is because I have caught them in many lies, and not just this trial.
              Jodi didn’t have a pattern of lying.

              Anyone would have been mortified to have to tell the things that she did and Travis did
              and she wasn’t his first.

              BUT strange to me they think the one that he actuall had sex with before Jodi, they feel so sorry for her.
              She says that what you do when you’re in love.

              Jodi loved him too.

      • Introspective says:

        Milan M,

        This Madonna/Whore complex was discussed on HLN on Friday. Janet Johnson (a Def Atty) had many good points on why JA is viewed as the ‘whore’ and therefore ‘deserving’ of the vile treatment by TA, whereas each of the other ex’s aka, the Stepford Wives Club, were viewed as the ‘Madonna’ virginal type, and so deserving of his respect, care, kindness, and even a marriage proposal.

        I also noticed that JA was the only one from the known TA ex’s, who was not entirely ‘white’ – she is of mixed race (white + hispanic). I have to throw racism in here as another factor that could have an equally strong influence in how she was viewed, treated, and cast aside as a proper marriage material – (TA’s own words could be a hint here as related by Dan Freeman – I love her, but I can’t marry her). She was not ‘pure’ enough – not just sexually, but also ‘breed-wise’. TA himself made a comment on his fb or ms account, beneath a pic of a woman who was of hispanic descent that “This little filly is the only valid argument to not put up a big freakin wall at the Mexico border”. See this: http://www.myspace.com/tvalexander/photos/33661428#%7B%22ImageId%22%3A33661428%7D (More on this racism issue later).

        Wendy Walsh, who is a loud-mouthed advocate for all causes ‘HLN’ (might be angling for an anchor job there), said, that TA had a suppressed internalized Madonna/Whore complex! Then you have that sexually-repressed soul, Josh Denne who was on JVM the other day: Here’s a snippet of their convo…(from CNN Transcripts)

        VELEZ-MITCHELL: And especially because she had used PrePaid Legal, as I`d like to say, a dating service. She claims she got into PrePaid Legal to make some money, because she was going into foreclosure with her previous boyfriend. She had credit-card debt up the wazoo. So she joined PrePaid Legal.

        But then, as opposed to working on just getting clients, she ends up going out with — well, let`s see, Abe Abdelhadi, John (ph) Dixon, and Ryan Burns, and of course, Travis Alexander, all of them connected to PrePaid Legal. What do you make of that, Josh?

        DENNE: I can say — I hear what the defense is saying about Jodi, and I heard Wendy talking earlier, you know, that she was a person who didn`t want to really express her feelings, who didn`t know. That wasn`t the Jodi I knew.

        The Jodi I knew, she put out lots of sexual energy. She was — she was just that type of girl. You know, I think she was shopping for an easy way out, personally. I think she latched onto Travis. He was this young, brilliant light of a man, who — his career was just blossoming. You can see it from some of the videos. He`s a tremendous communicator. And he was a light, and he was shining. And she just grabbed onto him hoping that, you know, he would take her along — along with him on the ride.

        And another snippet,…
        VELEZ-MITCHELL: Who is Jodi Arias? She is an enigma, appearing to different people to be different in personality. Take a look at this picture, never before seen. This is our guest, a very special guest, Josh Denne with Jodi Arias.

        Tell us about this photo, where it took place and what your observations were of this woman.

        JOSH DENNE, FRIEND OF TRAVIS ALEXANDER: That was, I think, the first day that met her. I was speaking at an event, I believe in San Bernardino, and she`d come up to me afterwards and introduced herself and wanted to get a picture.

        I immediately just felt something a little bit off with her. I couldn`t really put my finger on it. Certainly didn`t think it was this far off. But, you know, that was about as far as it went. And it must have been a year later that I saw her with Travis, you know, and they had – - they had a relationship going. That`s what that picture reminds me of.

        VELEZ-MITCHELL: Let me ask you, you were with PPL at the time. And now it`s called Legal Shield but at the time it was Pre-Paid Legal. And again as I mention before, she seemed to use this business organization, where you`re supposed to get ahead and sell legal insurance as a dating service. Was there something inappropriate that you observed about the way she interacted in the PPL world?

        DENNE: The only thing I saw about Jodi initially was that she did put out a lot of sexual energy. It did seem like she was shopping for someone to take care of her. That was my observation. I don`t know if that true or not, but that was the observation I had. And you know, I think when she linked up with Travis like I said previously, she saw a rising star and she just wanted — she wanted to latch on to him and that`s what happen.

        VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well Josh, I`m not blowing smoke, but you are a handsome guy, did she come on to you?

        DENNE: You know she just said hi. I felt the sexual energy, you know, when someone stands up but I don`t know, I turned away from it. Quite honestly, I just felt a little strange. As you can see, you have seen it in the courtroom, and you have seen it on just her different stories, and you look at the “48 Hour” interview. And I think that`s the most honest description of Travis and her relationship in that interview right there.

        But you can just see how she has this eerie, almost strange look about her. And that`s how I saw her.

        VELEZ-MITCHELL: I would say it`s kind of a Stepford look. I want to bring in Wendy Walsh, psychologist.

        DENNE: Ok.

        VELEZ-MITCHELL: Josh is giving us some great insight. As one of our panelists said he should be doing the closing argument although prosecutor Juan Martinez is also doing a great job. But I think he is describing something that we can all sense but we`re finding it hard to put words to.

        There`s a certain vacantness (ph) like a Stepford wife — we all remember that famous movie where people were robotic, women were robotic.

        So, there you go. Acc to this numbskull, JA has this ‘sexual energy’ that permeates everything and ‘everybody’ senses it!! Just like Abe, he too is pi**ed that she did NOT put out to him. To all these men, she’s a ‘whore’ becoz SHE invoked in them the ‘forbidden’ thoughts and sensations – so SHE was the whore!! Projection much??? This situation where all these men are throwing stones at JA (motive I believe is because she did NOT put out – but they are calling HER the bad one), is much like what is happening with Taylor Swift – she too is being much maligned as jumping from relationship to relationship, for the same reason.

        Regarding, racism, the DT could have thrown that bit in too, and everything else including the kitchen sink!
        PS. Didn’t mean to make this post so long.

        • Great post Introspective.

          I find it repulsive that all Travis’ friends freely admit that they see nothing but SEX SEX SEX when they look at Jodi, but are able to blame her for their own misperception. The haters are sexually obsessed with Jodi, and they are constantly bringing it up and talking about how attractive she is. Sometimes I wonder if that’s why their wives are so damn insecure, and they’re afraid of Jodi and they use that fear to condemn her too.

          And I agree about the racism. What bugs me a LOT is that HLN has folks like JVM and Jean Cesarez participating even though they are Latina. They don’t care that they are basically selling out one of their own, they just want the $$$ and ratings and to hell with who it hurts.

      • FreshAirBreather says:

        Yes! Thank you for saying this. I agree completely. When I was young I naively thought I was too well educated and emotionally strong to ever wind up where I eventually did. (No one is too anything to ever wind up here, when you get involved with an abuser.) But then, I was young and inexperienced when I was so arrogant as to think that. What excuse do all these people have, especially now that they have heard all the testimony of these experts, are they all eighteen and naive? And some of the women shouting loudest are claiming to be survivors of DV themselves? How can they not recognize the verbal assault against her, at least? How can a DV survivor not recognize which person was in control in the relationship? It becomes automatic after you are freed, in my experience. You become sensitized to it. The “conversation” about Jodi and DV going on in the media makes my stomach turn. I feel as though I live in a topsy turvy world. I was seriously triggered the week of the Tot Doc testifying that Travis’s clearly abusive texts were not “abuse.” Yes, I have PTSD.

      • Milan, you have brilliant posts. Please stay and continue contributing!! There are women out there reading who greatly appreciate it, I know I would too. :)

        Yes, I said the same thing about Jodi being an object when Travis had that T-shirt made for her. Even if it had a blog url on the back, that’s a hell of a way to “advertise” don’t you think? He treated her like she was a toast, a television, or a book. A book doesn’t have rights. The owner can rip the pages, burn it, throw it away, trade it for something else, and the book has no say. The book has no rights to say what happens to it.

        And I totally agree – those women out there supporting the Travis Taliban are so clueless and full of their own petty jealousies they can’t see how this affects themselves and their daughters later. It’s sick and sad at the same time. I can’t believe they want to live in a world where it is normal for women to be treated like that.

      • seek2understand says:

        Good post!

    • Sirlips says:

      I have often thought about your last comment. I have always considered myself a patriot. I love my country, for what it is supposed to stand for. I served my country. I would again. At the same time, i have had real consideration about moving out of this country. If i didnt have the kids (split family/divorce) i would be gone probably. Looked very hard at New Zealand actually.

      I doubt now that that will ever happen, but there is a good chance that someday me and mine will become tempted again.

      WHile im here, i have tried to become active in fixing the problems. It truelly is scary how far we have strayed away from knowledge, common sense and justice for all.

      • I agree, I want to fix the problems too. America is a great place where people have found great freedom and happiness, and I want to see that again. I want to see us living up to all the things we say we are. I want to see progress so that ALL people can live in freedom and without fear.

        It takes us working together, though, as a collective. Sadly people don’t seem to want to cooperate and do their part to make this a nice society to live in. I guess that’s why I admire the northern European countries because they value progress and cooperation, and through secular politics allow for religious freedom and freedom FROM religion! (This is important to me too)

        I’m not expecting miracles or everyone to become BFFs but there’s a point to which I wonder why people just can’t be happy living their own lives and letting others live theirs. Nobody has to like each other but respect for other’s rights has to be a priority.

  44. tonya says:

    OK this is what I think happened someone gave the hughes proof that travis molested there oldes son and they asked there son was this true and he said yes this would have been in may now they are mad and plan the revenge on travis they probable knew about the gun being stolen from the grandparents house because of the statements by dan hall and others that called jodi the hughes brother introduses jodi to ryan and they envite her to be at his house on the 4th but jodi went to travis house instead and all hell broke loose the intruders had hoods on they were suprised that jodi was there they knew she was to be with ryan if chris and sky were the ones in the house or they had someone else do it. they shot travis and knock her out when she comes too she is confronted by them have to go back to her story of the intruders now they let her go she goes to ryans and he and dan hall meet her at a restraunt or meeting but before she is ready to leave she is asked to go 4 wheeling this is the chance to kill her but she say I have to work and does not then they fix her lic plate and the cop stops her rayan is in back of her when this happen then she gets home and mom says people are calling saying she is crazy and needs treatment. she is envited to go camping get a 9mm gun but does not go another attemp to kill her now the 911 call travis is found 5 days later why house is open door policy and the cover up is on the way for 5 days a mentions of computer broken someone shows up at the house with a lab top to point jodi out with a photo Dustin also arives also Dan hall was called by the hughes to ask about travis and more and more and flores is told jodi did it why to cover up the real killers the hughes are on the cancun trip so they only have to talk on the phone while everyone goes into the jodi did it then flores gets the ashley reed saying her husband knew or may have done it then changed her mind then the flores report and all the stuff we know now with the breakdown that something was a foot sherlock homes was not in charge I can go on and on but this is what happens next she tells matt what happened to her at travis house and he was with her for 2 yrs till ashley’s death and 4 months latter her story changed because someone must have threaten matt or his family would be hurt jodi’s family was getting threats too her sister said someone said some really bad things to her daughter or that is what I read and to the self defence it was not from travis but from chris and sky hughes remember she told the jury that she said her sister was stupid because she was on drugs and in an abusive relationship and jodi was in the same with travis but he was killed for touching someones kid sexually and that is what killed him that is why she told the story of travis masterbating to little boy picture if he did not get it from the computer he got it from chris and sky hughes house he was always spending the nite with them and if he snuck in to see jodi and have sex with her he could have done the same to the hughes kid well that is what I think and the cards said and god showed me on easter sunday and I will hope that god will help her find a way to prove my theory on this someone will talk or something will point in that direction the trial has done everything to keep the hughes out of this and she is being railroaded to the DP has to happen to keep her from talking just hope no one kills her before that happens if you think im an on to something lets talk about it because the way this trail is now there is no way she can get a fair trial and ryan burns invited jodi to his house when she went to the restraunt dan hall was there and he has made statements about her they knew things before flores did ryan says this in the flores report page 20 ???

  45. tonya says:

    renee :)

    read your comment what has been happening hope you still have a computer shit started to happen to me to just be carefull of opening links that someone sends or check for viruses before you do even if you know them that is how they got to me I opened a link that a friend sent me and it had a virus attached to it and then google said i had 2 spys when I got on my brothers computer

  46. BevM says:

    Sirlips, Thank you for that very insightful post. I love how you scattered bits of sex into it to keep us rivited ;)

    I have a few random thoughts I just want to share.

    I feel angry at myself for watching HLN for so long (years) and now I wonder if anything they ever told me was the truth.

    I think they HAVE to believe in what they’re doing in order to come across as passionate as they do.

    I don’t think JM’s closing will be short because with his monumental ego, he enjoys the spotlight too much to tone it down. He will be grandiose and dramatic, loud and abrasive, as always.

    I hope Jennifer does the closing argument.

    I want to say once again how happy I am that I found this site. I only have one co-worker who is watching this trial like I am so I virtually have no one I can discuss this with who actually knows all the facts. Others are just getting bits and pieces, mostly from HLN, and are not really able to make an informed opinion.

    I am worried sick that when the actual verdict comes down, the haters might do something to shut down this site, by overloading it or something. What will I do if that happens? I NEED you guys!

    • maria rigadopoulou says:

      Imagine the verdict being reached and not having someone to turn to! I’ll be devastated if the haters do anything to this site.And I’m positively sure they will indeed try to gag us that day! Bring ‘em on haters! I guess we’ll have to resort to lowering our level that day to treat dirt like you!

  47. BeeCee says:

    I’m sure you all know this, but just a tip for FB users on any of the targeted sites…NEVER NEVER click on anything that gets sent to your private email that is associated with your FB. I have gotten phishing scam emails under the guise of being a message from a facebook friend. Strangely it is always the same facebook friend…

    Many times people can then embed a keylogger type program on your computer and get your passwords to various things if you click on their weird links.. also you can end up with computer problems like tonya has.

  48. JoshDavis says:

    WOW, SIrlips I commend you. That was the most amazing insight into this whole trial
    that I could have read. I wish someone could publish that as an article but as of now
    if you hashtag #JodiArias I can see 2 twitter accounts, one with 24, 469 followers and another
    twitter account with 15,273 followers. I really hope that if a JUROR is online, they would stop
    and read that because it really brought it home!
    Thanks for writing that because that’s how I have been feeling this whole time.

    You nailed the JM/Reality Show theatrics down to a tee!

    I am glad this forum exists because I have always been a leader and not
    a follower and not one to jump on the hate bandwagon so easy.
    I stop to read the facts, then I stop to think about how IT MAKES ME TRULY FEEL.

    I definitely believe that Luka Magnotta guy in Canada the Cannibal Killer deserves
    what’s coming to him. As I do believe the Aurora Theater Shooter…

    I do not believe in my heart that Jodi is an evil person and
    I do not believe she deserves all this insanity being thrown at her.

    I do not believe Travis deserved to die the way he did.
    But sometimes in life…The Universe can be very strange, sad and very mysterious.

    I do believe in Fate and that you are the designer of your own destiny.

  49. JoshDavis says:

    “Life always waits for some crisis to occur before revealing itself at its most brilliant.” ~Paul Coelho

  50. JoshDavis says:

    hummmmm INNNNERESTING!

    Jeff Gold in 24 seconds on HLN’s Nancy Grace describes why the State’s evidence that Jodi Arias shot last, not first,could backfire on its premeditation case.

    PS is it me of does Nancy Grace look like scary as fuck with her up do and heavy drag make up?

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-R7amIC13iU

  51. will says:

    Outstanding post SIRLIPS. Great writing skills…… with humor too!.

  52. cindy jewell says:

    Can someone answer this for me. Crime of passion. Where does that fall in the penalty stage

  53. Gwen says:

    Brilliant Sirlips!! Spot on! You have this summed up like no one else could. I get on here and rant and rave and quip but if I were as good a writer as you this is what I’d say! lol

  54. Al says:

    Came across this,

    Thought some here might find it interesting. It’s sort of old but still

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m9BigVBU5dA

  55. Oh, and I wanted to share a news story I found when I woke up today.

    Apparently users on Reddit are making a big deal that all Miss Koreans look alike:

    http://now.msn.com/miss-korea-contestants-all-look-alike-from-plastic-surgery-redditors-say

    But that’s exactly I see happening with Miss America. How can we point the finger at other countries and pretend to be better than they are, if we are doing the exact same thing?

    Just like we are making a BIG DEAL that Saudi Arabia put out it’s first campaign against domestic violence. But why should we, when Americans can’t even talk about domestic violence without minimizing victim’s experiences and protecting the abusers?

    Just like “Abe” Abdulhadi pointed the finger at Saudi Arabia taking people behind the courthouse and shooting them, when that’s exactly what the haters are advocating for Jodi.

    IMO we Americans need to clean up what’s going on right here at home before looking down on other countries and pretending we are better than they are. Talk is cheap. If we’re going to claim to be a progressive country, we need to ACT like it. Yeah, I’m looking at you too HLN.

    (Don’t get me wrong, I know the situation for women in Saudi Arabia is dire – but shouldn’t we Americans be doing what we can to avoid making the same mistakes?)

    • tonya says:

      thank god we dont live in saudi arabia they come here and still have to be abused here too. They can not even think forthemself must get permission from the husband sick. we as americans have come a long way with domestic violence in the 70′s the cops did nothing they told you get a restraining order and call if he attacks you again. That has changed if a man hits a woman he goes to jail now same with the woman hitting a man. but the court room is a different thing in this case with jodi and the judge ???? JM ????

  56. scrappydoo says:

    Did Jodi really tell Daryl Brewer she needed the gas cans for a trip to Mesa or did he just get tripped up on the stand?

    • D says:

      I think JM tripped his with his trickery. I believe Nurmi tried to clear that up, but HLN does not show that part over and over again.

    • cindy jewell says:

      He got tripped up. That truly was heart wrenching to watch. He still loves Jodi very much. Perhaps in some ways. He may feel guilty.

  57. Danielle says:

    Hi Guys,
    Good post today and good posts all day!! As for Jodi being a little nuts well I’m a little nuts too :) . I always say I can embarrass myself alone in front of myself bc of the goofy stuff I do. Especially when I’m alone. I also sing to myself alone and I don’t know why. I sing about what I’m doing and I sing to the cats, like make up songs with their names in them. I know I’m blushing I can’t believe I’m writing this. If someone put a hidden camera in my house they’d be entertained. Life’s no fun without being a little nuts.

    I’m Jodi’s age and if I was arrested they would probably make fun of me and showing videos of the 33 year old girl who cried for her Mom bc I bet that’s what I would do. God only knows what I would do but I usually ask for Mom first she’s my best friend.

    I bet I would also lie first too bc I know I would be scared. But I like to think I would lie better :) .

    So does that make me a bad person? I don’t think so. I don’t think it makes Jodi a bad person. I mean I wonder how many people walk in and are like yep it was me. I think a lot of peoples first reaction is to protect themselves. I don’t know what I would do if I was in her shoes but I’m sure if people wanted to they could make fun of it and show it 50 times and make fun of me more.

    • BevM says:

      I can pretty much guarantee that I would lie and try to protect myself. I think that anyone who says otherwise is, well….erm… a liar.

      I also agree that life is more fun if your just a little bit crazy…
      I like to keep people guessing…. You just never know what I might be up to.
      I also find it amusing that if you actually tell the truth about some of your most private thoughts, people just laugh and think your joking.

      Keeps life interesting.

      Also, if I was going to kill someone, I would not have such a disorganized, messy scene left behind me. Neither would Jodi, she is way too smart for that.

    • tonya says:

      Danielle sounds like my life too do all that and more

    • Danielle says:

      You guys sound fun! :)

    • Basse Krokke says:

      If, God forbid, you did find yourself the subject of a police interrogation, PLEASE, say NOTHING, and ask for an attorney.

      • Wes says:

        and remember when you talk with your family and friends from the lockup, never, never, discuss the case with them, no matter how curious they are, or eager to offer lay legal advice, or discuss legal strategies

        whatever is said will be recorded, and may be played back later. in court

    • maria rigadopoulou says:

      LOL,Danielle I’m as crazy as hell.Even when we get together with my friends we praise each other for being ”the aliens in this small town’s society”.As for the cats’ poems,lol I do that all the time-I bet my neighbours think I’m crazy,well cant blame them!
      Jodi sure is not crazy-she’s different.Not in a negative way,in an exceptional way!!People who are different not because they put on an act but because they are effortlessly special and were born to shine and have this particular aura of uniqueness around them is my favourite kind of people.

  58. tonya says:

    with all he lies being told in this trial how can they keep anything straight as to what really happened in the bathroom …. :roll:

  59. scrappydoo says:

    Just a thought but has anyone else thought about the possibility that Travis lured Jodi to his house to kill her? He was obviously very angry with her at the end of May. Maybe he wanted to make sure she stayed quiet about information she had about him. Maybe he set her up. Maybe he told her to do some of the things she did like turn off her cell phone, borrow gas cans etc. Maybe hes the one that didnt want anyone to track her to Mesa.

    • cindy jewell says:

      There is way too how many odd things in this trial. I find it odd That Chris Hughes brother would fix Jodi up with Ryan. The Hughes Didn’t like Jodi. I think Ryan lied on the stand

      • stan says:

        actually the Hughes ‘s liked Jodi until they decided to pin the killing on her, see testimony about there e-mails to Travis

    • tonya says:

      crossed my mind too but they tried that in utah

    • maria rigadopoulou says:

      Hmmm,never thought of that.Sounds far-fetched.Well yes and no.I dont know.Maybe.Could it be?Yes,he could have thought of that.But then again,no.Why?I dont know.I’m confused.Brain damage from thinking about this trial too much.

  60. tonya says:

    the jury needs to know that the house was open for 5 days then comes the day he his found in the bathroom for 5 days anyone could have been there. the crime was not protected during that time

  61. Heather1 says:

    I should just like to say that one person’s idea of calling someone a ”fruitcake”, would differ from anothers, possibly because that person is quiet, serious and has a tendency to be introverted, whereas the person they are calling a fruitcake might be lively, extroverted at times, and enjoys life. I would say that Jodi would fit a similar bill to me….take my neighbour, he always calls me a bit mad! :)

  62. Danielle says:

    You know what else I think JM has against him? He confuses people. I don’t know about you guys but when he gets all worked up even the witnesses stop and stare and him and say can you repeat the question. Sometimes after he gets on a questioning roll I don’t even know what he’s getting to bc he’s just yelling and even the witness looks lost. It’s like he’s so into yelling and he words things oddly sometimes. Then it seems that he’s dragging out a minor detail and yells what he was trying to drag out of the person. If he gets himself all worked up in the closing arguments and starts ranting and raving he might end up being confusing.

    JW is very neat and orderly. She’s very easy to follow when you’re listening to her. I think, anyway. If I was on the jury. Well, when I watch anyway I find JMs questioning harder to follow and I find JW very easy to follow and pay attention to.

    I hope that makes sense.

    • tonya says:

      the way he rants and pranes around he looks like he has to pee

    • Edward says:

      Danielle, you’re exactly right. I have thought that from the beginning. He is often times confusing. I am convinced he does a lot of this on purpose. He will overtalk the response, ask another question while the witness is still answering if the response benefits the defense. Demands yes or no answers where those answers will mis-characterize the witness, berate and scream at witnesses, insult and discredit their testimony right in front of the jury…..etc. He operates on the principle that what goes in the ear is what sticks. It doesn’t matter where, or how it came to be. He just wants the words to reach the jury at all costs. For example, he thinks if something is repeated enough times…it becomes fact.
      But I believe that it will not work this time. I don’t think Juan Martinez will get a guilty verdict because he has not proved guilt. The proof is simply not there. And no other retry will put the evidence there. Again, because the evidence is not there.

  63. tonya says:

    need to keep track of the last time we heard for renee it is Sunday I stayed away for 5 days then used someone elses computer and still got message that 2 people were spying on me so again if you have question dont open it check for viruses first. Renee stay safe

    • SR0606 says:

      I know. She has me worried.
      I know I don’t post that often but I’ve been here along time and feel like I know all you guy’s.
      Praying she is ok.

  64. Wes says:

    ttp://www.tentmaker.org/Quotes/couragequotes.htm

    Courage Quotes

    “There may be times when we are powerless to prevent injustice, but there must never be a time when we fail to protest.” Elie Wiesel

    As long as the world shall last there will be wrongs, and if no man objected and no man rebelled, those wrongs would last forever.” Clarence Darrow

    “I swore never to be silent whenever human beings endure suffering and humiliation. We must always take sides. Neutrality helps the oppressor, never the victim. Silence encourages the tormentor, never the tormented.” Elie Weisel

    Courage is resistance to fear, mastery of fear, not absence of fear.
    Mark Twain

    Life shrinks or expands in proportion to one’s courage. –Anais Nin

    Our doubts are traitors, and make us lose the good we oft might win, by fearing to attempt.
    –William Shakespeare

    Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed citizens can change the world. Indeed, it’s the only thing that ever has.” Margaret Mead

    • Wes says:

      three more quotes to help us when our spirits flag

      “The only tired I was, was tired of giving in.” Rosa Parks Biography, seamstress, Civil Rights Leader,
      1913-2005

      “Find out just what people will quietly submit to, and you have found out the exact measure of injustice and wrong which will be imposed on them, and these will continue till they are resisted with either words or blows. The limits of tyrants are prescribed by the endurance of those whom they oppress.” Frederick Douglass, African-American slave, and later abolitionist.

      “In Germany they came first for the Communists, and I didn’t speak up because I wasn’t a
      Communist. Then they came for the Jews, and I didn’t speak up because I wasn’t a Jew. Then they came for the trade-unionists, and I didn’t speak up because I wasn’t a trade-unionist. Then they came for the Catholics, and I didn’t speak up because I was a Protestant. Then they came for me and by that time no one was left to speak up.” Attributed to Rev. Martin Niemoller

      • Basse Krokke says:

        “You will never do anything in this world without courage. It is the greatest quality of the mind next to honor.” — Aristotle

        “Courage can’t see around corners, but goes around them anyway.” — Mignon McLaughlin

      • maria rigadopoulou says:

        WOW! already copied/pasted on my FB wall!! Thanks!!

      • Nikki says:

        Thanks, Wes. Niemoller’s quote has been going through my head for weeks. I’m so glad you posted it for everyone.

    • Also Abused says:

      Thanks so much. I really really really need these today. I am falling apart!

      • cindy jewell says:

        Okay girl start talking. we are here for you.

      • joujoubaby says:

        Take heart, girlfriend. To the extent that we can have, we’ve got your back.

      • joujoubaby says:

        And I should point out that before my Graves’ was diagnosed I almost checked myself into Silver Hill, so don’t discount the added strain that puts on your psyche.

        • Also Abused says:

          Thanks joujou. I was just subjected to hell at work on Friday, an ambush basically, by another employee who was allowed to have a free-for-all at me in something my boss called a “mediation” although she never said a word. It occurred after a fire drill that involved rapidly flashing lights. I have a seizure disorder and didn’t feel able to evacuate down 12 flights of stairs and sat practicing deep breathing and progressive relaxation. This other employee didn’t evacuate either and she grilled me on why I didn’t go down and mocked me for deep breathing. I was put in a position where I had to disclose my disability to her. She continued to laugh about it. My boss just sat there, even though I believe she had a duty to step in because that was harassment. The rest of the session was much like a JM cross-examination where this woman slung insult after insult at me claiming I have spread various rumours about her in the office, including one that she claimed I said she was a victim of domestic abuse. Seriously? That was absolutely insane. The irony is this is the same woman who recently told someone else that my engagement ring is fake, and I bought it for myself, because no one would want to marry a fat old ugly bitch like me. I’m shaking thinking about going back in there tomorrow. I don’t know what I can do since my boss allowed her to even harass me about my disability.

          • joujoubaby says:

            Umm..you call an employment lawyer. And one that specializes in disability discrimination. I will research for you and fine the name of someone good. My dream was about workplace betrayal, but the circumstances were slightly different. I know how workplace crap in a law firm can be, AA, and it is NOT HEALTHY for someone with our condition.

            • joujoubaby says:

              OK. I have these names, probably in descending order of whatever-ness: Elaine Bredehoft, Paul Sprenger’s firm, Robert B. Fitzpatrick, and it looks like Morgan Lewis has a good Employment dept. in DC. I think you should talk to somebody who knows. They HAVE to accommodate you, and I would talk to somebody about what the right way to ask for the accommodation would be.

              • joujoubaby says:

                P.S. My dream sucked, and if it was related, I can see why you are having panic attacks.

              • joujoubaby says:

                PPS I don’t officially believe in that stuff, but I did dream about Black Monday of 1987 a few weeks before it happened, among other weirdnesses.

                • Also Abused says:

                  Wow that’s amazing. You must have a gift of sight. Thanks for the names, unfortunately, I can’t afford a lawyer.

            • Also Abused says:

              You were close then because it did feel like betrayal. I wouldn’t be able to afford an employment lawyer, unfortunately. I just need to look for another job, but with my ever-changing schedule, that’s extremely problematic. My schedule changes with a moment’s notice and I never know it in advance.

              • Also Abused says:

                The worst part is that I’m going to have to go through a “debriefing” about it with my boss tomorrow. That’s what she called it. She loves all this drama (my boss). She is constantly picking on someone. I’ve never worked in such an unhealthy environment in my entire life.

                • joujoubaby says:

                  I wish I could say that I don’t know the feeling. Who is the debriefing with?

                • Also Abused says:

                  It’s with my boss. That will NOT be pleasant. I do not trust her. Plus, she has, in the past made comments about my height (I’m 4’11″), asked about my hororscope sign, and even said at one point “I’m not your abusive ex-husband.”

                • joujoubaby says:

                  Can you record it surreptitiously? Is that legal/admissible in your jurisdiction?

                • joujoubaby says:

                  By the bye, wtf does she need to be “debriefed” about? She was present for fuck’s sake

                • Nikki says:

                  AA. How about bringing in Randy Newman’s “Short People” song just to totally embarrass her, hahaha.

                  I hope you can visualize the best outcome for this (which would be undoubtedly to get the heck out of there since that was a real PTSD~ass kick) but short of that, just hang tight for awhile after you have quietly noted for your own records when and for what reason you felt you had to disclose that disability to her highness. And since your boss allowed her to continue to harass you with respect to a particular condition in her presence, duly note in your records the boss’s colossal error in fostering a hostile work environment.

                  Your boss also misled you by stating that you would engage in some sort of “mediation”. The insinuation was that by divulging more HIPPA-covered information about yourself, you would somehow benefit – not!

                  Then sit back and watch how the frustrated control freak goes about her business. Since you already observed or heard that she made problems for others in the office, there is reason to wait and watch her job performance.

                  In the meantime, you could give a copy of the ADA to the boss in whom she constantly confides. Bypass Ms. Negativity. When you give it to the boss, just include a short memo that states it’s FYI from you with respect to “events” on “such and such a date” and thank her for her time and for listening. My guess is that they will both be completely stymied and will STFU. Lol.

                  Keep visualizing your “best outcome”. You only need your own skill and finesse.

                • Also Abused says:

                  I can record it as DC only requires one party’s consent. Perhaps telling her I’m recording it would be more shocking to her though.

                  She claims this is part of the process. First the “mediation” (which was really a cross examination by the other employee. Second, she meets with each of us separately.

                  I was looking on the EEOC’s site and I believe I would have to fill out and send in a form before I could speak with them.

                • joujoubaby says:

                  AA, I have struggled for years with boundary issues and compulsive people pleasing (in the lexicon of today)- I know, it’s weird for a litigator, but I think I was was overcompensating. Anyway, I hated conflict (interpersonal) more than anything in the world. Interpersonal conflict with the passive aggressive/manipulative seems to be the worst kind. I recently had an issue with my kids’ principal (stupid, ineffectual, meddlesome) wherein she confronted me about my son’s having been in the office most of the day because his allergies were bothering him. Despite the fact that I was never called to pick him up, she was put out hat he had been there. She then went on to confront me about it in from of a group of other students, and when I didn’t cow and apologize, she insisted that I call her later. I did not, and she tracked me down 2 days later at the school play. Again, she did not want to speak there, but wanted to talk on the phone. I fretted and fretted about calling her back, and I have to admit that in a moment of weakness, I called my ex husband, who gave me the same advice I gave you, less the memo. He said that she would have invented something else to go on about, and he was right. I think that you are in the same situation. You have a less than effective cheif who is trying to keep all of the Indians in order, while making sure that her pet is at the top of the pecking order. You don’t want to escalate, but you don’t want to be punked out either. Write your memo. In fact, I would write two versions. I would write one that was purely theraputic where you pull no punches whatsoever, and a second one. It can be totally casual, and say something like, “I just want to go over again what was covered in our meeting.’ I’ll bet you anything that alone will put her in her place. You don’t have to decide who else it will go to until after your meeting, if anyone. But most importantly, don’t feel like you need to justify anything at this meeting. You can do that in the memo if you want, at a different time, or not at all. But I suspect that she is calling this meeting to goad you into doing that, or throwing yourself on her mercy to be respectful of your disability or whatever. I would resist the temptation. This is her homefield advantage. You can do all of that at another time if you wish on your own terms. Go to the meeting. Do not apologize. Don’t make excuses. If she asks for info, relate it succinctly and politely, and with as little embellishment as possible. Good luck. I’m sending you all I’ve got to send.

                • Nikki says:

                  AA, check the ADA to see if there are provisions for people w/disabilities w/respect to fire/safety drills. If the drill would exacerbate a condition, an employee could possibly be exempt from a drill(?). Surely there were rapidly flashing lights in the stairwells at each floor, which you would want to avoid except in an actual emergency situation.

                  Two issues here, linked but separate: How you conducted yourself during the drill bearing your condition in mind. And: How the other employees handled your personal information, which is protected by the legislation.

                  It is possible your boss has already talked to HR and has some information for you about this. If she is smart, she’s looked into it. If she hasn’t and you must (sigh) enlighten her about various ADA protections, she’ll be grateful that you set her straight – that HR didn’t come down on her for using your own private protected medical information in a negligent manner, i.e. requiring you to sit in a one-sided meeting that was represented to be a “mediation”, while another employee was allowed to mock and belittle your medical condition (!). HIPPA regs are no joke, but these two don’t seem to know that.

                  At the very least you deserve an apology and one should be forthcoming. I wouldn’t encourage any discussion of issues in the “debriefing” other than the triggering incident. Don’t let them muddy the waters – it’s too upsetting for you right now. Stay calm; we’re pulling for you!

              • joujoubaby says:

                I think that you can talk to someone at EEOC for free. Actually, that would probably be the first step. I don’t think that plaintiffs typically pay, even in regular employment disputes in any case. This is slightly different in that there has not been a separation, but you want to make sure that your boss is the one making the mistakes. Unless something has changed since I was a young associate long ago, I know that the EEOC will advise you for free. Plus, you have the beginnings of a hostile work environment claim- against a law firm! (I just looked it up, there is a cause of action for hostile work environment under ADA).

                • Also Abused says:

                  A law firm isn’t the best type of employer to bring a case against. I keep wondering if I should bring this to HR which is in NY or to my boss’s boss, the administrative managing partner, but that might just piss her off royally.

                • joujoubaby says:

                  OK, what about this as a potential game plan: You sit down now and write down everything that has happened so far, go through the stupid “debriefing” and treat it like you are being deposed. You don’t initiate anything, don’t give any info away. Give short, polite answers. No editorializing. Don’t even feel that you need to stick up for yourself. Then you write a memo about the whole incident, addressed to your bitchy boss, and cc the cow, HR, and the administrative partner?

                • Also Abused says:

                  I actually started writing a memo and was considering who to give it to: her, the administrative managing partner, HR. I don’t know. Going over her head is probably not a good idea and my life will then become even more hell at work. I’m lost! I”m also panicking so much about this.

                • joujoubaby says:

                  Just take it one step at time: Firstly, the meeting tomorrow, and DO record it. You iphone should do a pretty good job sitting in your open handbag, and the light will go out and appear off. Next, complete your memo and decide who all you want to give it to. Third, decide if you want the EEOC to investigate. You can’t do 2 until 1 is complete, and you can’t do 3 until 2 is complete. So don’t stress about 2 until you are finished with 1, and so on. If you compartmentalize each step, you will be able to manage. You will go with all of my good thoughts and support tomorrow. Let us know as soon as you can. We are here for you!

                • Also Abused says:

                  I’m home. The “debriefing” was hell and I left work because I explained how upset I was, how I was in a state of panic and she offered to allow me to leave, so I did. Not sure if that was the right thing to do or not. But I needed to get out of there.

                  She denied prior knowledge of my seizure disorder. Since I never put it in writing to her, I guess she can deny it. She got very defensive and almost angry about that. However, I told her that whether or not she had prior knowledge, once I disclosed it during the meeting, she had a duty to intervene when the other employee laughed, rolled her eyes, and told me I was a l was a liar. She admitted that I turned to her (my boss) at that point and told her it was harassment and that she didn’t intervene. I said that by her not doing so, she condoned the behaviour. She said the other employee had a right to air her concerns and I had a duty to listen to them, so the mediation was mandatory. Also, that I had the right to defend myself and I did.

                  I said it should have been postponed when I explained my state due to the strobe lights at the beginning and she didn’t offer that. She agreed but said what’s done is done. She said these sessions are helpful because they get everything out on the table. She said I should realize there is a sensitivity there (wtf?) and suggested that I go to the other employee on my own and apologize for the way she felt and reiterate that I didn’t say the rumours I was accused of. I said that I was not comfortable doing that because I felt it would create more problems and that I felt her claim that I said she was a victim of domestic abuse was further harassment of me because I had been forced to reveal to that employee that I was a victim myself when the photo of my ex was distributed and she asked me about it. My boss admitted that I also stated at that point in the meeting that this was harassment and that she again, did not intervene. I also said that most of the issues she raised were things my boss should address, not this other employee (such as when I cover the receptionist’s breaks which is in my job description as a requirement, and when I leave the desk I’m assigned to in order to carry out my other responsibilities, or when I take breaks myself). She said those were things we’d address at another time, but that she had no problems with my performance.

                  She went on again about how the other employee had a right to speak her concerns. I said that then I should have a right to discuss my concerns about being subjected to that kind of harassment, but I didn’t want to go to above her head without discussing it with her first. I could tell she was incredibly pissed at that point, but she reined it in. She told me this was all off the record, but if I wanted to go on the record, she would take begin taking notes. I said that I did want to go on the record, and that I felt someone else should be involved because it involves harassment of my disability. She said she would discuss it with the HR manager. She said I was making some very serious allegations. I said that I wanted to be sure I would not be harassed further about my disability. She noted that. That’s when I told her I was shaking and in a panic and not feeling well about this and she offered to let me go home.

                  As I walked by her office to leave a few moments later, she was sitting there looking pretty bewildered.

                  I’m a complete and utter wreck now. I don’t really know what to do. This is a clusterfuck!

              • joujoubaby says:

                Sorry for the hijack, SJ and moderators. Please excuse. AA is so worth it, though!

          • cindy jewell says:

            I’m sorry this happened to you. do not be the victim you’re a smart woman you know the harassment laws.

          • JC - TEAM JODI ADMIN says:

            It’s workplace bullying. Your boss not responding to blatant bullying and discrimination because you are in a protected class is more common that you think. Is the person who said that to you, a known bully? Sometimes bosses have trouble stepping up due to also feeling intimidated. Hmmm. I can see your dilemna. Now the balls in your court, legally speaking.

            • Also Abused says:

              I know that she has caused problems for 3 other employees recently. She’s the kind of employee who kisses the boss’s ass and tells the boss everything and anything. She spends more of her day behind the boss’s closed door than she does doing anything else.

              • lara says:

                aa, i am so sorry you are being treated like that. i hope you have a human resources person you can contact or something. call in sick tomorrow and call around to see what resources you have available in your company or area. you can’t take that. how incredibly upsetting.

                • Also Abused says:

                  I really can’t call in sick tomorrow as I’m assigned and will be needed. A part of me wishes I could. We do have an HR department in NY (we’re a DC satellite office). I don’t know any of them, and I’d be going right over my boss’s head. I’m really not sure if that is a good idea or not. Thanks so much for caring Lara.

              • D says:

                Do you have an advocate you could take into that meeting with you? Much like a union rep does for their members. Maybe your fiance? Someone as a witness. Most of all, I say, don’t say anything. Don’t sign anything.

          • tonya says:

            you should have held up your hand and said talk to the hand then got up and excuse yourself sorry you had a bad day at work

          • joujoubaby says:

            Also, I think that there are Third World prisons with healthier interpersonal relationship “patterns” than the average American law firm. The closest I’ve ever come to a healthy working environment in my career is working for the government, and that wasn’t ideal either. Plus after paying my kids’ nanny and my student loans I was in the red.

          • Oh my god!!!! That’s a terrible thing to say!

            My heart goes out to you. You are a great person who deserves to be treated so much better than that. <3

      • Al says:

        Hang in there AA. It always gets better.

        • Also Abused says:

          Thanks Al. Unfortunately, it just seems to get worse at this job. I need to get very serious about looking for another. Luckily, there are plenty in this area. I almost walked out on Friday and that’s something I have to guard against doing if I become even more upset tomorrow.

          • D says:

            If you have disability insurance, perhaps you should considering going on a disability leave for stress related issues. Get the hell out of that environment for it will continue to stress you out and no job is worth your health. Again, from someone who knows. Also, as hard as it is to do, be happy in front of them. There is nothing bullies detest more than to see their target happy. Like I said, it is very hard to do, but it works. One day at a time.
            Best of luck.

            • Also Abused says:

              Hmmm I should look into how that works. I do have short and long term disability coverage through work.

    • Al says:

      And here’s one JM should read

      “Whenever you have truth it must be given with love, or the message and the messenger will be rejected”

  65. Marguerite says:

    Somehow, i have managed not to encounter anyone in real life who is following the case…until this weekend. I had to swiftly change the subject because I was afraid of getting into a heated debate!! I’m relieved I can visit this place for some rational discussion. :)

    • annieEP says:

      I had that encounter in the waiting room of the dentist off about a week ago. I got a very dirty look as one of the men left.

      • tonya says:

        Marguerite :roll:

        if you are new welcome and enjoy this site I love here I was afraid of saying things here to like someone else did this and kept it a secret but now that it is almost to the end of the trial I spit it out and let every one see what I thought some will like it and others will not but it only matters to the people who manage this site if they dont like it they will take it down and something they will give you a reason why they did it and if you are so not for jodi and are kkk clan they will band you from here so you can not come back there is a lot of information here just go to the top of this page and click open the flores report or you can watch the trial it is there to you can even go back use the calander and change the month and see things discussed in january it so great here

  66. Also Abused says:
    • maria rigadopoulou says:

      I can give you a few names,off the top of my head ;)

    • joujoubaby says:

      I don’t think he was ever in Jodi’s “camp.” I was more surprised when it was pointed out last week that he was in the PPL Pyramid. If he can fall for that, what would he NOT succumb to? I’ve read his blog. I think he conceives of himself as a free thinking rugged individualist, but I’m sorry. Anybody who could be taken in by Eddie Snell is no Thomas Paine.

    • cindy jewell says:

      AA Are you okay?

      • Also Abused says:

        Thanks Cindy, sorry for being quiet. I’m having a really tough time right now over something that happened at work which I don’t know what to do about. I’m having panic attacks and anxiety and I’m really confused and very upset.

        • joujoubaby says:

          AA, this is going to sound absolutely nuts, but I think that I had a dream about it last night. Is your office split up into 2 different spaces in the same building?

          • Also Abused says:

            Not exactly, we have the entire floor, but there are two doors to each end of the office with a bank of elevators in between. I don’t know if that would fit your dream.

            • joujoubaby says:

              Yes. Kind of. And does it have to do with a low level partner or of counsel who is blond and a little dumpy?

              • Also Abused says:

                No not a lawyer at all, but my boss is blonde and dumpy looking. I wrote out what happened above after your kind comment.

        • cindy jewell says:

          Is your Man home? I understand what you’re going through
          Been There. I can attest to it It will get better in time. For now have a glass of wine. Always know that you have friends.

        • tonya says:

          Also Abused :)

          let it go it is sunday give that probable to god and let him take it

    • And I liked Daniel Freeman. Go figure huh??

  67. joujoubaby says:

    Ha ha! Chris Hughes blocked me on twitter! I’ve never interacted with him in any way, I have fewer than 50 followers, I am a comtweet nobody, and yet he has the wherewithal to block ME on twitter! Now THAT’s pathetic! Do they think that that is where jury deliberations are going to take place? In cyberspace? I think in hell I would be Sky Hughes!

    • Basse Krokke says:

      Sah-weet. Congrats!

      • joujoubaby says:

        Thank you, thank you… I think that the ones who are not utterly brain dead see the writing on the wall. They know that there’s really not even a prima facia case for M1, and that the DP option got off at a rest stop 2 states back. Now it’s down to Mistrial, M2, Man1, or Acquittal-all wins for the Defense since they offered M2 to begin with.

        • Basse Krokke says:

          On her FB page, Beth Karas is lamenting the cost of the Arias trial, with a financial breakdown TO THE PENNY. She is trying to raise the ire of the lackeys, against Jodi, which is absurd, since Jodi tried to plea to M2. Why aren’t they all pissed at Juan for overcharging the case?

          Oh, how sweet an acquittal would be …

          • joujoubaby says:

            Of all the HLN heads, her talking annoys me the most. She is not stupid. And her journalism used to have integrity.

            • Basse Krokke says:

              I know! I used to think she was fair-minded. I hope the behavior of these attorneys on HLN during this trial turns out to bite them on the a$$.

              • Gwen says:

                I lament the salaries of anyone who is on HLN. They are making a mockery of this trial with their obvious bias for cash. When this is over I bet they can’t hardly wait for the next tragedy to latch onto so they can keep their ugly mugs in front of the cameras. They are no more than glorified ambulance chasers!!

                • Edward says:

                  I agree Gwen. But these nutjobs are doing more than chasing ambulances. They are actively participating in the destruction of people’s livelyhoods and lives. It makes me sick to my stomach. What a bunch of assholes.

    • tonya says:

      joujoubaby :)

      so the killer stopped you from looking and saying anything on his site just like the HUGHES that means they have been here and see our names hope the hell they saw my comment about his child and his involvement in the killing and the kkk clan after the 911 call there sick and someone is watching them and hopefully it is sherlock holmes

  68. Jared Wolf says:

    Yikes, Sirlips just insulted each and every one of you/us at one point or another in his essay, and you don’t even recognize the injury!

    Sirlips’ post was filled with “American exceptionalist” bullshit, and snide, sardonic comments that reek of self-importance, smugness, and arrogance. Not looking for a confrontation here, however despite all the ball washing for Sirlips, congratulating him on his superior intelligence and “wit,” I’ll “enlighten” you with a bit more humility and say it here: the man is actually quite small-minded, while his tunnel vision won’t let him see past his own narrow, egotistical worldview, and believe it or not, his “wit” is as dull as a bowling ball. I’m not a comedian, which is why I don’t portray myself as one. I have no way to know why there is so much interest in this case, so I don’t make presumptions that assume the worst in people.

    I support Jodi Arias because I believe she is a good person, that her goodness, gentleness, and talents would be wasted in prison, and that the ultimate good of society calls for her release from her confines. I don’t support Jodi Arias’ innocence. I support Jodi Arias-my belief in her innocence is secondary, though I believe the evidence supports a self defense verdict.

    There are a lot of truly awesome people on this site, so if I am banned after this post, it has been great to read everyone’s posts for the time I’ve been here. I wish everyone the best. Sorry I won’t kneel before the almighty “comedic, common sense sage” who blesses us every day with his great wisdom and depth.

    I hope I am not banned just because I find one particular poster on this site to be an annoying little creep. I admire and respect everyone else, so if there is a 1/100 chance of me being a nice guy, can’t I stay?

    • joujoubaby says:

      Jared, it’s not my site, and I don’t decide, but we are all confident enough in our beliefs to withstand genuine critique and heartfelt debate. I don’t know Sirlips personally, but if my impressions are correct, he’ll be able to take it. And I suspect that you can stay too if you can tolerate his predictably sarcastic/sardonic response. You might not think it’s funny. Maybe I will. Maybe your sense of humor is more refined than mine. The world will continue to turn. We can still be friends.

      • JC - TEAM JODI ADMIN says:

        I like your post. JouJou. Well stated. My sentiments exactly.

      • sirlips says:

        Id guess that is about as “awesome” of a response as a person good put. TY.

        (i hope that doesn’t mean im washing your balls now)

        Your “good people”.

        • joujoubaby says:

          One ball washes the other? You’re pretty spiffy too, Sirlips. And you make me laugh. Of course, Howard Stern does too, and that offends some people. My grandmother says that it jeopardizes my status as a lady, but what can one do? I gotta be me.

    • Basse Krokke says:

      Nope. Nope. Nope. Your petty comments about Sirlips betray your jealousy, Jared.

    • rb says:

      To Jared Wolf:

      You say you believe the evidence supports a self defense verdict, but then you say you don’t support Jodi’s innocence. Jodi is charged with premeditated 1st degree murder. Jodi says it was in self defense. So what exactly are you saying when you say “I don’t support Jodi Arias’ innocence”?

      • Jared Wolf says:

        I apologize, I wasn’t clear in my “I don’t support Jodi’s innocence, I support Jodi Arias-my believe in her innocence is secondary. ” I OF COURSE believe Jodi is innocent on all counts! I am emphasising my support for the person of Jodi as primary, the innocence of Jodi as secondary. I was merely illustrating that I support JODI ARIAS, not only her innocence, but *All things Jodi Arias,* as opposed to our master Sirlips, who only supports Jodi Arias to the extent that he believes in his concept of “Justice.” I actually like Jodi as a person, and believe she was being truthful on the stand. I don’t think she is strange, or a “fruitcake.” He was out of order when he said that. Anyway, I do support Jodi’s innocence, otherwise I wouldn’t be here, you know?

    • Danielle says:

      It’s okay, everyone here is so cool and everyone lets everyone speak their mind. Maybe some people got more out of some parts of Sirlips post than other parts. For example I’m Catholic, so I’m not on the same page w the part about not believing in God, but that’s okay, I liked other parts of the post. I think this is one of the most laid back sites I’ve ever been on, I usually never post bc everyone’s always looking to argue, but everyone here is willing to let everyone else have their own opinions bc in the end we’re all here bc we are here for Jodi. So I guess what I mean is I agreed w some parts or the posts and not others but that’s okay. I like in your post why you support Jodi, it was really cool the way you put it.

      In the end we’re all on Team Jodi!

    • BeeCee says:

      Jared, I have enjoyed your posts in addition to how I enjoy sirlips posts. Yes, you seem to be very different people, but we are all different.

      I did not take offense to sirlips post, I thought it was funny and accurate and many other things :)

      I’m not sure what you mean about not supporting jodi’s innocence…if you mean innocent of taking a life…then I guess technically that is correct…the important aspect is that she did it in self defense.

      It’s not the same as someone who goes around killing for the thrill of it…self defense is VERY different even if the end result still has a dead body lying there.

    • sirlips says:

      Jared, Hello.

      How yah doing?

      Good..Good.

      I’m not sure where to start. I suppose the beginning makes sense. (is that to witty?) No, you know what, i’ll start here… I apologize, as I did in advance in my post, if I upset anyone with my personal opinion.

      I don’t think i’m “that smart”, but I am kidda funny at times. I try to use levity in my posts, for many reasons, like keeping myself and readers entertained, to keep people interested and maybe to keep it from become yet another dry ABC type comment (not that we don’t need those too, many are very informative, but I fear that they get skipped over). I suppose that would means i’m insecure. That’s true. But, that doesn’t jive with your idea that im egotistical, so i’ll take that at a compliment, and that I don’t have too much to really worry about.

      Lets take it from the top:

      “Sirlips’ post was filled with “American exceptionalist” bullshit”-qutoe

      Hm, i’m not sure what you read, but I remember typing that I have thought about moving out of the country because im so upset with how ‘un-exceptional” we are. maybe I’m wrong, but if that memory serves me right, then I think you need to bark up a new tree. (are analogies ok, or will that upset you too?)

      ” Not looking for a confrontation here, however despite all the ball washing for Sirlips, congratulating him on his superior intelligence and “wit”-Quote

      Jared, when you tell someone that you are not looking for a confrontation, after insulting them, then directly follow it up with yet another insult, doesn’t lend much to your credibility. If you are being confrontational, that’s ok, I’m a big boy, I can handle it, and if not, then DONT BE CONFRONTATIONAL..lol. Again, i’m not the brightest bulb in the box but I do know when someone is contradicting themselves. It’s ok to be honest here. Your confrontational, good enough. After all, lets be serious for a sec, I said some pretty offensive things. Not to offend, but to point out where i’m coming from, with my opinions.

      “the man is quite small-minded”-Quote
      If you feel that way, that’s your opinion and I will consider it when evaluating myself. Understand, its hard for me to know if you say this because I hurt your feeling with some “anti-god” talk, or if it is because it is true. It appears that people here, that have earned my respect, seem to not agree with you, so for now, i’ll take this with a grain of salt.

      ” I have no way to know why there is so much interest in this case, so I don’t make presumptions that assume the worst in people”-Quote
      You have no way to know? Why is that? I have TONS of ways to make an educated guess on that. In fact, it made my post rather long, but I backed up how I felt about each item with reference to my opinion. Again, If I don’t have a memory problem (sorry, its just hard to stop) I remember saying that the media jumped on this because of sex. It wasn’t because of the DP, Age, Looks, prosecutor drama. Its not hard to come to the conclusion that the media grabbed this because it was a “sex” filled story. Just like the Zimmerman trial will be about race. It doesn’t take a “Jared Wolf” to figure that out. Maybe I wasn’t clear enough for ALL people that read my post, not everyone is here NOW because of the “sex”..i’m guessing most are not. They are here because of all the noble reasons, but they are probably like me and had not heard of the trial until HLeN and unTRU TV started airing tons of coverage. The media did grab this story for SEX, I think, which in turn is how we all ended up here. Ie, that’s the reason most are here.

      Maybe we can ask everyone here, im wrong ALL THE TIME, but maybe i’m not wrong about this. How many of you heard about this crime via HLeN, and unTRU TV, then started looking harder for facts? I know I did. 2nd, Why do you all feel HLeN started covering this trial? My “little creep” mind is guessing you are about to hear a bunch of “because of HLN covering it” and “They started covering it because of the sex”. I could be wrong, time will tell.

      Not sure if the rest is worth quoting and replying to. Looks like most of it was just begging all the people you say you “respect” not to ban you after you basically called them all “stupid sheep”. Who else would be dumb enough to fall for the rant of a small minded creep that isn’t funny or witty? As you said, these people all said they liked the article.

      i’m curious, you said I insulted everyone, and you. I think we can see you don’t speak for everyone else, but how, SPECIFICLY did I insult you?

      So, if that’s the end of it, fair enough.

      ———————-

      Now, if you do in fact want to be confrontational, then lets go buddy. I’m game. I was going to tell you to go fuck yourself, but I’m not convinced you have the needed equipment. So I’ll just call you a poo poo head, because I think poo poo is funny.

      A) I didn’t ask to post the daily “starter thread”. I didn’t even post the thread and have it copied to the top.
      I was e-mailed by SJ to write one of the daily “starters”, I then wrote the post and emailed it to SJ. If it was a worthy post, then SJ would use it…turns out, Sj liked it. So, go get a spoon, drive to Minnesota and eat my ass you little piss ant. (that is, only if you want to be confrontational)

      B) Jodi doesn’t need someone to support her because they “like her”, think she is a good person or because she could have a better life outside prison (thanks for that one, captain obvious,,,so could Charles

      Manson). She deserves people supporting the LAW. I’m guessing you don’t know her, so all those things about her “being a good person” is just mindless banter. (the type we usually only get from HLeN) It sounds good and all, but she needs reason, justice and the law to be served, not a friend that thinks she is “swell”. Personally, YOU are the EXACT type of person I was talking about in my post. You don’t use reason, you don’t use the law, you don’t even use common sense, you shoot from the emotional hip and think you can “judge people” on your gut feeling. Juan Martinez with out the mouth piece.

      C) If you admire and respect everyone (your last line), then why did you just insult one of them, and imply everyone else was an idiot?

      So, since we are being confrontational (only if you are still reading) I would like to ask them NOT to ban you. Not to argue with you, there is nothing left to argue, your a dip shit, we see that, you are left wanting, story over. No, I want you to stay so everyone else can tell you what a fuck stain you are, before you tuck tail and run. I will keep quiet on your post. feel free to comment on mine, if the need arises. Everyone else can decide if you are right or just ate too many paint chips as a child

      Any further debate, threats or insults can be sent to me directly. SJ has my Email address and I have given her permission to give it to you. My first email will contain my name and address incase you want to go bowling, or simply talk about your bowling ball comment above.

      Sirlips- Idiot comic.

  69. Also Abused says:

    http://www.azfamily.com/home/Hoards-of-people-drive-by-home-where-Travis-Alexander-was-killed-204947431.html

    I kind of feel sorry for the homeowner. It sounds like she’s not going to sell it though.

    • JC - TEAM JODI ADMIN says:

      that article was odd to me.

      • joujoubaby says:

        Me too. Like the writer isn’t a professional or something. Or the writer is the homeowner? Yes, something like that. It has the same ring to it as the stories that came out in my jr high newspaper about the track meet written by the kid on the track team.

      • Gwen says:

        VERY odd that the homeowner randomly throws in there how much she loves Juan, Flores and Travis. Go figure?

        • joujoubaby says:

          Travis is dead. How could she love him?

        • Basse Krokke says:

          Freaking Bizarro World just won’t stop.

        • Also Abused says:

          The weird part of that was she didn’t say any of those things during the video.

        • Truthseeker1111 says:

          Gwen….she told Travis’ sister how she felt she had visitations of Travis looking over her boys…how she saw a shadow move up her stairs and into each of their rooms and how her dog stood at attention…

          So maybe that is the reason that she loves Travis???

          • Gwen says:

            That’s creepy in more ways than I can describe. I would be calling someone to purge that house if that’s the case. Not that I don’t think stuff like that happens sometimes but it’s probably power of suggestion in this instance.

          • joujoubaby says:

            If that happened in my house I’d call Paranormal Child Protective Services

            • JoshDavis says:

              LMAO good one, yeah there was def something OFF
              about that lady – she loves Travis?
              Hellllllo i hope Travis’s spirit isn’t pulling any Entity Shit
              with that lady! Creeeeeeeeepy!

          • Kira says:

            That would scare the shit out of me. Travis’ lingering spirit would not be a happy one.

        • I think it might be to avoid the wrath of the Travis Taliban. You see what they do to anyone who doesn’t agree with them, and placate their need to convince the entire world Travis was a saint. They do everything they can to ruin their lives.

      • Ann says:

        What? When I think I have heard ALL the batshit crazy things possible…then this:
        “I very much love Travis, and I love Juan Martinez and detective Flores,” said the homeowner.

        • cindy jewell says:

          now this is a just creepy…
          ..

          Surprise she isn’t selling tickets to go through the house

          • tonya says:

            that homeower is paid $$$$$$$$$$$$$$ to say that and more

          • Truthseeker1111 says:

            I only read that she invited Travis’ sister and family in for a dinner after they all (homeowner included) went searching with their shovels and metal detector at the dead end street for the gun…

            • Aly says:

              Who owns the house now?
              Ann, right some REAL batshits? lol
              Perfect,
              They ARE out there and I have a feeling they will probably
              name the street after Travis.
              This is rediculous!

        • Basse Krokke says:

          Seriously, she’d sell that house if she saw the autopsy photo of Travis’ facial wound. It’s the scariest photo I’ve ever seen in my life, and not all that sensitive.

          • Basse Krokke says:

            *I’m* not all that sensitive.

          • Kira says:

            I’m really sensitive to stuff like that, but these crime scene photos have toughened me up. I’ve seen them so many times that I don’t get phased that much now. I wonder if the jury will react the same way – Kermit wants the “big impact’ moment but everything loses its impact when it’s viewed multiple times.

    • scrappydoo says:

      I thought I read that the house is now empty???

      • Truthseeker1111 says:

        scrappy….read my post below about the weekend of 3-16-2013…the house was full of all of them…they were helping with their shovels along with the others metal detector in the search for the gun….they are no afraid of no ghost…

        this is for fun…

        http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MVjd5w2iRAg

      • ENOUGHisENOUGH says:

        just catching up for the day..so did I, it was just stated that the house was empty and someone was planning to do some kind of ghost hunting??or something to that affect. Then this woman pops up with the house has a warm and fuzzy feel to it and she loves EF, JM, TA. IDK

    • Truthseeker1111 says:

      AlsoAbused…it looks like the good ole roommate was a crimes specialist…yet he couldn’t put 2 and 2 together when he smelled an unusual odor in Travis home while he was living there…and Travis wasn’t at church on Sunday…and his CTR ring and watch was found on Thursday…duh…what is wrong here???someone is lying???

      Enrique posted on that same link that you posted…

      Enrique Cortez Jr. · Financial Crimes Specialist 2-Customer Fraud Detection at Wells Fargo
      I wouldn’t want to live here again since I was there when everything happened, but I know Travis is happy this house is a home. Travis made it a home while he lived here, and for the light of the new homeowner’s loving family to banish the darkness Jodi brought to this house is all he would want to see happen to his old home.
      Reply · 47 · · Yesterday at 2:23pm

      Let’s not forget just how clumsy or deceitful the roommates were in discussing with Flores what they were doing during those last few days before Travis was found on Monday night, June 9, 2008…

      The roommate being a crime specialist…you would think that he would be able to remember in great accuracy what they did in those last few days…you know…just a couple of days…it’s not like it was a week or two weeks or a month before….just a Thursday, Friday, Saturday and Sunday…

      Wednesday, June 4, 2008…Enrique told Flores in his follow-up interview that the last time he saw Travis was on Wednesday, June 4th…He talked to Travis that morning and Travis told him that he had a conference call scheduled that day…Travis told him that he hadn’t slept very much, only getting about 45 minutes of sleep that night…(Flores page 15)

      Thursday, June 5, 2008…Enrique told Flores that Travis CTR ring and his watch was found on the kitchen counter on Thursday evening on June 5, 2008 by Enrique’s girlfriend, Kim…hmmm…(Flores pg 7)
      Remember this is Thursday…the day after that Jodi has already left Travis’s home…so who put the things there on the counter top? The roommates and their girlfriends used the kitchen and the bathroom in the house…

      Sunday, June 8, 2008…Enrique said that it was odd that Travis missed Church on sunday…he said that he assumed Travis was out of town or something…hmmm…(Flores pg. 16)…yet with him being a crime specialists and he thinking it odd that Travis not at church..why didn’t he do some I N V E S T I G A T I N G ???

      Monday, June 9, 2008….And according to the Flores Report and the Detailed Breakdown Report..Enrique told Flores that he noticed an unusual smell on Monday night when he got home from church activity…Enrique said he never asked anyone about it…hmmm…(Flores pg 16)…now why didn’t this crime specialists not use his sniffers to sniff out and investigate the location of that smell….nothing makes a damn bit of sense when it comes to the roommates testimonies…

      • Truthseeker1111 says:

        And that is only a small part of the summation of why so many of us believe that there were more people involved inside Travis’ home with a cover-up of the surroundings of his death…someone knows more than what they are telling…

      • tonya says:

        the roommates are back peddeling to keep from being discovered that they were aware of what happened in the house one married his girlfriend that was there so she could not testify against him if he was called to the stand the fact that they were not called really puzzle me

    • Truthseeker1111 says:

      AlsoAbused…don’t feel too sorry for the homeowner…

      On the weekend of 3-16-2013…katiecoolady, and some courtroom watchers, and Travis’ sister and some others all met in Travis’ neighborhood with a metal detector looking for the gun at the end of a dead end street…all because Travis’ sister had been having visions of where the gun was and she wanted them to help her look for it…

      The current homeowner of Travis’ house met with them and helped them in the search…she brought shovels for the digging and later invited them all in for supper…the homeowner found something in the attic of Travis’ home and gave it to Travis’ sister…This was the first time that Travis’ sister had ever seen the house…

      The homeowner told Travis’ sister that she had visitations of Travis looking over her boys…how she saw a shadow move up her stairs and into each of their rooms and how her dog stood at attention…

      So it is no wonder that “House Hunters” is on location…some of them called em…

    • Kira says:

      “So when we viewed the home things were missing, faucets missing, showers, carpet was missing … so we thought the home had been vandalized,” said the homeowner who wanted to remain anonymous.

      She didn’t notice the crime scene dust everywhere and the big chunk taken out of the wall? Sorry, but you’d have to be a moron to not know that a crime took place in that house. Tawnidilly posted pictures of the house when it was up for sale.

  70. Gwen says:

    Every day I encounter people who say ‘DP’ because she lied. I don’t waste my energy arguing because their minds are made up. Last time I checked lying wasn’t a death penalty offense and most especially if you do it out of fear and to save your own life. If lying were punishable by death there would be no human being left on planet earth.

    • joujoubaby says:

      No kidding, Gwen. And does her seriously think that at least one of the12 jurors won’t see it that way too?

      • Gwen says:

        I hope all 12 of the 12 jurors see it that way. And if Jodi walks free that day or at least gets Manslaughter I will be so happy for her but I will also silently or not so silently gloat to these folks. lol

        • Edward says:

          I hope you’re right Gwen. I hope for the same thing. I hope Jodi is set free. I just hope she’ll be able to resume some kind of life somewhere. She deserves it.

    • Sooo true.

      And it’s so true that you can’t change anyone’s mind either.

      I just speak the truth to the best of my ability and if it talks sense into someone, great! If it doesn’t, well denial is a river in Egypt and they are welcome to inner tube on it as long as they want.

    • Kira says:

      Jesus, let’s hope that lying isn’t a DP offense!

  71. Gwen says:

    Another example of lying to save your ass. Maybe this homeowner realizes how rabid the TA supporters are so it was a preemptive strike to keep shit from rolling her way. I can see them camped out on the lawn doing a seance if she’d said anything different.

    • Oh definitely. You know TAPS – that ghost hunting tv show – is going to be doing a session there for an episode on SyFy? People have knocked on her door asking for a shovel to dig up their yard looking for evidence.

      I can’t make this shit up!!!!

      • joujoubaby says:

        I was in the mood to abuse myself and I read a Huffington Post story, and in the comments section, they are trying to orchestrate an evidence collecting mission under some bridge in Mesa! FIVE YEARS LATER. Ugh…I just thought of something. Thank you, Jesus that this thing will be over by the time the 5th anniv. rolls around. Can you imagine?

        • cb says:

          We should inform Westboro Baptists that a sacred event is organizing under that bridge. I’d like to be sitting on the bridge, swinging my legs eating an ice cream to watch those two clans get together

          • Kira says:

            LOL. The Westboro Baptist cult is fucking nuts but they’d totally go protest something like this. They protest the opening of an envelope.

        • Say what??? Oh brother! Those people need a life. Really they do.

      • JC - TEAM JODI ADMIN says:

        Ive been meaning to tell you. It was JUST revealed that the source of that information was way off the mark! That show is not at the house nor was taping a show! I’ll tell SJ so he talks about that next time.

      • Truthseeker1111 says:

        well…the homeowner got her shovel and helped Travis’ sister and the others use the metal detector to look for the gun at the end of a dead end street…then she told them to look around Travis’ church too…

  72. Gwen says:

    I’m all for solving cold cases but in my mind this case is solved. Jodi killed Travis in self-defense. And while Nance loves to say there are ‘no coincidences in criminal law’ sorry, hag, but I beg to differ. It’s unfortunate and is one that Grandpa’s gun was stolen shortly before this happened. All this other is smoke and mirrors. I do think Juan would dearly love to have more ‘evidence’ to twist around and mold to fit his lame beyond belief theory. He’s got a camera with pictures, for f#ck’s sake, and still can’t seal the deal! It’s because he’s trying to sell a load of shit!!

  73. tonya says:

    has anyone considered that the ower of travis’s house is empty now because the state wants to take the jury there and walk them thru the crime seen and test the shelves and that would suck big time I would not put it past JM and jack ass flores to do that…. :roll: :roll: :roll:

    • Nk says:

      Doubt they can. They rested.

    • coldcase53 says:

      Tonya,

      I saw somewhere that a single mother owns the house now. She’s a big fan of Martinez apparently (not sure why). She’s hoping that people will stop coming to her house and taking pictures when the trial is over. I can’t vouch for the accuracy of this story though.

  74. Aly says:

    Thanks Sirlips,
    That says it all IMO.
    Truth is though I have to admit, I’m a fruitcake and if I’m ever in that situation as Jodi,
    I would love to be able to do backflips cartwheels and stand on my head. Really I would.

    IMO they haven’t proven anything, so I’m hoping for an acquittal.

    And about God, religion was one of the reasons we’re here, so I think it’s
    appropiate to put the lyrics to one of my favorite songs on here.

    http://www.azlyrics.com/lyrics/bobdylan/withgodonourside.html

    Like you said though if there is a God, he wouldn’t condone it.
    Maybe you all have heard it.

    Bob Dylan
    God On His Side.
    Enjoy : )

    Also how do you purchase Jodi’s art.
    Thanks

  75. tonya says:

    well it is 8pm again and have to go now someone wants his room and my computer is fried so be safe and dont open things with out a virus check first and Im worried about renee I hope she is ok and everyone be safe it is getting close to the end now and the kkk are everywere …. :roll:

  76. lara says:

    renee? NANEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!!!!!

  77. PJ says:

    Congrats Sirlips, that was wonderful. I’m rather late arriving here today. Each day gets closer and closer.
    Someone asked the other day why we call the judge Pickles. I never saw anyone answer but I think I have it. It’s because she is a dilly!

  78. Dennis says:

    Well the end is near,hopefully the jury can use their combined brain power to see through all the wrong that JM has spewed out there,Its amazing how he just continued to badger the witnesses till he got the exact answer he wanted from them,The judge just sat there and let this bizarre behavoir pour forth with out any intervention.The defence team deserves kudos as the battle has been uphill all the way,they did not get many breaks in this trial.The public opinion of this trial was well swayed by the media as it should have not been.I sometimes check out the hater sites just to see what is being said,its just off the wall,everybody hates Jodi and that is so typical of the way the media presented her to the public,if this trial was not sensationalized the way it was,hardly anybody would know who Jodi Ann Arias was,one woman on a hater site stated that she just hated Jodi and Casey Anthony,but my question to her would be,Its easy to hate when all you recieve is the one sided trash against these women,she did not meet Jodi or Casey and probally never even considered their side of the story,lets look at some of the other henious criminals that have come and gone,Ted Bundy,Charles Manson,John Wayne Gacey and Charles NG,I wonder if the haters would loath these persons like they do Jodi,I say not because the media coverage was there,but not glorified like Jodis,yet these murderers were way above the crime that Jodi is accused of.I am so saddened in the way the American masses have percieved MS Arias,it is a sin to cast judgement on someone that you have never known or met.Jodi has done something wrong that she regrets and will be punished for that event.I do not believe in capitol punishment because executing the defendent will never bring back the victim or deter any further people in commiting a murder.As for the State condoning the DP,they are no better than the murderer themselves.I believe Jodi should be found guilty of man slaughter with time served or guilty in the heat of passion crime.I would like to see her set free,but I think that is asking just a little to much.This trial has been awash with lies and trickery by the prosecution,a judge that clearly is bias and has not got control of her court and a very skewed opinion of Jodi Arias.We can all hope for the best for Jodi,the defence has done a good job and we can pray that at least one of the jurrors will see the truth and do the right thing,Jodi is a very beautiful and intelligent young woman who committed a crime for only reasons known to her and I believe that she deserves a chance at life again,Lets all pray for her and keep up the support,the week to come could be the turning point we and Jodi have all been waiting for.GOD BLESS JODI.

    • Edward says:

      Well said Dennis. I would like to see Jodi set free. I think she has done her time. Matter of fact…. destroy her record pertaining to this case. Then, she might… have a chance.

    • Also Abused says:

      I always love your posts Dennis. You always seem to get right to the heart of the matter.

  79. Truthseeker1111 says:

    I was just thinking…..

    What if the “something” that was found in Travis’ attic was the missing journal that was being looked for earlier by that girl….

    Does anyone remember who the girl was that was going through Travis’ house looking for some journal???

    Maybe he hid it in the attic?…a place no one would think to look…

    • maria rigadopoulou says:

      Jodi witnessed Deanna entering the house,saying she was looking for some books(or a book,I dont remember exactly).

  80. Ann says:

    Regarding Fruitcake and lies: Often, my husband and daughter tease me about my low level of pain tolerance. They refer to me as a “Chunk” (Lawrence Cohen) from the movie Goonies. When Chunk is drilled by the escaped convicts about his lies…he spills his guts about ever lie he has told since birth. Chunk and I would never make it as pisoners of war. When viewing Jodi’s interrogation tapes, I’m thinking..Ok ..1st the female po in Yreka keep talking about TA “parents” wanting to know the “why” ..then she tells Jodi, when the guys get here from AZ it is over for you..First Degree. Jodi mumbles something like.. no one can help her, she doesn’t know why and the reason is “trivial”.. then Flores (acting like he’s a friend) tells her, that her parents believe she’s involved, everyone of TA friends are pointing their finger at her calling her a scio-stalker, also he knows she was in Mesa, he has hair, prints and photos and keeps impling more than one person did it..encouraging her to rat out who helped. Flores “knows all” and just wants to know “why” and how she did it by herself. After long hours of interrogation, Jodi being ashamed, scared and in deep denial become a “Chunk” and fruitcake. I’m sure at this point, she felt like it was her against the world. Sometimes when you feel so beat down and not even your family is for you, your willing to let people think whatever they want to about you. Watch Jodi when someone is on the stand like Dr. Data Point. She knows this person is going to say horrible things about her and she disassociates from it.. back to her against the world. She is not alone, thanks to her lawyers and this website. BTW I think Jeff Cohen is a lawyer now.

    • maria rigadopoulou says:

      You’re right,we have often talk here about how she seems to be in her own world when horrble things are being told bout her-she has to disassociate from it I’m sure,there’s no way she would have been able to go through all this hell.Kinda like surviving instinct.I deeply ache and admire her at the same time for being able to do that.

  81. sirlips says:

    Because of my reply at 11:30 tonight, I feel like I should say something…

    Isn’t it great to see people with such different beliefs, back grounds, personalities and geo-political views able to come together with 1 goal? The goal that our legal system will fix its issues and run the way it was meant to…with blind justice for all, both the victims and the accused.

    I apologize if I offended anyone in my original post that started the day, or in my response to “he who shall be named” earlier tonight. My intentions are not to insult you. Levity, talks about justice and the continued search for “real talk” were/are my goals.

    Specifically, one person made a comment and I want to let them know I appreciate the thoughtful response. This person said she/he is a catholic and strongly disagrees with my take on religion. Fair enough. I applaud you.

    Good night everyone.

    • joujoubaby says:

      Sirlips, if your post shook anybody’s faith in the Almighty, it probably wasn’t very firm to begin with. Sleep well.

      • Aly says:

        joujoubaby,
        I SO agree with that.
        I have friends that don’t believe in anything and others that do.
        I appreciate both sides, they are all my friends no matter what they
        believe or don’t believe in.

        I know why Sirlips brought it up in the article. This trial has a lot to do with sex,
        but also religion.
        Not in the other trials I’ve watched.

        And Sirlip,
        I agree with your statement
        “Isn’t it great to see people with such different beliefs, back grounds, personalities and geo-political views able to come together with 1 goal? The goal that our legal system will fix its issues and run the way it was meant to…with blind justice for all, both the victims and the accused.”

        This is # 1 goal for all of us and thank you again for posting it.

      • JC - TEAM JODI ADMIN says:

        True and funny! LOL

    • Ann says:

      Good night sirlips. I appreciate your post and your insight.

    • lara says:

      nighty night sirlips. i really liked your post today!

    • seek2understand says:

      One thing I can say with certainty about you Sirlips: You do not have carpal tunnel syndrome!

      • sirlips says:

        Oh, if you only knew how long it takes me to type something… It’s terrible. Then, i tend to re-read it 5 times, changing something each time, then it starts all over. On top of that i have the spelling skills of a two year old with A.D.H.D on crack. Spell check is my friend.

        :)

        • BeeCee says:

          HAHAHA

          I understand totally…sadly that is why I don’t post more than a few one liners here and there. Many times I type a bunch of something and then delete it. LOL

          I have a lot in my head, but don’t really put it out much…that’s one reason I like your posts!

  82. Willis says:

    I too am Catholic and proud of it. I also respect your opinion about a divine deity. We live in a free society where people are free to choose how to live their lives and worship how they choose to or decide not to at all. I am grateful to be able to express my thoughts and opinions about this case. Jodi is innocent until proven guilty. I believe the crime scene and the majority of the evidence supports her side of the story which is self-defense. The messiness of the crime scene means that there was a struggle between the two. Everyone is entitled to their opinions about what went down there but Jodi is the only one who really knows. No one can honestly say what they would have done because they haven’t been in her shoes. The burden of proof is on the prosecution and I don’t believe he has been able to rule out reasonable doubt. Hopefully Dr. Geffner can blow even more holes in his scenario.

  83. lara says:

    nighty night everyone! i`m sending good vibes to jodi and wishing you all a good night. AA- i hope you have an okay day at work tomorrow. i will be thinking about you. and RENEE- let us know you are alright.

  84. Gulliver says:

    I am a licensed psychologist with more than 21 years of experience (since licensure) in dealing with individuals suffering from severe and persistent mental disorders. Prior to that time, I spent about 10 years in academia as a professor and another 6 years as a hypnotherapist. I have been thinking a lot about why so many people around the country either believe that Jodi must be guilty of premeditated murder or are convinced that the prosecution has proven premeditation beyond reasonable doubt.

    Nearly 75% of the American population falls in one very broad psychological category. Thus a little over 25% of Americans fall into the opposing category. I believe that the majority of the people on this site will fall in the latter category while the majority of the people on the opposing sites advocating justice for TA will fall in the major category. Thus, I would like to check this out with your help. It will take about 10 minutes of your time and requires only anonymously completing a questionnaire online. I would appreciate if you would post your results here. They will be in the form of 4 letters. You will have a percentage associated with each letter. Please report all of the percentages not just the four letters describing your results. For example, here are my results:

    I (44%), N (100%) F (88%) P (67)%

    Thanks a lot. I will report the general results here. If you would like interpretation of your personal results, I will be happy to provide a brief interpretation and directions to more information via email. You can, of course, get my email from SJ.

    Here is the link to the questionnaire. I have used this in other research related to political orientation, as well. When you finish the questionnaire, the system will score it for you and your results will be immediately available.

    http://www.humanmetrics.com/cgi-win/jtypes2.asp

    • Angela says:

      I(56) S (1) T(1) P(11)

      • Gulliver says:

        Thanks, Angela. :-) Your results are in the direction of my prediction.

      • Gulliver says:

        I’ll say more later after others respond.

        • Angela says:

          What does a low number mean? Is it bad?

          • Gulliver says:

            No, there are no “bad” results on this assessment. Your (1) scores mean that you are almost exactly in the center of a continuum that runs to 100 in each direction. So, you are balanced with regard to these two measures, whereas on the second scale, I am at the extreme and near the extreme on the third.

            • Gulliver says:

              Your results suggest merely how you interact with the world. There is no “right” or “good” way to deal with the environment. Your strongest characteristic is that you are moderately inclined to stay to yourself rather than going out socially and interacting with a lot of people.

    • LC says:

      Extravert(56%)  iNtuitive(12%)  Feeling(38%)  Judging(22%)

    • geebee2 says:

      Introvert(89%) iNtuitive(75%) Thinking(12%) Perceiving(11)%

    • Also Abused says:

      Introvert(11%) iNtuitive(48%) Feeling(38%) Judging(40%)

      I struggled a lot with many of the questions as I could have answered either way.

      • BeeCee says:

        Me too AA.

        I usually bounce between INTJ and INFJ when I have taken that test before.

        today was I(100%) N (88%) T (25%) J (67%)

      • Also Abused says:

        Wow, I was just reading about INFJ personality types. Apparently, I’m very rare! (Thank God for that — we don’t need more people like me around.) This description of that personality type is actually pretty much on the money, especially as regards to intuition.

        http://www.personalitypage.com/INFJ.html

    • Ok here is mine (is it consistent that I’m practically dying of embarrassment right now?)

      Introvert(56%) Sensing(1%) Feeling(25%) Judging(22%)

      My profile is interesting. http://typelogic.com/isfj.html

      “their form of “service” is likely to exclude any elements of moral or political controversy”

      Haha, does this one count?? I’m curious and have studied a lot of far out stuff like conspiracy theories, unconventional politics, new age spiritualities, ect. But I adhere to none.

      “they specialize in the local, the personal, and the practical.”

      Well, I do think the personal is political. Also: “They are capable of forming strong loyalties, but these are personal rather than institutional loyalties” YES.

      “When these include Es who want to socialize with the rest of the world, or self-contained ITs, the ISFJ must learn to adjust to these behaviors and not interpret them as rejection.”

      Been there. Done that. lol

      “an ISFJ child may be reproved for “sulking,”"

      Hahahaha it’s like this lady actually talked to my mom. :>

      “An adult ISFJ may drive a (later ashamed) friend or SO into a fit of temper over the ISFJ’s unexplained moodiness, only afterwards to explain about a death in the family they “didn’t want to burden anyone with.”

      Oy. I HATE talking about my problems.

      Analyze away. >.<

      • “You have marginal or no preference of Sensing over Intuition (1%)”

        Yes. I rely on my intuition as much as I do on the rest of my senses.

      • Kira says:

        I’m an ISFJ too – took this type of assessment a while ago :) .

      • Gulliver says:

        Thanks, MB for your participation and your self analysis in conjunction with the profile which you read. It is important, however, that your position on the S-I continuum is almost exactly in the middle so to lump you in the ISFJ type may not be accurate. The typical typology does not take into consideration people who are balance on the various dimensions. This could be the basis for future work with the MBTI. You might read the profile for INFJ and try to meld the two together.

        • Cool, thanks! Ok here goes:

          http://typelogic.com/infj.html

          The commentary by Joe Butt is right on the money! I won’t copy or paste anything because it stands up all by itself. I LOLed when I read “rotten in Denmark” because I’ve used that phrase a lot in my life. And yes, I am NOT easily led, I am not easily influenced and I’ve always believed that’s part of why I am more loyal personally than institutionally (to quote the other profile).

          As to Marina Heiss’ commentary:

          “This rare combination of vision and practicality often results in INFJs taking a disproportionate amount of responsibility in the various causes to which so many of them seem to be drawn.”

          Ah yes, and this is so true. I don’t mind either, so long as the problem is fixed.

          “INFJs are deeply concerned about their relations with individuals as well as the state of humanity at large.”

          Yep!! One of the reasons I’m so invested in this case is because I see that the consequences of giving a pass to domestic violence will ultimately affect society at large in terribly negative ways. If we allow women to be abused, then that will affect women’s ability to mother the next generation, which will then grow up disadvantaged and the cycle continues until society falls a part. I often get frustrated because it’s so clear to me, but not to others and I always have to explain what I see as the obvious. lol.

          “They are, in fact, sometimes mistaken for extroverts because they appear so outgoing and are so genuinely interested in people — a product of the Feeling function they most readily show to the world.”

          Yes, I think sirlips had mentioned that he was surprised people here weren’t extroverts. I’ve been told this by others too – that they can’t imagine me needing a lot of time alone because I invest a great deal in others. But I do.

          As I keep reading, I keep having YEP and SO TRUE moments so I’ll stop copying/pasting. lol I think you’re right, I definitely should meld the two because the entire page fits me to a T!!!

      • Can't Take it anymore says:

        INFJ

        Introvert(89%) iNtuitive(50%) Feeling(12%) Judging(33%)

    • Also Abused says:

      “I am a licensed psychologist with more than 21 years of experience (since licensure)”

      Gulliver, I had to laugh at how you qualified that. I bet you have never thought about having to qualify it until this trial, right? You mean you’re not including the experience you had BEFORE you were licensed and while in school and/or supervised? Even though people called you “Doctor Gulliver” then? Hahaha I’m sorry, but I couldn’t resist. Tot Doc changed the rules.

      • Kira says:

        So you’re saying that EXPERIENCE is better than EDUCATION, RIGHT???? YES OR NO?????

        LOL.

      • Gulliver says:

        Yes, AA, I thought it was important to differentiate prelicensure experience from academic and supervised experience given Dr. Demarte’s “youthful” audacity.

    • Renee' (HRS) says:

      Introvert(67%) iNtuitive(12%) Feeling(75%) Judging(33%)

    • Marguerite says:

      Introvert(89%) Sensing(38%) Feeling(50%) Perceiving(56)%

    • Ann says:

      I(33),iN(12),F(12),J(56)

    • eli says:

      Introvert(67%) iNtuitive(38%) Feeling(12%) Judging(33%)

    • Gilberto says:

      Introvert(67%) iNtuitive(25%) Thinking(1%) Judging(44%)

      I first took the Briggs Myers test about 20 years ago and again about 10 years ago with both results being the same: INFJ. Now I’m wondering why things have changed. As I recall my intuitive part was higher in previous results and the feeling/thinking was most definitely F. Now I see a “marginal/no preference” there.

      I’m also hoping to see your commentary on this 75/25 population breakdown theory.

      • Gulliver says:

        Gilberto, this particular questionnaire is different from the MBTI. Here are some reliability and validity data. They are reasonably good in that scores on the JTT accounts for about 50-69% of the variance in the scores on the other tests reported. So, there are factors which can influence your response on a given day. These might have to do with your state of mind and how it tends to influence your perspective of the questions.

        http://www.humanmetrics.com/validate/jttvalid.htm

    • lara says:

      introvert (44%) intuitive (75%) feeling (50%) perceiving (22%)

    • sirlips says:

      Extravert(100%) iNtuitive(62%) Thinking(1%) Perceiving(33)%

      •You have strong preference of Extraversion over Introversion (100%)
      •You have distinctive preference of Intuition over Sensing (62%)
      •You have marginal or no preference of Thinking over Feeling (1%)
      •You have moderate preference of Perceiving over Judging (33%)

      • sirlips says:

        Had to post this…I couldnt help but think of my little spat with Jared last night… oh how funny…

        “Clever” is the word that perhaps describes ENTPs best. The professor who juggles half a dozen ideas for research papers and grant proposals in his mind while giving a highly entertaining lecture on an abstruse subject is a classic example of the type. So is the stand-up comedian whose lampoons are both funny and incisively accurate.

        ENTPs are usually verbally as well as cerebrally quick, and generally love to argue–both for its own sake, and to show off their debating skills. ENTPs tend to have a perverse sense of humor as well, and enjoy playing devil’s advocate. This sometimes confuses,——> even angers<——–, those who don't understand or accept the concept of argument as a sport.

        • Gulliver says:

          Since you are marginal on the T-F dimension, you might want to look at ENFP and do a sort of mind meld. This is one of the deficiencies of this typology, viz., there is not allowance made for the marginal (maybe vacillating type of predilection).

          • sirlips says:

            Actually I took a 6 hour assesment before being hired for a job, and my ENTP did hold true on that assesment. It was several years ago, but i know this was my letters because of the “famous names” in history that are the same as me. I remember several of them when this site showed me the names.

      • JC - TEAM JODI ADMIN says:

        Link? :-) I would enjoy taking this test.

    • SD says:

      INFJ
      Introvert(100%) iNtuitive(75%) Feeling(56%) Judging(56%)

    • Gail Conlon says:

      This would be me… lol

      I(67%) S(38%) F(25%) J(22%)

    • joujoubaby says:

      E-67 N-100 T-25 J-56

      I’m REALLY ENTJ. My nieces and my godsons have always called me “Aunt J,” but my brother, in times of extreme expression of my traits, refers to me as “Aunt ENTJ”

    • FUJuan says:

      Gulliver,

      Hope your not using this information for a study as it would be unethical according to the IRB laws. Just curious where your other five years of experience has been since you said you spent ” 10 years in academia, and 6 years in hypnotherapist.”

      In your ten years in academia did you ever publish in a journal? What areas to do focus on in the psychology field? Please don’t tell me your like Dr. DeMarte and your expertise as a CLINICAL PSYCHOLOGIST in all areas. ( wink). I have also worked in this field as as a psycyologist for over 20+ years however, I don’t claim to be expert in all areas of the field. My main focus is on women who have been abused, sexually abused, and self-injurers.

      Your correct, that if we gave everyone on this site and the TA site everyone would fit into a category according to the DSM-TR-IV however, this is why it is critical to behavioral therapy ( talk therpay) because often times the elememt that one lives in can cause a test to give them a diagnoses that really isn’t them. Dr. DeMarte, was bais, and very judgemental in her assessment with Jodi to fit JUAN agenda for this trial. I find that very unethical, and many things need to be considered with Jodi.

      First PTSD: if Jodi was abused as a child she would have PTSD, and it would carry over into her abusive relationship with TA.

      Second: BPD has numerous changes in the new DSM this should be brought up hopefully with this new psychologist. DeMarte didn’t have enough information in my opinon to diagnose Jodi with this personality disorder. I have personally seen psychologist label those who are cutter’s with this personality only so they are able to be paid. LABELING sticks with a person and can hinder ones life by not getting a job in certain fields ( militiary, pharmarcy, surgerons etc. ).

      Third: This test that you have asked people to take on this site, have you considered asking their birth order? Birth orders often fit into these same categories on this test. I did this test with my undergraduate students for a management course……… just so they could see if their personality meet certain criteria.

      Take the test when your having a very depressive day, and then retake it when your having a very up beat day and see the results.

      • tonysam says:

        The MB is used mostly in job training/skills programs and sometimes in colleges and universities.

        It’s used to match personality types with the best fit in occupations.

        I last took the MB about a year ago.

    • stan says:

      Introvert(33%) Sensing(38%) Feeling(25%) Judging(44%)

    • Jeff says:

      Introvert(11%) iNtuitive(25%) Thinking(1%) Judging(83%)

    • tonysam says:

      That’s the Myers-Briggs test. I’ve taken that at least two or three times in my life.

      I either score INTJ or ENTJ on it.

      • tonysam says:

        Job training programs provide that testing frequently in order for job seekers to find the best occupational fit for them.

        I don’t say the Myers-Briggs is invalid, but it is not the same thing as what psychologists normally use in diagnosing patients.

    • sirlips says:

      I cant help but notice the extreme amount of introvets compaired to extraverts on this site. I was actually expecting the complete opposite.

      Also, There seems to be only one person that isnt an “intuitive”. I would guess this is the catagory that you were expecting to see a large number of people here in, as the other lopped sided one really doesnt “group” well for this format, even thoe there is a bias of I over E. again, that has me curious.

    • maria rigadopoulou says:

      Just took the test,here it comes:

      Introvert(11%) iNtuitive(50%) Feeling(62%) Judging(33%)

    • Milan M says:

      INTJ
      Introvert(44%) iNtuitive(75%) Thinking(1%) Judging(56%)

  85. Angela says:

    Cool!

  86. Zoe says:

    I (78) N (12) T (50) J (44)

  87. Fred says:

    Ha ha, that stuff about MBTI, I said exactly the same thing on another website that the intuitives were in the minority. It was so obvious to me. So you have a big bunch of ‘maintainers of status quo’ that is prejudiced, oppressive and anti-female for the most part.
    I’m an INTP woman, and don’t I feel it?

    • “So you have a big bunch of ‘maintainers of status quo’ that is prejudiced, oppressive and anti-female for the most part.”

      Summed up precisely.

      So you’re a woman “Fred”? :) the name throws me off. lol

  88. Fred says:

    Sorry, I should have introduced myself. Social worker, feminist Mormon hating socialist.
    But very friendly,
    The sexism in this trial is STAGGERING.
    I also have C-PTSD, from a weird childhood, and workplace trauma (child protection)

  89. Fred says:

    Ah I was trying to disguise myself haha.
    I gave too much away on another site.

  90. Fred says:

    One of the very intersting things to me about all of this, which there seems little acknowledgement of, is the amazing number of women who have come out and told their stories. You can tell that to Jodi from me, she has opened a door for many people to say things about their private lives that they wouldn’t ordinarily say, and that’s is a powerful magic.
    Of course it is balanced by God’s Policemen.
    But we won’t let it get us down, women have been fighting for freedom for 2,000 years.

  91. Fred says:

    More like witches burning…
    It is repulsive, and it makes me cringe when I think of the images of her sexual organs alongside his body.
    It’s totally not right, and a revolting message.

  92. kitty says:

    I 44% S 12% T 1% J 1%

    • kitty says:

      I don’t know quite what to make of my score. I found it hard to answer some of the questions because I have experienced quit a lot of trauma the past 5 yrs and am not really feeling like my “old self” these days.

      • Also Abused says:

        That was my problem too, Kitty. I think I was trying to answer more about the “old me”. But it was tough.

        • D says:

          That is exactly the point I was trying to make days ago re: the bubble sheet tests administered by Dr. D(eath).

          • Also Abused says:

            That’s why I wonder about the accuracy of this type of testing for someone who isn’t in their “normal” state. Jodi is incarcerated. There is nothing “normal” about that. Her life was turned upside down five years ago when she was arrested. And really, her life went through a severe change when she first got into this awful relationship with Travis.

            I feel like I spent most of the 10 years I was married in a sort of prison, especially after we moved to Florida a year and a half into the marriage. After that, I wasn’t able or allowed to leave the house without him taking me somewhere since I don’t drive. My life was governed by his whims. Most of my time was spent in my small bedroom or in the garage after he went to bed. I walked through virtual “minefields” daily, unarmed, never knowing what would happen. Granted, I’ve been free now for 2 years, but I’m still adapting.

            Jodi went through the same kind of torture in her relationship with Travis. Now, she’s in jail. How can we be evaluated effectively when our lives have changed so much?

  93. Fred says:

    Hello Gulliver I’m also an MBTI practitioner.

    • Gulliver says:

      Hello, Fred. I would like to create a way for the people on the Travis Taliban sites to fill out the questionnaire. Unfortunately, they are not the types to do this. It is psychobabble to them. But, I have some ideas.

      • Fred says:

        I’m intrigued, do tell! I was just going off what people had written and were re-iterating ad nauseum, on a particular site. No insight or imagination, except when it came to lynching, then they exceptionally creative! but just saying what Nancy Grace says really, and no critical thought, and that was including psychologists, (heaven help us).
        It was easy to tell the T/F, and the S/N. There were a few iN’s, and the differences were actually quite staggering, I was clearly in the minority.
        If you need any help with your quest, count me in!

  94. Al says:

    Good Morning everyone.

    I know we have a Janis fan somewhere her. Here’s Jerry’s song for Janis.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=geaZ_lXLIxg

  95. cindy jewell says:

    Just reading through the post of last night.. I thought tht sister went through rehab if she’s digging up around Travis’s house looking for the gun five years later there’s something. Not right about her

    G I would think Bernie Fife did that 5 years ago.

    • Also Abused says:

      Bernie Fife, hahahaha good one!

      • cindy jewell says:

        Hugs. Its going to be a good day for you.

        • Also Abused says:

          I’m in knots and my heart is racing a mile a minute. I’m not looking forward to it at all. I have to sort of work in close proximity to the negative employee who is going to be watching me, no doubt. And then, I’ll have to deal with this “debriefing” from my boss who is such a passive aggressive type that I dread that, especially because she’s also very defensive.

          • lara says:

            don`t let the assholes drag you down. you have had to put up with too much shit in your life to be treated like anything other than a goddess. no job is worth it. life is too short. if it were me, i think i would find a way to take some time off with my full pay on a stress leave. what a couple of C U N TuesdayS those nasty women are. i`m sending all my good vibes to you today.

    • Al says:

      Remember the ballad of Barney Fife, never caught a criminal in his life!

  96. Kalista says:

    I know you guys and gals are not wild about new people posting at this point but I have to put my cents in. I have been reading this forum for almost a month now as I could no longer handle the hate on facebook and the other top crime sites that I used to frequent. I have boycott HLN and CNN its sister site for the reprehensible way they have given a totally one sided LIE and HATE filled interpretation of every fact and even no facts (rumored things) in this case. Don’t even get me going about things people are allowed to post on facebook.

    I am sickened and disenheartend by my own fellow Americans being so vile and way over the top in the sad case we are here to discuss. I did not feel it my right to join in so late but have readl lauged and cried some here at many of your posts. Also have gained a wealth of additional more fact orientated musings and opinions and I could not find this anywhere else.

    Anyways. many of your stories have touched me and of course I feel that Jodi was overcharged in addition to a massive Mormon and police coverup on many aspects. You have all been my solace in the shitstorm all over the net about this case and I thank you for that and hope I will be allowed to remain if only as an observer.

  97. Renee' (HRS) says:

    sorry for anyone I worried yesterday…. My comp was acting up and my email was being flooded with SPAM and I ran a male-ware scan and it found TONS of stuff.

    So I just shut it down and walked away.

  98. geebee2 says:

    More updates to http://jodi-arias.wikispaces.com/Bathroom

    I found some much better pictures.

    Blood stains inside linen cupboard.

    • cindy jewell says:

      Please give me a synapse of what you’re getting at here.

      • geebee2 says:

        The killing
        Arias is taking pictures of Alexander in the shower when she accidentally drops the camera.
        As she juggles the camera, it takes a picture of the bathroom ceiling. ( Note: it’s possible this picture was taken somewhat later )
        He is angry, calling her a “stupid idiot” and says “a five year old could handle a camera better”.
        He picks her up and slams her on the floor.

        First time down the hallway
        She gets up, runs down the hallway, through the bedroom, into the closet ( shutting the closet door ).
        He is chasing her. She climbs up some shelving, to get his gun.
        He follows her into the closet. She runs out of the closet into the bathroom, turns, and points the gun at him with both hands.
        He does not stop, but comes at her. As he does, the gun goes off (accidentally), and he “rugby tackles” her to the floor.
        She gets out from underneath him.

        [Speculative]
        She gets up. He also gets up and is over the sink, aspirating blood. See Bathroom .
        Note: Arias may have no memory of this, since it immediately precedes the main stressor “FKYB”.
        Also note: at this point the fight has not yet started. Arias may be attempting to help him, or may just be standing there in shock.
        [/Speculative]

        Alexander now loses all reason due to the gunshot wound to the head, he goes into “fight” mode.
        The last thing Arias can remember is him saying “fucking kill you bitch”. This causes extreme fear in Arias, triggering acute stress.
        Raised adrenalin, and other hormones prevents the hippocampus from functioning, preventing any new memories from forming.
        In addition, during acute stress, higher reasoning no longer occurs, as all the resources of the body are utilised to fight or flee.
        Thus extreme violence from normally peaceful people is not unusual when they become extremely fearful and are fighting to defend themselves.

        Second time down the hallway [Still speculative but backed by crime scene photos]
        Arias runs down the hallway towards the bedroom for a second time.
        Alexander follows her, he is somewhat incapacitated due to the gunshot wound.
        He leaves blood marks down the RHS (closet) side of the hallway as he goes. See Blood Trail
        At the end of the hallway he stumbles, and falls to the ground, leaving a “swoosh” mark on the wall, and the blood stain on the carpet.
        Arias turns right again through the closet and heads for the bathroom, trying to create distance between herself and Alexander..
        At some point she picks up the knife ( possibly in the bedroom ) to defend herself. She believes he is following her.
        Alexander doubles back up the hallway, leaving another trail of blood up the other side of the hallway.
        They converge on the bathroom, he is coming up the hallway, she through the closet for a second time.
        She opens the linen cupboard door and seeks refuge there. He attacks her in the linen cupboard.
        Fight
        She stabs him in the chest, he incurs defensive wounds and other cuts as he tries to get at her.
        At some point they are face-to-face (perhaps in the hallway on the ground,or in the linen cupboard).
        She chops/slashes him multiple times in the back with the heel or curved point of the knife to make him let go.
        Finally she cuts his throat, and he is dead. She drops the knife.
        Note: the camera goes off 62 seconds after a picture of the bathroom ceiling. It’s not clear at which point in the fight this happened.
        [/Speculative]
        She heaves his body into the shower, and cleans his body up, to minimise the horrific injuries, and deletes some photos.
        She takes the camera, sheets, puts them in the washing machine.
        She puts a barrier across the bottom of the stairs, so Napoleon, Travis’ dog will not be traumatised by finding the body.
        She leaves Travis’ keys etc. in the kitchen, possibly as a hint to the flatmates that he is dead.
        She flees. She is in a state of amnesia due to the extreme acute stress.

        From http://jodi-arias.wikispaces.com/Defence+narrative

        • cindy jewell says:

          Thank you.. but… how did she get him in the shower his had would have been flopping let alone getting
          Him inthere. I know the whole adrenaline thing.

        • cindy jewell says:

          Geebee2 You have done a wonderful job. It does make sence. but my gut is telling me somethings missing.

          We all have our theories but we all agree it was self defense.

        • truthseeker1111 says:

          geebee…I like your post…but think about this…

          [quote]She heaves his body into the shower, and cleans his body up, to minimise the horrific injuries, and deletes some photos.[quote]…

          1. What if Jodi cleaned up some and left in a hurry because she knew someone was in the house and knew the other roommate would be home soon…this left her with less than an hour of time…
          what if the roommate and others put Travis body in the shower and cleaned up some more…and they put the bullet casing in the blood…and etc….

          2. Zach told Flores that Wednesday, June 8, 2013 was his day off work…so he was there at the house that day…he left Travis’ house that morning to return his car rental and returned back to Travis’ house around 3pm and didn’t leave again until 4 pm…what if the roommate cleaned up by putting Travis’ body in the shower and etc…

          [quote]She takes the camera, sheets, puts them in the washing machine.

          1. Jodi admitted to washing a load of clothes…there were two loads washed…the first load was the comforter and pillowcases…they were in the dryer…the sheets, camera was in the washer…who washed the first and second load?

          2. Zach and Enrique both told Flores that they washed and dried their own clothes that week…one even said that he washed on Wednesday and again on Saturday….

          [quote]She puts a barrier across the bottom of the stairs, so Napoleon, Travis’ dog will not be traumatised by finding the body.

          1. I believe that Zach put the barrier across the bottom of the stairs when he returned to Travis’ house around 3pm to keep the dog from bothering him…he told Flores that he left Travis’ house at 4pm to go clean his girlfriend Mandy’s house…convenient that he made a point to tell Flores that he cleaned his girlfriend’s house that day….

          2. I wonder how many times has Zach ever cleaned his girlfriend’s house before and after the death of Travis???

          3. Convenient that he would have come back to Travis’ house later that evening smelling of cleaning solutions from cleaning Mandy’s house and yet Travis’ house had a cleaning too???

          [quote]She leaves Travis’ keys etc. in the kitchen, possibly as a hint to the flatmates that he is dead.

          1. I feel that the roommate put Travis CTR ring and his watch on the kitchen counter…which was later found on Thursday evening by Enrique’s girlfriend, Kim….and all that Enrique said was that it was odd because Travis always wears the ring and watch…yet Enrique being a crime specialist didn’t think it odd enough to investigate?….or did he???

          2. Both roommates and the girlfriends used the kitchen to eat in and cleaned up after themselves…

          3. I feel that either one or both roommates knew what had happened to Travis and they were involved somehow in muddling the crime scene….and they were just waiting for someone to come looking for Travis…if not…then how else would they have been able to stand the smell of decomp for those several days…it was a strong smell in the house….and even Enrique said that he smelled the odor he just didn’t say anything about it….WHAT ARE THEY HIDING???

          [quote]She flees. She is in a state of amnesia due to the extreme acute stress….

          1. I feel that she fled a lot earlier than that…and the Zach the roommate leaves Travis’s home around 4 pm that day and Enrique returns to Travis’ right after 6 pm…Travis time of death around 5:36 pm or so….

          2. So that leaves a window of time of less than an hour (1 hour) for all that to be done…

          3. Realistically…Jodi would not have had enough time or have been able to have done all of that in that little amount of time…

          4. And realistically it would only seem possible that someone else did all the other as stated above…

    • truthseeker1111 says:

      geebee…after he went to the sink aspirating from the bullet wound…with the blood shown on the floor of the linen closet…could it be possible he reached into the cabinet for a towel?

    • Michele says:

      Thanks geebee2 for taking the time to do this.I appreciate it and refer to it often.

    • D says:

      Are the pics that were shown during the ME testimony last week available somewhere? I read that the photos were never before used in court.

    • scrappydoo says:

      In picture #20 I find it odd that there is still water on the floor. Also, does it appear to you that there is a shoe print in the lower left corner of the picture?

      I wish someone could lighten and enhance the photo with the foot/pantleg. I really want a clearer picture of that.

  99. Elaine says:

    Thanks, Gulliver, for providing the Myers-Briggs materials and your fascinating thoughts on how typology relates to this trial.

    I do want to add a couple of caveats, though. I’m a social worker with 25 years of experience and a minister with 23 years of experience. I think the Jung typology is extremely useful, and I’ve used it in parish ministry as a way of helping people work together better. I’m a strong INFP myself, although find myself moving more towards center as I age.

    My caveats are, first, that I have been told that we have to be cautious in using scores that don’t come from a trained professional administering and interpreting the results.

    Also, my understanding of Jung’s work is that he wants to help people get along better and understand each other more. I’d like to see us find ways of using these results to learn to interact better with all types of people. So, I’d hate too quickly to characterize people who believe Jodi is guilty of pre-meditated murder as having one set of characteristics – or saying those traits are oppressive or sexist.

    I think Gulliver raises really interesting ideas for discussion – but this isn’t a scientific survey and I don’t think it fair to characterize any clusters of characteristics as oppressive or sexist. But understanding differences CAN help us find ways to better communicate with those who have differing perspectives from ours.

    My 2 cents on this!

    • Gulliver says:

      Elaine, you are certainly right about being cautious. However, the MBTI and variants thereof are not psychodiagnostic tests. They do not focus on identifying pathological individuals. They are oriented to describing types of human orientation. The purpose of such inventories are to provide information for self exploration much like the Strong Vocational Interest Inventory that matches ones interests with the interests of successful people in various occupations. I see the Jung tests as providing information on how an individual processes information. It is one thing to say that those who hold the view that Jodi is guilty of pre-meditated murder have different traits from those that don’t, and it is quite another thing to hypothesize that people who process information in a particular way may be more susceptible to accepting facts laid out by the prosecutor without seeing where these “facts” are contradicted by other facts or brought into doubt by other reasonable possibilities. In other words, a particular information-processing predilection may interact with other personality characteristics to produce a certain belief system, and we know how ingrained deeply held beliefs can be.

  100. PK says:

    Regarding the back wounds Travis had, here is a reasonable explanation. This morning on CNN’s home page there is a report of a stabbing by a crazed parishioner after mass ended NM. He rushed the choir with a knife and stabbed four people.
    To quote the article:
    Mass had just ended at St. Jude Thaddeus Church in Albuquerque, New Mexico, and the choir had begun its closing hymns when it happened.
    A 24-year-old man jumped several pews and rushed toward the choir with a knife in his hand, screaming, “Fake preacher!” He stabbed four choir members during the attack Sunday morning.
    Gerald Madrid, the flutist, told the affiliate from his hospital bed that he was stabbed five times in the back.
    “I just instinctively dropped my flute and I charged the guy,” Madrid said. “And I got him into a bear hug and pinned him against the wall.
    Unquote.

    So he is stabbed 5 times in the back! This, in my opinion, is what happened to Travis when he attacked Jodi and got her in a bear hug. Hope “others” are hearing this report, too.

    • Lura says:

      Sad for that to have happen , but it is exactly how I had it pictured in my mind. Hopefully the jury will see this story.

  101. PK says:

    Sirlips, I always look forward to your posts but this one was exceptional. Wow!!

    I could not agree more and applaud you for your insightfulness, wisdom/intelligence and succinctly summing up this case. I know this will resonate with many more people and hope it goes viral. Would it be possible to post on YouTube for added exposure? Just a thought….

    Needless to say, I look forward to future posts! Again, thank you.

  102. Pat says:

    I (22) N (62) F (12) J (44)

  103. Willis says:

    I-78% N-12% T-1% J-67%

  104. Al says:

    geebee2,

    Thought I’d put this at the end so it doesn’t get lost. Don’t know if folks go back and revisit their old posts.

    There is one set of blood satter your narrative doesn’t account for. This, of course is assuming the forensics person was accurate in her assessment. That is the impact blood spatter on the WC door jamb and the opposite wall, around the trash can. She also testified that this spatter came from a source that was about a foot or so above the ground.

    This spatter, at least in my mind is very important, both because I think JM is going to make a big deal of it, and actually so can the defense to show an alternative sequence of events. For this blood spatter to occur, at some stage TA must have been on the floor, and the knife blows had to be hard enough to make the blood drops fly a few feet. JM’s argument, I suspect, is going to be that TA was down and out, on the floor, and Jodi was still hacking away at him. On the other hand, there could be another explanation. If at some stage TA tackled Jodi and knocked her to the floor, with him on top of her, an she started flailing with the knife, it would account for the blood spatter. The wounds that show that level of impact of course are the ones to his head, and possibly his back.

    In order to account for these wounds we know need TA in the bathroom, on top of Jodi. When and how this occurred is obviously rank speculation, but needs to be done.

  105. Ashley in Illinois says:

    Forgive me, I haven’t been able to go through and read the follow up comments to this post, and am in a rush so don’t have time now. I have a difference of opinion on some of sirlips post (I do believe in justice for a victim, I am a Christian who believes in God, and other things) but overall I enjoyed the post because it’s spot on in terms of I’d rather let guilty go free than convict one innocent person. I also agree that the oddoties of head standing, etc, are blown way out of proportion when she was stuck in that room for hours, and was doing whatever she could to keep herself occupied. I do think she took the gun from her grandparents’ home, but there is NOTHING to suggest to me that she did it with the intention of killing TA, especially when, according to the prosecutor the killing took place with a knife. Doesn’t make a bit of sense. And it really disgusts me that it’s very clear TA was manipulative, cared about himself and had a complete disregard for fidelity, honesty or respect of the women in his life and yet he is held up on a pedastal as if he should be our new standard for morals in this country, while someone like Alyce Laviollette is demonized and destroyed.

  106. cindy jewell says:

    I hope everybody has a wonderful day!

  107. Kalista says:

    Thanks for the welcome everybody. I enjoyed this opening post by SL and agree completely that little screaming weinie JM has not proved 1st degree–not by a long shot. I am still worried like all of you that the jury will not see the facts as we do and that would be a travesty not justice. Can’t wait for Wednesday and then for the closing arguments and God willing I never have to hear that annoying little man again. All my thoughts are for Jodi and her family. and for the best possible outcome.

  108. Al says:

    geebee2,

    Picture 16 in your collection is one I haven’t seen before. It is rather interesting. Notice, that in the area of the wall marked off by the yellow crime scene tape, there is a divot in the drywall. Looks like a squarish pice of dry wall was gouged out by something. That has to be a hard, possibly sharp object. It could be the gun flying out of Jodi’s hand and hitting the wall, or it could be the knife. Either way, it is something that was never talked about.

  109. D says:

    Have you all taken a peek of Jodi’s drawing comparisons on the ‘haters’ site? At least they have proven, to their dismay I amsure, that Jodi was not drawing Skeletor! :-) Say what they may, they cannot take away the amazing artistic talent of JA.

    • Nk says:

      Was she drawing the lady from the gas station or who?

      • D says:

        One is her interpretation of a Miss Dior ad.

        • JC - TEAM JODI ADMIN says:

          Would this be considered intellectual property? * curious * And isn’t sketching considered an art too?

          • D says:

            Beats the heck out of me. How could drawing/sketching another’s work be illegal? It is done all the time.

            • Nk says:

              Selling it may be illegal unless they have permission or permission is granted due to some other reason, I think.

              Of course, if she credits where she gets her sketches from, that may not be a problem. I don’t see how selling a painting or sketch or poster of the Mona Lisa is legal, but what Jodi is doing is illegal. That makes no sense.

          • D says:

            I can draw Fred Flintstone. (-: Is that illegal?

          • Nk says:

            Found this:

            Copyright legally belongs to the artist from the moment of creation. You don’t need to mail yourself copies – that’s another urban myth and a complete waste of time (you can’t use it as evidence in a court case).

            Should someone infringe your copyright, you cannot sue (in the United States; check local laws for other countries) unless you have registered with the Copyright Office of the Library of Congress. Its a small fee, so if you are concerned about copyright, it may well be worth it.

            You may choose to sell copyright along with your artwork, to sell it with limitations, or retain it entirely. It is important that you make clear your intentions to buyers, in writing. Consider writing a copyright notice on the back of your drawing and include the small circled ‘c’ symbol beside your signature.

            When publishing images on the internet, there are several methods to prevent misuse of your work. Some of these are:

            In the first instance, add a copyright symbol and written notice on the page.
            Post images as small and low-res as possible;
            Add a copyright notice watermark across the image;
            ‘Cut’ larger images into sections and join them in a table;
            Use scripting to disable copying and saving;
            Become informed – follow the copyright links on these pages for further information.

      • D says:

        One is from Guess Jeans and others seem to be anonymous.

  110. Janeen Russo says:

    Good morning everyone. I hope everyone had a wonderful weekend.

    AA…I work in a Labor & Employment Law office in New York. If you need anything, get my email from SJ…I’ll help anyway I can.

    :-)

  111. Dharma says:

    Killing someone because you believe you are that much in danger is actually a right as well as legal. did anyone deserve to die, no, should anyone have died no. the most important thing i would like others to see and understand and accept is the different rages of abuse and how they look, say/words, feel/feelings as well as acceptance that when you are in this space you may not know its abusive. Why, because it acts like love and caring as well as many things. However one never knows when it’s no longer possible to accept and you can’t. If you have to kill in order to live, then you do. Unfortunately its true. Most people believe they have the answers to everything, they know so much but they dont. One never knows until you find the truth of what real life is about and your participation in it. I am sure Jodi is completely sorry she went there and didn’t stay put. Now the question is would he have died anyway? my thought is did someone else actually kill him? Again to that computer and why wasnt it his? I keep thinking there is an answer in here.

  112. stan says:
    • tonysam says:

      As I said upthread, those scores don’t mean much of anything, and the test is largely used in job training programs/colleges to help people determine the best occupational fit for their interests and personality traits.

      • stan says:

        well i am retired now so it doesn’t mean much to me then unless it tells me that i was in the wrong occupation for 45 years. HAHA

  113. CanadaLinda says:

    From Sirlips post:
    “He is an officer of the court, if he doesn’t internalize this as a core belief, he shouldn’t be in that position. Is this part of his “master plan”? Somehow he will elicit a wanted response from the witness or the jury? We have a name for that, it’s called a “trick”. If you have to use tricks, then you should not be prosecuting murders, rapists, terrorists or jay walkers. I don’t care if it works or not. Your job isn’t to “make” a person guilty, your job is to prove a guilty person is guilty.”

    Kermit: Was it sunny yesterday?
    Witness: No it was cloud…
    Kermit: Yes or no?
    Witness: No
    Kermit: So it was raining?
    Witness: No it was…
    Kermit: Ma’am do you have a memory problem? Did n’t you just say not 1 minute ago that it was raining. Do you not remember that?
    Defense: Objection..badgering
    Judge: over ruled. You may answer
    Witness: I didn’t say it was rai…
    Kermit: Isn’t it true it was raining? Yes or no
    Witness: I…
    Kermit: Witness is un-cooperative

    • SJ - Team Jodi says:

      Classic Kermit! :mrgreen:

      SJ
      Team Jodi

      • Pat says:

        I didn’t want to really get into this case..I heard about it of course but felt such revulsion I didn’t want to “go there”..likely because of my own experiences with DV.

        However, I happened to see JM with Alyce while flipping chanels and could not believe my ears! The most blatant word twisting, abusive, creepy persecutor I have ever seen. That led me to believe that the states case was rotten..hence my discovery of this web site.

        Thanks to all for being here.

  114. SJ - Team Jodi says:
  115. tonya says:

    good day to all renee glad to see you are back and did a virus check on your computer … wish i could fix my computer to work again but its gone when I have the money will take it somewhere to see if a computer expert can fix it untill then im not opening anything my fb has setteled down and no emails so this computer is ok so far. I still believer jodi story of the man and woman in that bath room and I also believe the roommates know more than they are saying if a mon and dad found out there best friend molested there child they would have been livid about it and would have killed him. end of story but jodi could not keep that story because no one believed her not even Dr Samuels it is possible that ALV knew the truth and she got what happened to here she was told to shut up by JM when she told him hay jack ass do you want the truth or not. and the Hughes backpeddeling to get out of testifing yet he showes up in court sits with the family all the kkk are out in numbers to keep the truth a secret. Jodi tried to tell that secret and look where it got her

  116. FreshAirBreather says:

    Does anyone know why Travis was not autopsied until June 12, when the body was discovered on June 9? Given the condition of the body by the time of discovery, I would have thought there would be haste to get the body examined by the ME on June 10 in order to extract as much information from it as possible. Sorry if this was already discussed!

  117. Kimberly says:

    STANDING OVATION!!! This is the best summary I’ve read in a LONG time! THANK YOU for so eloquently writing what I have been feeling for some time. Be it the Jodi Arias case, the Trayvon Martin case, or the case of the neighbor who plats their tree on your side of the land-line…..Americans would be far better off if we revisited the reason we have laws, courts, and the Constitution. When you diminish its value for one, you diminish its value for us ALL!!!!!

    • sirlips says:

      “Americans would be far better off if we revisited the reason we have laws, courts, and the Constitution. When you diminish its value for one, you diminish its value for us ALL!!!!!”- And that my friends is a “wrap”.

      kimberly, you are the best-est-er.

  118. jeffinerd says:

    Sirlips-your lips speak truth !!

  119. Marianne says:

    Sirlip,

    Hello, I was so happy to read your summary of this Trial. Last week, I was so upset because I felt Jodi would not have a chance based on Marteniz’s tricks. I strongly felt the Jury would make decisions based on siding with Martinez. I pray it works out for her. It would be good if she can live her life in the outside world with real psychiatric help. I pray what ever happens she is okay. I wish someone would realize Martinez is really bad at his job. Thank you for taking the time to write all that out.

    Marianne

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